Fastpa$$/Fastpass Updates {Merged Threads}

[DizneyRox]

Jim (consider the source) Hill just today posted a write up about a very recent patent submission by Disney.

If you're interested, it's patent # 20070203763, and you can look that up on appft1.uspto.gov.

Sounds like the pay for Fastpass is in the future. It's more of a prioritizaion process depending on how much you spend on your resort accomodations, but it boils down to pay more get more.

Discuss...

[bemster]

I'm not a big fan of the idea of pay for FastPass. I hope Disney doesn't implement it, but I wouldn't be entirely surprised... How did the old E-tickets work? Would paying for FastPass be much different than that old system?

That being said, just because Disney filed a patent, it doesn't mean: 1) the patent will be granted, and 2) that Disney has to use the patent. They could patent a technology to prevent someone else from using it, say, Universal, who I understand does/did allow people to pay for the privilege. Just my two cents...

[mermaidmarian]

Jim (consider the source) Hill just today posted a write up about a very recent patent submission by Disney.

If you're interested, it's patent # 20070203763, and you can look that up on appft1.uspto.gov.

Sounds like the pay for Fastpass is in the future. It's more of a prioritizaion process depending on how much you spend on your resort accomodations, but it boils down to pay more get more.

Discuss...

Wow - you know, I think if Disney went to this type of thing, I would have to reconsider whether it was really a family friendly theme park in which I wanted to spend (and spend and spend and spend) my recreational vacation dollars.

Would the people who pay gate admission but stay off property still be allowed to ride, or are imagineers working on the first generation of vicarious thrill rides?

[SBETigg]

When I was just there in August, I was amazed to find people walking around who actually thought FastPass was a paid-for privilege. Someone in front of us was making fun of the "fancy rich people, think they can buy the world" who FastPassed Buzz Lightyear. I wanted to set her straight but it was a short line anyway and she was dragging her screaming fearful daughter, so I let her go on believing.

I think it would be a bad idea for Disney to change a system that currently works and pleases so many to a paid system that would disappoint. It seems too early to worry about that kind of change taking place, but who knows. Change happens fast.

[Ian]

This is old news, so I wouldn't sweat it. First of all, what appears in patents and what actually gets done are frequently two totally different things.

Keep in mind that in 2005, Eisner wasn't long out of power. This could have been something that was started under his regime and shelved once Iger took over.

Also, companies file patents and intentionally try to cover any and all areas they may ever want to get into. This protects them in the future and also ensures that anyone who does want to use that technology will have to license it from Disney first.

And, in the grand scheme of things, I'm fine with it anyway. I think people who pay more should get more out of their experience. That's the way of the world.

[mttafire]

This is old news, so I wouldn't sweat it. First of all, what appears in patents and what actually gets done are frequently two totally different things.

Keep in mind that in 2005, Eisner wasn't long out of power. This could have been something that was started under his regime and shelved once Iger took over.

Also, companies file patents and intentionally try to cover any and all areas they may ever want to get into. This protects them in the future and also ensures that anyone who does want to use that technology will have to license it from Disney first.

And, in the grand scheme of things, I'm fine with it anyway. I think people who pay more should get more out of their experience. That's the way of the world.

Ian, I agree 100%. If i may i'll also add; I too would see no problem IF Disney charged extra for a fastpass or "get on ride faster" type stsyem. I know that Universal does that exact thing and i actually kinda like it. I to dont actually think this will happen at Disney but if it did....I think id like it.

[MidnTPK]

I'd just like to remind people that FastPasses aren't exactly cutting to the front of the line. FastPass is a virtual line.

Well what does that mumbo-jumbo mean: when you are in the standby line, you are physically there. Move and you lose your place in the line. Now imagine if you got a number for your place in the physical line. You could go off and do something until it was your turn to ride. Well.....that's what FastPass is. It creates the virtual line.

While this patent says that priority would be given to higher revenue generating guests, it's not likely that implementing that type of system is a priority for Disney. Consider the pricing scheme of park tickets. Its less than $3 more a day, per day, for days 5 through 10 on park passes. This is because WDW wants people buying meals on property, buying more merchandise, and spending $100-$500 a night in the hotel rooms. If people cut a day or two out of their vacation because they didn't have to wait in line, Disney would be losing out on a lot of other revenue, and would have to charge a ridiculously high price for this option to make up for shorter stays at the resorts. So that's probably not the direction they are going.

What I will bet is on the horizon, however, is pre-scheduling your FastPasses. Imagine if you could use your hotel room TV to book all your rides for the day. WDW could personalize what parks you were allowed to do this in on particular days, in order to manage crowds (so everybody from Pop didn't go to MGM one day). And they could give more flexibility to deluxe guests, like longer time windows and closer spacing of ride times.

Wide scale implementation of this type of system could make the WDW experience much more pleasant. Imagine not having to wait in a line the entire time you visited WDW. And shorter standby lines because everyone is organized. But the potential loser in this system is the day and off-site visitor. But I bet a good-neighbor like system would develop where WDW placed kiosks in the DTD hotels plus some other places like the Hyatt and Gaylord.

[DizneyRox]

Would the people who pay gate admission but stay off property still be allowed to ride, or are imagineers working on the first generation of vicarious thrill rides?

I don't think Disney would be able to pull Fastpass from everyone. It will still be "free" in some form, but I do think that offering priority to resort guests AND the different resorts is a pretty good selling point.

What I would imagine is that folks in the different resorts will sign-on nightly, make their picks, and each morning get a list of what they got. Those at the grand will get more of their first choices, and folks in the values will get more of their third choices. I can picture say 50% of the fastpasses distributed this way with the remaining 50% reserved for the regular people.

What could happen is fastpasses selling out sooner, but it may be that if you pre-order your fastpass you can't get one during the day. In that case, it won't have a significant impact on fastpass availability, but will impact the times that are available. For example, I would expect many non-resort guests would get the less desirable times like lunch and dinner, while resort guests will get times that don't interfere with other happenings.

Is it enough to justify staying onsite, or upgrading to better accomodations? Maybe, maybe not... For people who don't go often, I doubt it, it will be tough to grasp the ramifications, but frequent guests will get it. It has the potential to backfire though I agree.

[Ian]

I hate that idea. Overly scheduled vacations are annoying as anything to me. I like to play it by ear and take my time to do whatever I feel like doing at a given moment.

If I felt like I had to plan my trip from start to finish before I even left just to keep up with everyone else, I'd be done with WDW as a vacation destination. Let's not get carried away with this technology stuff.

Also, I'll be shocked if any of this ever materializes ... I think Disney is becoming less enamored of Fastpass because, from what I've heard, the additional revenue streams they were supposed to have generated from folks spending money while not waiting in line never materialized.

[Ian]

What I would imagine is that folks in the different resorts will sign-on nightly, make their picks, and each morning get a list of what they got. Those at the grand will get more of their first choices, and folks in the values will get more of their third choices. I can picture say 50% of the fastpasses distributed this way with the remaining 50% reserved for the regular people.

In that case, when I was staying in a value resort I'd just list all my #1 choices as my #3's and vice versa.

[GrumpyFan]

When I was just there in August, I was amazed to find people walking around who actually thought FastPass was a paid-for privilege. Someone in front of us was making fun of the "fancy rich people, think they can buy the world" who FastPassed Buzz Lightyear. I wanted to set her straight but it was a short line anyway and she was dragging her screaming fearful daughter, so I let her go on believing.

It's amazing to me, how many people still don't understand Faspass and how to use it. Not that I'm complaining really, because sometimes, by the time I get to the Fastpass machine, they're spitting out tickets for closing time, so obviously some do get it.

[glenpreece]

It's amazing to me, how many people still don't understand Faspass and how to use it. Not that I'm complaining really, because sometimes, by the time I get to the Fastpass machine, they're spitting out tickets for closing time, so obviously some do get it.

I agree that i am glad some don't understand it. I think it ould be great if Disney offered priority to resort guests. Being someone who always stays on site and has to due to physical limitations I would to be able to pre book a fast pass in my room for free.

[DisneyDudet]

I like the system, as is. I would like to change Peter Pan into a Non Fastpass ride, but no one asked me.

Do you think they will make it "free", only based on level of resort type, or will it be an optional charge? If its not optional, you can see room rates sky rocket, and people will not be too happy, because they are paying more for a little more benefit.

The only way I can see it as being "user friendly" is that, based on level purchase (or level of stay), you can hold X number of FP at one time.

The whole choosing the night before, makes planning a day very difficult, and is time consuming.

I have seen a thread like this on rumors or ideas many times in my 5 years of being on Intercot. Nothing really has come of it, except arguments. Until they actually have serious talks about it, I'm not too worried.

I don't like the looks that I already get from people waiting in standby lines, because they don't understand the FP system, or think its like Universal Studios. To me, having a convoluted system like there are rumors of, will just make it even worse! MYW and free dining is already mind churning enough!

[valjane]

I don't like the idea of distributing FastPasses based on how much someone is spending at a hotel. Nothing like making value resort guests feel like third class citizens during vacation, huh?

Besides, someone spending 10 nights at a value will be spending more money than someone spending a couple of nights at a deluxe, so who is to say who's spending the most money?

I don't think it will ever happen, but I'd be pretty disappointed if they were ever distributed in such a manner.

[Tekneek]

I hope they never give into this, but I suspect they won't be able to hold off the urge forever. They will find a way to "monetize" the fastpass system eventually. They are fully in the "gotta please Wall Street" mindset and that means they have to raise revenues every quarter by any means possible. As that pressure mounts, those trying to hold the line will lose this battle.

[DizneyRox]

I hope they never give into this, but I suspect they won't be able to hold off the urge forever. They will find a way to "monetize" the fastpass system eventually. They are fully in the "gotta please Wall Street" mindset and that means they have to raise revenues every quarter by any means possible. As that pressure mounts, those trying to hold the line will lose this battle.

Correct, if there's money to be made, it has to be made. It's east to start with efficiencies, then cut backs, and move on to fees and other charges. Looks like we're looking at phase three, while still getting some mileage out of phase two.

It will happen, I'm sure of it! When is in question. Yes loads of people will complain, there will be some resistance, but if they stick to their guns and people get sick of standby lines, the wallets will open. With there being tens of thousands of guests daily to the parks, even only very small percentage of people paying for the opportunity is all it will take to add some significant cash to the balance sheet. With the infrastructure in place, the costs of implementing this has got to be relatively small.

[Tekneek]

With the infrastructure in place, the costs of implementing this has got to be relatively small.

I expect it will be something you add onto your existing ticket. I would be surprised if the ability to add/remove a Fastpass 'flag' on a ticket is not already in their system (even if no one is able to make changes to that variable at this point).

[WDWfanatic742]

Per the other thread, with this coming in a newspaper, I think it deserved it's own thread because it lists much other things in it and would attract people who just want to read the news.

Disney's FastPass entering digital era
Scott Powers | Sentinel Staff Writer
September 6, 2007

Walt Disney World visitors could someday order line-skipping, "FastPass" ride tickets from their cell phones or home computers, and could receive preferential treatment based on the price of their Disney accommodations, using a new technology the resort's parent company is developing.

The technology, which the Walt Disney Co. is seeking to patent, would use central computers to manage distribution of FastPass tickets throughout Disney World's four Central Florida theme parks and at Disneyland in Southern California. Such passes, which shorten the wait for theme-park rides, could be ordered and downloaded through all sorts of wired or wireless digital devices, according to the patent application filed Aug. 30.

FastPass tickets are available from kiosks placed outside popular rides such as Space Mountain in the Magic Kingdom and Soarin' in Epcot.

A Disney World official downplayed on Wednesday the FastPass ideas spelled out in the application, which is on file with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office.

Disney spokeswoman Kim Prunty said the technology is envisioned for use in connection with all sorts of guest services, such as shopping and dining-room management.

There are no plans to change FastPass, she said.

"They are still in the very early stages of development. There's no telling where the dreams might lead," Prunty said. "We're looking at lots of ways to use interactive technology."

Ride management evolves

Still, most of the 30-page patent application deals with FastPass, spelling out an interactive, digital system in detail.

Among the ideas: How theme-park officials or customers could revise FastPass times via text messages in case something such as poor weather complicates plans.

The wait in line for the more popular Disney rides is typically more than an hour. But people who swing by early can pick up FastPass reservation tickets at a designated kiosk, which lets them return at set times and enter the ride through a shorter line.

The ideas in the patent application are an evolution of Disney's ride-line management, said Dennis Speigel, a private consultant and president of International Theme Park Services.

"It's kind of the digital-age queue line," Speigel said.

Some people -- notably single-day visitors to the giant resort's theme parks -- could be frustrated by some of the ideas in the patent paperwork, however.

'Hierarchies of access'

Disney's application openly suggests that the technology could be used to give preferential treatment to people who spend more money at the resort.

That could mean priority for the best FastPass times would go to people staying in Disney's luxury hotels, followed by those in its moderate hotels, then by those in its budget hotels, then by day visitors.

"Spending per guest at hotels can determine different hierarchies of access to Fastpass," the application states. "Thus, the more that is spent by a patron, the higher the priority can be."

Also, day visitors who send a text message request for a FastPass could have an advantage over people who don't and use a kiosk.

A means test for rides?

"That's really a bad idea," said Arlen Miller of Kissimmee, a Disney enthusiast and past president of the World Chapter of the National Fantasy Fan Club. Apparently, text-message visitors could present a coded Disney ticket or a "Key to the World" pass once they enter the park and go to a ride.

"I don't have a problem with people staying at a resort [hotel] being able to get the reservation. But I resent the fact that someone who's off-property with a cell phone or a PDA can do it and they're not even in the park," Miller said. "That's discrimination against people who aren't as financially fortunate."

There also could be privacy concerns, suggested Jim Hill, founder of JimHillMedia.com, the Disney-watching Internet site that first reported the patent application Wednesday.

The patent application notes that, once someone uses a cell phone or PDA to contact the system, the system could recognize the device and track the person around the park.

Hill wrote in his blog that the intentions behind such a use are likely fairly innocent but would inevitably raise privacy-rights questions.

The application credits three people as co-inventors behind the patent: Disney World's Gregory B. Hale, chief safety officer for all Disney parks and resorts worldwide; Kenneth W. Schweizer, of Disney World's design-and-engineering team; and Jonathan Ackley, of Walt Disney Imagineering in Glendale, Calif.

Prunty said safety and security issues are among those that must be explored before any system could be set up.

[Marker]

What strikes me most is the overwhelming use of the word "could" in this article. It's full of a whole lot of speculation, and not a lot of facts. The only comment from Disney about it is "There are no plans to change FastPass".

[battlefield2freak]

i guess this is related to the new fastpass machines being installed throughout the 4 parks?