Math and FastPass+. My Fears

[TikiLounger]

Just noting that FastPass has been in existence only since 1999, not 40+ years. The current system is 14 years old. But I think they are investing too much $$$ in this new FP+ system not to get some return out of it. Maybe they won't charge for just using the basic FP+ system, but I'll bet we see a significant increase in park admission after it's fully rolled out. That way they can say it's still "free", but they'll still get paid for it Either that, or you'll be able to pay to get more than 3 FP+s in a day. The new Disney is more dollar-centric and less about guest satisfaction than the company used to be.

Well, I just got my wristbands today. I've been reading everyone's comments and I just have one thing to add. When I opened the box containing my MagicBands, I looked at the awesome packaging and presentation (including each of our names printed under our individual, customized wristband) and I thought, "There is no way these things are going to be free forever." I believe that, at some point, they WILL be charging for some aspect of this service...even if it's just to receive a "customized" band (you pick the color). I don't know enough about the subject to really get into the conversation, this was just my reaction when I opened the box.

[AndrewJackson]

Just noting that FastPass has been in existence only since 1999, not 40+ years. The current system is 14 years old. But I think they are investing too much $$$ in this new FP+ system not to get some return out of it. Maybe they won't charge for just using the basic FP+ system, but I'll bet we see a significant increase in park admission after it's fully rolled out. That way they can say it's still "free", but they'll still get paid for it Either that, or you'll be able to pay to get more than 3 FP+s in a day. The new Disney is more dollar-centric and less about guest satisfaction than the company used to be.

I am aware of how long FP has been around. I was referring to the comment that Disney will start "stratifying" your experience using FP+ capabilities abd based on the price level of the resort. My point is that they could have done this long before FP or FP+ and never have.

It seems everyone wants to argue against FP+ before ever experiencing it, and with possible scenarios that are pure speculation. It's become a race to the bottom.

The latest is that we shouldn't like FP+ because they are going to start charging for it.

[joonyer]

I like being able to enjoy the current FP system, and I'm sure I'll like using the new FP+ system available to make choices and reduce ride wait times for my family when it's fully implemented. I'm not arguing that it will be a bad thing or that we shouldn't like it. I just don't it'll stay free for very long.

Speculation? Yes.
Do I hope I'll be wrong? Yes.
Will I be surprised if FP+ becomes a pay as you play system? No.
Just sayin'

[Dulcee]

Speculation? Yes.
Do I hope I'll be wrong? Yes.
Will I be surprised if FP+ becomes a pay as you play system? No.
Just sayin'

I wouldn't be surprised to see it become an on site perk. Pricing would be rolled into the resort pricing matrix like many other on site perks. That wouldn't bother me much.

I think it's unlikely that this would become something that every guest, on or offsite, would have the choice to pay for. Much like extra magic hours...

[Tekneek]

It seems everyone wants to argue against FP+ before ever experiencing it, and with possible scenarios that are pure speculation. It's become a race to the bottom.

I've been critical of it and now I've begun testing it. I continue to stand by my original concerns.

[Opus X]

I've been critical of it and now I've begun testing it. I continue to stand by my original concerns.

Yeah, but thats like folks testing beta versions of ios7..or any other Macintosh mobile operating system....They say, Oh, i dont like it...it has querks.
Then it is fully released...and its an art form. Perfect. (there is always a few debbie downers)but 99.9% of iPhone/Ipad users will love it.
I fully expect F.P.+ to be the same.
What you are testing now...is merely a skeleton of the final deal.
I will lay down 5-1 odds...Heck, 10-1 ..in the end, it will be just like the regular fast pass. A GREAT thing.

Time will tell.
Oh, and if in the end, I have to "pay for front of the line" access as some have speculated...So be it. Money WELL spent.
I do agree that if you stay at a Deluxe...you get more fp+ "bookings" that too, though may be a rumor.
In any case. I love the debate. But...hate the speculation. I have tremendous faith in Disney. In all these years...Always a GREAT vacation experience. I have NO doubts about this either.

[Jared]

Disney already offers this, and it is really, really expensive. If you hire a tour guide at $300+ an hour and a 4 hour minimum, you get front of the line access.

Fair point. I didn't mention the VIP tour service because it's generally unadvertised and certainly inaccessible to a vast majority of guests.

As for the stratification of the Fastpass service, I guess we'll see. We know for a fact that Disney has already obtained certain patents and such that would allow for a system like the one I described. Will the company ever implement it? Maybe, maybe not. But we're already starting to see a part of it: Disney resort guests are going to be given an advantage in Fastpass+ over off-site guests.

To be honest, I don't have a problem of this. Disney needs to entice people to stay at the expensive resorts. This could be a significant perk.

[DizneyFreak2002]

To be honest, I don't have a problem of this. Disney needs to entice people to stay at the expensive resorts. This could be a significant perk.

FP+, if for resort guests only, and I have no reason to believe it will be for resort guests only, may be the only perk left for staying at the over priced Disney hotels, once EMH are eliminated completely... There will be no reason to ever stay on Disney property for the prices they charge for a bed and shower...

[Jared]

FP+, if for resort guests only, and I have no reason to believe it will be for resort guests only, may be the only perk left for staying at the over priced Disney hotels, once EMH are eliminated completely... There will be no reason to ever stay on Disney property for the prices they charge for a bed and shower...

There is a reason why I hardly ever stay on-site anymore. Or, better put, there are few reasons why it is worth it to stay on-site anymore. There are infinitely better hotels within minutes of Disney property that literally cost a third of the price of someplace like Port Orleans.

[DizneyFreak2002]

There is a reason why I hardly ever stay on-site anymore. Or, better put, there are few reasons why it is worth it to stay on-site anymore. There are infinitely better hotels within minutes of Disney property that literally cost a third of the price of someplace like Port Orleans.

You and many others... Resort occupancy rates are not at the numbers Disney wants... 60 to 70 % occupancy rates (and in some cases lower)... But don't worry, next year, Disney will make sure to increase the rates by double digits again...

[Opus X]

There is a reason why I hardly ever stay on-site anymore. Or, better put, there are few reasons why it is worth it to stay on-site anymore. There are infinitely better hotels within minutes of Disney property that literally cost a third of the price of someplace like Port Orleans.

Whoa, Not true at all......
We spent 149.00 per night at POR riverside last visit. First of May 7 nights.
A third of that is..50.00 What resort or hotel within minutes of WDW is 50.00 that has as nice of a pool...As nice of grounds, as nice of total resort,plus free parking to the parks....etc.
....thats right, there isnt any. Plus, you cant beat staying on property.
You are just plain wrong, and i want you to show me exactly where I can stay for 50.00 a night..that is as nice as POR. Really, you cant.
Even the budget hotels...when you add resort fees, parking fees at the parks, it is RARE that you save a lot to stay off property compared to the values. And, if you throw in rental car costs....it is NEVER cheaper than a value. That alone will cost at least 100.00 for a week in a very small car.
I could stay at a value..In May (when we go) and ALWAYS save money at a value compared to say a Holiday Inn...plus fees, plus rental car...plus parking.

[Mickey91]

I am aware of how long FP has been around. I was referring to the comment that Disney will start "stratifying" your experience using FP+ capabilities abd based on the price level of the resort. My point is that they could have done this long before FP or FP+ and never have.

It seems everyone wants to argue against FP+ before ever experiencing it, and with possible scenarios that are pure speculation. It's become a race to the bottom.

The latest is that we shouldn't like FP+ because they are going to start charging for it.

Well, they already started "stratifying" with free dining. If you stay at Fort Wilderness campstes, AoA Mermaid rooms, POFQ, or GF Villas you don't get it at all. If you stay at the other values, you only get quick service free...

I have no problem believing there will be some kind of money involved with the new fast pass+. And I have no problem believing that different levels of resort guests will have different perks in relation to it.

[Mickey91]

I am aware of how long FP has been around. I was referring to the comment that Disney will start "stratifying" your experience using FP+ capabilities abd based on the price level of the resort. My point is that they could have done this long before FP or FP+ and never have.

It seems everyone wants to argue against FP+ before ever experiencing it, and with possible scenarios that are pure speculation. It's become a race to the bottom.

The latest is that we shouldn't like FP+ because they are going to start charging for it.

Well, they already started "stratifying" with free dining. If you stay at Fort Wilderness campstes, AoA Mermaid rooms, POFQ, or GF Villas you don't get it at all. If you stay at the other values, you only get quick service free...

I have no problem believing there will be some kind of money involved with the new fast pass+. And I have no problem believing that different levels of resort guests will have different perks in relation to it.

[Jared]

Well, they already started "stratifying" with free dining. If you stay at Fort Wilderness campstes, AoA Mermaid rooms, POFQ, or GF Villas you don't get it at all. If you stay at the other values, you only get quick service free...

I have no problem believing there will be some kind of money involved with the new fast pass+. And I have no problem believing that different levels of resort guests will have different perks in relation to it.

Good point about the "free" dining plan. I didn't consider that.

I'm with you -- I'd have no problem if Disney started offering more Fastpass+ offerings to guests staying at more expensive hotels. If you are shelling out the bucks to stay at a place like the Contemporary or Grand Floridian, you deserve better perks than the folks staying at Pop Century.

[Dsnygirl]

I actually think the FP+ system is great for certain attractions like Toy Story Mania and for restaurants like Be Our Guest. Loyal Disney customers staying on property should be prioritized in these situations. Other than that I think FP+ is worthless. Before FP+ there was barely any wait for Pirates of the Caribbean and since they had that option I've had to wait awhile for it.

Ditto - I think it should have stayed limited to the "prioritized rides" like TSM, RnRc, Splash, Space, etc. We were just there in August, and our first 3 days PoC was WIDE open, no wait, no FP+ signs. Then, suddenly mid-week there was a FP+ sign, and the entire queue was re-routed. We asked about it, and the CM said that although the queue looked longer, it was actually shorter b/c of the implemented FP+. Wrong... we waited 20 minutes for a ride that was a walk-on the day before. I hate to think that rides that were NOT long waits before will now become so because of this new system... when I saw the sign for FP+ at IASW, all I could think was, "Really??"

[Dulcee]

There is a reason why I hardly ever stay on-site anymore. Or, better put, there are few reasons why it is worth it to stay on-site anymore. There are infinitely better hotels within minutes of Disney property that literally cost a third of the price of someplace like Port Orleans.

Really? I've been looking for a place close by to stay the night before our reservation begins on our next trip. To stay in anything decent were looking at $100-140 a night. Add to that $5-10 to park the car, $10-20 for internet and some even have a "resort" fee for another $10-15. And I don't know where the free continental breakfast went but it appears most Orlando resorts don't believe in that anymore.

So on the low end my cheap night before disney is now $125 - 165.

Sure, I could decide to do the $65 a night red roof inn (about 1/3 of POR) but does that really compare to a disney resort? Even a value in January I can get for about $110 a night. And at least I'm confident I"m in a safe area with a clean room.

Don't get me wrong, Disney deluxe hotels are overpriced (so are Universal's). I'd love to stay at the Poly but it just ain't gonna happen right now. But the moderates and values? They seem to fit right into the rest of the Orlando hotel market to me.

[Jared]

I compare the Disney value resorts to the budget lines of the major hotel chains. Take the Fairfield Inn, for instance, which is the cheapest Marriott brand.

I picked a random few days in January -- the 10th through the 14th, to be specific.

The Fairfield Inn & Suites Orlando Lake Buena Vista in the Marriott Village costs $76 per night, and that includes wireless Internet and a continental breakfast. Yes, you'll need a rental car, which is an added expense, but I do believe that the lowest Marriott brand is better than the value Disney hotels.

For what it's worth, the Gaylord Palms right outside the Disney arch is $229 per night, and I view that as a much nicer hotel than even the Grand Floridian.

[JerseyDad]

I compare the Disney value resorts to the budget lines of the major hotel chains. Take the Fairfield Inn, for instance, which is the cheapest Marriott brand.

I picked a random few days in January -- the 10th through the 14th, to be specific.

The Fairfield Inn & Suites Orlando Lake Buena Vista in the Marriott Village costs $76 per night, and that includes wireless Internet and a continental breakfast. Yes, you'll need a rental car, which is an added expense, but I do believe that the lowest Marriott brand is better than the value Disney hotels.

For what it's worth, the Gaylord Palms right outside the Disney arch is $229 per night, and I view that as a much nicer hotel than even the Grand Floridian.

...have to agree with the room quality at Fairfield Inn's. We stayed at one in St. Augustine on our trip to WDW 2 weeks ago ...and for $75 (plus tax) the room was bigger ...brighter ...and as you mentioned ...included a very good complimentary breakfast. When we checked into POP the next day ..it was like taking a backward step in room size / quality (Fairfield had 2 queen beds ....and a fridge). And ....as a side perk ...Marriot gives me reward points for continual use of their hotels. It'd be nice for Disney to 'perk' repeat guests ...heck, if they are going to charge "Vegas-like" prices ...they need to provide the perks. (I also know exactly where the Marriott village is you mentioned ...having driven past it to get to a local Walgreens before we checked in at POP) ...it's a very nice complex

[Opus X]

I compare the Disney value resorts to the budget lines of the major hotel chains. Take the Fairfield Inn, for instance, which is the cheapest Marriott brand.

I picked a random few days in January -- the 10th through the 14th, to be specific.

The Fairfield Inn & Suites Orlando Lake Buena Vista in the Marriott Village costs $76 per night, and that includes wireless Internet and a continental breakfast. Yes, you'll need a rental car, which is an added expense, but I do believe that the lowest Marriott brand is better than the value Disney hotels.

For what it's worth, the Gaylord Palms right outside the Disney arch is $229 per night, and I view that as a much nicer hotel than even the Grand Floridian.

You stated a "third of the price of POR" I pointed out we stayed at POR last May for 149.00. Im still waiting for the 50.00 hotel you stated you could find that was a better value. Which, would also have to include free parking. ( and as nice as POR) Remember, There is more to a WDW resort than sleep and shower...The theming, even a value is fantastic)..and WDW transport is also a GREAT perk..especially those who fly.
I think ill be waiting for a long time...you cant find a hotel off property for a THIRD of the price...which IS what you stated.
There is a reason ALOT of hotels off property is closing...The new ones being built at times..is MORE than a Value resort. And, alot of folks WANT to stay on property. If a family travels to WDW once a year or every other like us. I dont want to stay is a Fairfield Inn..where i could in my own home town. Part of the vacation IS staying on property...But, PLEASE...direct me to the 50.00 "resort" off property = to POR.

[Opus X]

I compare the Disney value resorts to the budget lines of the major hotel chains. Take the Fairfield Inn, for instance, which is the cheapest Marriott brand.

I picked a random few days in January -- the 10th through the 14th, to be specific.

The Fairfield Inn & Suites Orlando Lake Buena Vista in the Marriott Village costs $76 per night, and that includes wireless Internet and a continental breakfast. Yes, you'll need a rental car, which is an added expense, but I do believe that the lowest Marriott brand is better than the value Disney hotels.

For what it's worth, the Gaylord Palms right outside the Disney arch is $229 per night, and I view that as a much nicer hotel than even the Grand Floridian.

You failed to mention..the 10.00 resort fee per night and parking at WDW every day....the real total would be what 97.00? ...I'll take All star Music anyway over that for close to the same price...and if you have kids.....its a NO brainer. On property..WDW transport is easy and you get where you need to go..faster than free transport in any City i know.
I dont mean to make this about on vs. off property...thats a personal choice..
My point is though to point out the completely wrong and not just wrong but 110% wrong.. comment from an earlier post about a "third" the price of POR..Which in many cases would mean a 50.00 a night hotel..along with resort fees and parking at wow which would ADD to that quite a bit.