insight into how fastpasses will change

[taleasoldastime]

Maybe I am behind on how all these changes to fastpasses will go but I thought I would post this anyway since it is news to me.

I have not been able to find information on if the fastpass kiosks in the park will close once the online advanced reservation fastpasses open. It has been something I have been worrying about. I talked to my mom this morning though snd founf out dome info.

My mom had taken a trip to wdw this past weekend with her cousin. Her cousin lives in florida so she needed to get her season pass switched to the rfid one. While she was getting it switched my mom chatted with a castmember who was explaining some of the changes. Apparently the kiosks will be done with completely. They will only be doing the online fastpasses. You will get three of them as of now but they are open to change if that number doesnt work out. You will be able to change your fastpasses you chose while you are in the park by going online on your phone or ipad. (My concern with that is I dont anticipate there being that much wiggle room with fastpasses for major attractions like peter pan. Maybe im wrong.) Also, this means fastpasses will no longer be available at all for people not staying on property. (Obviously a way for disney to force more people to stay on property) the cast member did claim that the will help the stand by line not take as long because there shouldnt be as many fastpass riders holding up the stand by line but idk how much im trusting this.

Opinions/insight?

[taleasoldastime]

Excuse my bad spelling. Im typing on my phone and im obviously not good at it. Haha

[DizneyFreak2002]

Going with what we know already:

You will book your fastpass online, 60 days in advance... You can only book one park per day, so while it won't truly stop park hopping it will change the way people park hop (some people will probably stop altogether)... The current fastpass system will go away, including the current FP machines...

At one point, on the Terms of Service, Disney stated 3 FP+ tickets a day... However, they have since removed the number 3... Whether that means they are rethinking the amount or not, who knows? Once you are at the park, yes, you are supposed to be allowed to change out a FP, either via your smart phone app, or a centralized kiosk (which will probably have massive lines cause not everyone has a smartphone nor does everyone use the apps)...

No one knows how this will work for people staying off property... I have a hunch off site guests will be left out in the cold... There is also talk that this system MAY wind up being tiered, meaning you stay in a deluxe you get more FP tickets than someone staying in a value... But no one has been able to confirm that, and Disney hasn't stated anything to that affect...

As for the lines, I don't see how this will make stand by go faster... it just won't... FP killed the stand by lines.. FP+ will only make standby worse... Someone on another site did an number comparison, and he projected the stand by lines will increase by 30 minutes, if not more (for the more popular rides)...

[Ian]

I can't ever recall a more botched, PR disaster of a new program rollout than this one. The stupid thing is live and no one even knows how it works or will work ... even the people rolling it out!

I can't fathom how Iger and his senior leadership team haven't fired every idiot in WDW management over this debacle. It was a huge waste of money to begin with and now it's just foundering ... just a total mess.

[DizneyFreak2002]

I can't ever recall a more botched, PR disaster of a new program rollout than this one. The stupid thing is live and no one even knows how it works or will work ... even the people rolling it out!

I can't fathom how Iger and his senior leadership team haven't fired every idiot in WDW management over this debacle. It was a huge waste of money to begin with and now it's just foundering ... just a total mess.

If this flounders once 100% implemented, heads will roll... But, will the right heads roll or will the poor cast members earning $7.00 an hour suffer the blame?

[Aurora]

As for the lines, I don't see how this will make stand by go faster... it just won't... FP killed the stand by lines.. FP+ will only make standby worse... Someone on another site did an number comparison, and he projected the stand by lines will increase by 30 minutes, if not more (for the more popular rides)...

There's no way anyone knows right now or can predict how the stand-by lines will be affected because no one knows how many FPs guests will actually use. The system is so different that predicting its usage now is futile.

Some people who use the current system may be put off by the need to make advance "reservations" for rides and may not use it at all; others who used it for more than 3 FPs per day may be reduced; there may be more than 3 FPs per day allowed; people who used FPs at more than one park may be reduced to one park; some who never used current system may like this one and use it; and on and on.

There are just too many variables to predict any of this until it's rolled out completely, with everything spelled out: all of the restrictions, number limits, park limits, accommodations limits, AND the old system is phased out completely. Any projections right now can only be based on "what-ifs." No reason to worry about stand-by lines yet.

I can't ever recall a more botched, PR disaster of a new program rollout than this one. The stupid thing is live and no one even knows how it works or will work ... even the people rolling it out!

I can't fathom how Iger and his senior leadership team haven't fired every idiot in WDW management over this debacle. It was a huge waste of money to begin with and now it's just foundering ... just a total mess.

Just read something really interesting about the money aspect. This is from an article published today on qz.com:

Here’s how [CFO Jay] Rasulo explained it to analysts who were listening to the company’s post-earnings conference call, according to a corrected transcript published by FactSet CallStreet:

"We have known for a really long time that getting our visitors to Walt Disney World to make decisions about where they spend their time before they leave home is a powerful driver of visits per guest. When they get into the Orlando market and their time isn’t yet planned, they can be subject to everything you see down there, which is a lot of in-city marketing for all the many products that people have put there to basically bleed off the feed that we fundamentally motivate. So if we can get people to plan their vacation before they leave home, we know that we get more time with them. We get a bigger share of their wallet. So that’s one thing for you guys to think about.

"And the second thing is, what happens to purchases when they become much more convenient and you don’t spend time queuing up for a transaction, queuing up to get in the park and you actually have more time to enjoy the entertainment and subsequently spend more money doing things other than standing in line which, of course, you can’t spend any money while you’re doing that."

Nothing at all about guest satisfaction. Yes, the context was that it was a conference call with analysts about company earnings, but ... yuck.

[BriarRose0708]

Nothing at all about guest satisfaction. Yes, the context was that it was a conference call with analysts about company earnings, but ... yuck.

It still cracks me up that they think by implementing FastPass people spend more money when they're not waiting in line. Whether I have a FastPass option or not, I'm not in a gift shop in my spare time. Granted, I may be eating but what I pay for a counter service meal is still less than what they want me to spend on their low quality and generic merchandise.

[DizneyFreak2002]

There's no way anyone knows right now or can predict how the stand-by lines will be affected because no one knows how many FPs guests will actually use. The system is so different that predicting its usage now is futile.

There were people on another board better in numbers than I am who ran numbers based on what we know (17 million people a year, 47000 a day, 3 FP per person) and came up with an increase in standby lines of 30 minutes or more (more for the popular attractions)... Could they be wrong? Sure, I guess they could be... But, would Disney be building interactive queues if your wait time on rides which should be walk on were going to drop? Nope... Everything they are doing points to increases in standby wait times...

Some people who use the current system may be put off by the need to make advance "reservations" for rides and may not use it at all; others who used it for more than 3 FPs per day may be reduced; there may be more than 3 FPs per day allowed; people who used FPs at more than one park may be reduced to one park; some who never used current system may like this one and use it; and on and on.

If you don't book your FP+ time, then you will stand in stand by.. if guests are turned off by this and do not book, then they will go to the stand by line, thus increasing the wait time.. If more than half the guests use this, then stand by lines increase on rides which would be walk through... There really is no way to think otherwise...

Nothing at all about guest satisfaction. Yes, the context was that it was a conference call with analysts about company earnings, but ... yuck.

Because Disney no longer cares about guest satisfaction... Not as much as they used to... Rasulo sure don't... It is all about bottom line numbers and value to shareholders, guests come last...

It still cracks me up that they think by implementing FastPass people spend more money when they're not waiting in line. Whether I have a FastPass option or not, I'm not in a gift shop in my spare time. Granted, I may be eating but what I pay for a counter service meal is still less than what they want me to spend on their low quality and generic merchandise.

This was the reasoning for the original FP program: If we let guests get a time to return, and spend no time in the queue, then they will spend more time in the shops buying merchandise... This failed... People were not spending more time in the shops.. of course, the merchandise became generic garbage at the same time...

They think this new system is now the fix it to the broken system... it won't be... Which is why you will eventually see this system become a pay for play type system... Watch, just watch... Magical Disney vacations are going the way of the dodo...

[Wayne]

Watch, just watch... Magical Disney vacations are going the way of the dodo...

Which is why my family has probably taken its last trip to WDW. I go on vacation to relax not to stress out 6 months in advance where I am going to eat or now, what rides I am going to ride with the hope that the weather will co-operate.

[waymickey]

all of this makes me sad.

[CuteAsMinnie]

Very

The only thing making me happy is it seems very unlikely this mess will be implemented for our July trip.... Our LAST trip with the kids as kids (they are 17 & 20). No idea when we will be back. Will it be with the grandkids one day? A weekend trip during flower/garden? When DS runs in the Disney marathon after collegiate running? Any way we look at it it will be vastly different for us after this summer. I keep praying this trip will go smoothly.


On another note...

Another piece of the puzzle to consider is this....

I think it stands true guests have not been spending $$ on merchandise and such while not waiting in line so, perhaps their main way to make $$ on this is:

WDW has X number of hotel rooms which on most days are booked at or less than 80% - sometimes more, often times a whole lot less. If FastPass+ is only available to Resort guests as a "perk" (and no one knows if this will hold true) that missing 20% is a whole lot of hotel rooms with a whole lot of families in them spending a whole lot more money than THEY otherwise would.

OUR family has always stayed on property and would never visit WDW otherwise, but not everybody does.

I wonder what the percentage of WDW guests stay on property????

Disney wants a bigger piece of the Orlando pie and this may be the way to get it.

You don't stay on site.... They may not give you the FP+ 'perk'

Just some thoughts coming from the NextGen (DS 17)

[Ian]

This is the one thing the silly suits never seem to grasp ... maybe because they have too much money themselves?

The vast majority of people go on vacation with a fixed budget and that's what they spend. Whether they spend it on rooms, food, souvenirs, or whatever ... the guy who budgets $5,000 for his vacation spends $5,000 for his vacation. He's not going to spend $6,000 just because he's not waiting in a line. You know what he's going to do? Go ride another ride.

Duh.

[DizneyFreak2002]

This is the one thing the silly suits never seem to grasp ... maybe because they have too much money themselves?

The vast majority of people go on vacation with a fixed budget and that's what they spend. Whether they spend it on rooms, food, souvenirs, or whatever ... the guy who budgets $5,000 for his vacation spends $5,000 for his vacation. He's not going to spend $6,000 just because he's not waiting in a line. You know what he's going to do? Go ride another ride.

Duh.

You are 1000% right... The problem Disney sees with this though is half of that $5000 (maybe more than half) is now going to Universal (thanks to Potter)... Disney wants all of that $5000... Now, they figured out a way to sucker rubes out of that $5000 and more...

[Aurora]

There were people on another board better in numbers than I am who ran numbers based on what we know (17 million people a year, 47000 a day, 3 FP per person) and came up with an increase in standby lines of 30 minutes or more (more for the popular attractions)... Could they be wrong? Sure, I guess they could be... But, would Disney be building interactive queues if your wait time on rides which should be walk on were going to drop? Nope... Everything they are doing points to increases in standby wait times...

If you don't book your FP+ time, then you will stand in stand by.. if guests are turned off by this and do not book, then they will go to the stand by line, thus increasing the wait time.. If more than half the guests use this, then stand by lines increase on rides which would be walk through... There really is no way to think otherwise...

They can run the numbers any way they want to -- that's my point. The only way to know for sure is to have all the data about how people use FP now and how people will use it in the future based on Disney's restrictions, which aren't even written in stone yet and haven't been tested. Simply multiplying numbers of guests x FPs held (even if you're assuming 3 per person) is not going to tell you anything. There are just too many assumptions.

For example, take Splash Mountain. If the same number of FPs are given out as now and they're all taken, the only way the standby lines would increase is if there are more TOTAL people wanting to ride the attraction, and that's a function of guest attendance, not FP.

Standby lines could also increase if more FPs are allocated for any given attraction (but I haven't read or seen anything that would imply this) OR if all the FPs for an attraction that currently exhausts its allotment are NOT used up for the day (because people can only have 3, for example, and don't pick this one, moving their waiting spot to standby instead).

All I'm saying is that there are a lot of "ifs" about how it's implemented and guest behavior, not just how many FPs will be given per guest. We really have to wait and see.

[c&d]

Maybe I missed this, but if you can book 60 days out, what happens if all the FP's are gone when I go to book? I can see that happening when it's super busy.

I love going to WDW but it's becoming work to go, I have to make dining reservations 6 months out, and now I have to know what rides I want to do 2 months out. Take me back to the days when I could go eat at a restaurant without a reservation a million days before, and yes even the waits. It just put everyone on a level playing field.

[Ian]

It really boggles my mind that they think this is the way to combat the rise of Universal.

It's about kindergarten level logic to go, "Universal opens new Harry Potter section. Universal begins kicking our tail. We open new, uber-cool rides and attractions. We go back to kicking Universal's tail."

Instead oh no ... we'll over-complicate our vacations so much that people will be too confused to leave property! By the time they've finally navigated the maze of our mind-boggling admission options, dining reservation system, and advance ride/parade/fireworks/character meet-and-greet scheduling their vacation will be over, we'll have all their cash, and they'll be on their way home broke!

Turble.

[DizneyFreak2002]

It really boggles my mind that they think this is the way to combat the rise of Universal.

It's about kindergarten level logic to go, "Universal opens new Harry Potter section. Universal begins kicking our tail. We open new, uber-cool rides and attractions. We go back to kicking Universal's tail."

Instead oh no ... we'll over-complicate our vacations so much that people will be too confused to leave property! By the time they've finally navigated the maze of our mind-boggling admission options, dining reservation system, and advance ride/parade/fireworks/character meet-and-greet scheduling their vacation will be over, we'll have all their cash, and they'll be on their way home broke!

Turble.

Hit the nail on the head again... Who needs new attractions in WDW? Just put them under MouseArrest (complete with MouseArrest wrist bands!!!)...

[MizMissy]

Hit the nail on the head again... Who needs new attractions in WDW? Just put them under MouseArrest (complete with MouseArrest wrist bands!!!)...

I'm really hoping that is just your name for the wrist bands ... I mean, WDW marketing can't have fallen that far off the deep end???

[cer]

This whole thing is making me weary.

This part is not about the fast passes, but still confusing to me.

Like now, I just purchased annual passes for my husband and myself. In June, when we turn in our vouchers we will get the RFID cards (I think). My children will have Magic Your Way tickets. I am already confused as to if we will be able to enter through the same turnstyles, or will they have to go one direction and we go another? Since everything is not converted to fast pass +, I think the fast pass situation will be ok, but I am not sure. Will the tickets I get for the kids have the RFID chip in them or can their tickets be put on their room card?

Such a mess.

But truly I agree that Universal is looking better and better and I have never even been! It is a real draw to know that major attractions are being announced and coming online within a year. It seems that Disney needs to work on their turn around or releasing information in a way that is more timely.

I am certainly not the authority on any of this, but it is exhausting. There is so little information and so much speculation.

[DizneyFreak2002]

I'm really hoping that is just your name for the wrist bands ... I mean, WDW marketing can't have fallen that far off the deep end???

It is a name used by many in the community spread out over several fan sites... Disney is calling them Magic Bands... As bad as Disney marketing is at times, I don't think they would be that bad...

I've even seen some fans refer to these bands as Tragic Bands... I prefer Mouse Arrest...