Spontaneous trip and Fastpass-it's not working out!

[mouseketeer mom]

So DH gets "last minute" invite to do a training close to WDW. We all decide to accompany him, so three weeks out, we are planning a WDW visit. I'm an old hat at this, but with this new system, UGH! No option for Mine Train, they are all gone, and can't get earlier times for some of our faves like TSM. Pulling my hair out. Was excited to plan, now see most of our options are limited, some are gone altogether. Just venting, but boy, this trip is costing $$$ as you all know, and no chance for getting these fastpasses we desire. Ugh.

[SBETigg]

Yeah, that's not ideal. They do need to work out a few things with the new system, I think. But, you've been around enough to still find plenty to do that you love and not be all that bothered, maybe? I hope? Good luck!

[Figment50]

I think your making a bigger deal out this then it should be. You can allways use the stand by line to ride the rides you don't have a fast pass for. Go first thing in the morning and get on line before the rush or go last thing in the day most ride quite down around then. Worse case you wait on line for 30 min or an hour or maybe longer but as long as you have fun what the deal. I remeber the days before fast pass when eveyone stood on one line.
Have a good trip.

:mickey:

[VWL Mom]

Lisa, try to go in to change my fp and see if you can find better times for TSM. I've been able to make my schedule more to what I want that way. The selections they give are oft times just trying to direct the crowds where they want them.

[AgentC]

Lisa, try to go in to change my fp and see if you can find better times for TSM. I've been able to make my schedule more to what I want that way. The selections they give are oft times just trying to direct the crowds where they want them.

Lisa, Definitely do what Lynn suggests. If you only go with what they suggest, the time often doesn't work. Unless it is a holiday weekend there might be more TSMM times out there but you have to go into the change time to find them.

I do mine at the last minute a lot since I'm local and usually don't have more than 30 days. I pick what is close to what I want, then I go in and change them and move times.

The Mine Train unfortunately is just tough. It usually gone at around 30 days but if you check back or break up your group into smaller groups, it sometimes comes up but it is definitely a hard one to get.

It's hard to get used to but I try to remind myself when I get frustrated that under the old FP system I had no control over the times at all.

[Cass&KenziesMom]

Keep checking back as you get closer. I tried forever to get Mine Train and a little over a week before we left to go one popped up!

[BigRedDad]

The new FP system is designed for making plans 60+ days out. It is the first salvo in forcing people to stay on property. The next big change will be Deluxe Resort guests can reserve 60 days out, Moderate 50 days out, Value 40 days out, then AP holders 30 days out. Everyone else the day of. After that change comes into effect, they will alter it more where Deluxe get 5 FPs per day, Moderates 4, Values and AP 3, and everyone else 1 on the day of.

This is all planned. Once they make the final changes, the rates for Deluxe and Moderate resorts will go even higher. They have no lack of people visiting and they will find the easiest ways to get the money from them.

[joonyer]

The new FP system is designed for making plans 60+ days out. It is the first salvo in forcing people to stay on property. The next big change will be Deluxe Resort guests can reserve 60 days out, Moderate 50 days out, Value 40 days out, then AP holders 30 days out. Everyone else the day of. After that change comes into effect, they will alter it more where Deluxe get 5 FPs per day, Moderates 4, Values and AP 3, and everyone else 1 on the day of.

This is all planned. Once they make the final changes, the rates for Deluxe and Moderate resorts will go even higher. They have no lack of people visiting and they will find the easiest ways to get the money from them.

This is a good analysis, kinda like the income tax and payroll withholding: people never would have stood for it if they got the money first and then had to send it to the government. FP at Disney will likely always be "free". It's the hotel rooms that come with the "free" FP and other benefits that will go up in price.

[yankeesfan123]

The new FP system is designed for making plans 60+ days out. It is the first salvo in forcing people to stay on property. The next big change will be Deluxe Resort guests can reserve 60 days out, Moderate 50 days out, Value 40 days out, then AP holders 30 days out. Everyone else the day of. After that change comes into effect, they will alter it more where Deluxe get 5 FPs per day, Moderates 4, Values and AP 3, and everyone else 1 on the day of.

This is all planned. Once they make the final changes, the rates for Deluxe and Moderate resorts will go even higher. They have no lack of people visiting and they will find the easiest ways to get the money from them.

Any sources for this "plan" involving the resorts?

Hearing it from message board rumors (not just here) isn't the same as seeing it legitimately reported.

[NJGIRL]

This is why a lot of people hate the new system....Not for last minute vacations.....not for people staying off site....not for locals who want to go for day trips.

For this vacation try Universal.....you will love the easy of the vacation and not having to take any transporation to get to the parks.

[princessgirls]

I'm not a fan of the new system...at all.

Had a late time for TSM... and absolutely could not change it.

We rode on less this past trip too....

However, if you get up and get out, you should get on your favorites!

Have a great magical trip!
Julie:mickey:

[EeyoresBestFriend]

I think your making a bigger deal out this then it should be. You can allways use the stand by line to ride the rides you don't have a fast pass for. Go first thing in the morning and get on line before the rush or go last thing in the day most ride quite down around then. Worse case you wait on line for 30 min or an hour or maybe longer but as long as you have fun what the deal. I remeber the days before fast pass when eveyone stood on one line.
Have a good trip.

:mickey:

I wish they would go back to one line - then it would move just fine and everyone - wdw veterans, rookies, newbies - would have an equal chance to ride. And I'm pretty sure that the lines would move smoothly. Uh . . . at least until the ride broke down . . . :D

[mouseketeer mom]

Well, logged on this a.m, and got Seven Dwarfs mine train and TSM! Woot woot! Persistence paid off!

[VWL Mom]

Well, logged on this a.m, and got Seven Dwarfs mine train and TSM! Woot woot! Persistence paid off!

:yay: Glad it all worked out, have a great trip!

[SBETigg]

Well, logged on this a.m, and got Seven Dwarfs mine train and TSM! Woot woot! Persistence paid off!

Yay! Good news.

[LVT]

I hope not. That is what I dislike about universal. The expensive hotels have the fastpass or you can buy one. The cheap hotel line they started does not get them. The richer folks get more. It's just business.

[SurferStitch]

I hope not. That is what I dislike about universal. The expensive hotels have the fastpass or you can buy one. The cheap hotel line they started does not get them. The richer folks get more. It's just business.

Don't worry... that FP cost is already rolled into the cost of the higher end resort stays. You're either paying for through your room cost, or you can stay in a less expensive resort and buy it. Pretty much the same.

[PopPhan]

Don't worry... that FP cost is already rolled into the cost of the higher end resort stays. You're either paying for through your room cost, or you can stay in a less expensive resort and buy it. Pretty much the same.

Let's take a look at FastPass vs. FP+ in the same vein....

With the original FastPass system, it was first-come, first-served. People who knew the system, whether they were staying on Disney property or not, got what they wanted by arriving early and stockpiling FastPasses (until they actually started enforcing the time windows). People who didn't know the system - first time visitors, for instance - ended up standing in long queues whether they paid the extra money to stay on Disney property or not.

A lot of first-timers or one-timers paid a lot of money to stay on Disney property and enjoy a visit, only to get shut out of some attractions or have to wait while the above mentioned group zips right on through. (I blame this on the 80/20 rule, but that is a whole different soapbox.)

Believe it or not, there are still some people who do not do research before visiting.

So, Disney comes up with this new system to do a number of things:

Cut down on stockpiling FastPasses (FP)
Allow more visitors to get FP
Allow those staying on property access to FP before those staying off property (weekenders and AP holders who know the system well and play it for all it's worth)


You already pay more than standard (for the area) for rooms on-property. To me, that means you are already paying for FP+ and Disney Transportation. Why shouldn't those people get a bit of "preferential treatment" on what they are paying extra for?

I am not a fan of the FP+ system myself, but I just don't get some of the complaints. Next thing you know, people will complain about Single Rider lines because they (can) make the Stand-By line move slower.

There will always be complaints, so let's just make the best of the situation while we can.

OK...off my soapbox now... :soapbox:

[Hammer]

Let's take a look at FastPass vs. FP+ in the same vein....

With the original FastPass system, it was first-come, first-served. People who knew the system, whether they were staying on Disney property or not, got what they wanted by arriving early and stockpiling FastPasses (until they actually started enforcing the time windows). People who didn't know the system - first time visitors, for instance - ended up standing in long queues whether they paid the extra money to stay on Disney property or not.

A lot of first-timers or one-timers paid a lot of money to stay on Disney property and enjoy a visit, only to get shut out of some attractions or have to wait while the above mentioned group zips right on through. (I blame this on the 80/20 rule, but that is a whole different soapbox.)

Believe it or not, there are still some people who do not do research before visiting.

So, Disney comes up with this new system to do a number of things:

Cut down on stockpiling FastPasses (FP)
Allow more visitors to get FP
Allow those staying on property access to FP before those staying off property (weekenders and AP holders who know the system well and play it for all it's worth)


You already pay more than standard (for the area) for rooms on-property. To me, that means you are already paying for FP+ and Disney Transportation. Why shouldn't those people get a bit of "preferential treatment" on what they are paying extra for?

I am not a fan of the FP+ system myself, but I just don't get some of the complaints. Next thing you know, people will complain about Single Rider lines because they (can) make the Stand-By line move slower.

There will always be complaints, so let's just make the best of the situation while we can.

OK...off my soapbox now... :soapbox:

I agree with this 100%!

I sincerely hope they do not do away with Single Rider lines, though I have noticed for the last few years, even before there was such a thing as FP+, they will sometimes close the Single Rider lines for Rockin Rollercoaster and Everest.

[EeyoresBestFriend]

I agree with this 100%!

I sincerely hope they do not do away with Single Rider lines, though I have noticed for the last few years, even before there was such a thing as FP+, they will sometimes close the Single Rider lines for Rockin Rollercoaster and Everest.

Interesting that you mention single riders line as I have noticed that this appears to be the latest 'abuse'. I noticed that there were a lot of families in the line that when at the front would then say 'oh (s)he's too small/ afraid to ride by themselves - can they go with me/Daddy?' So then the family would split into groups of 2. Even though they were in the single rider line, I never once saw them denied and there were quite a few of doing that.
It's sad and reinforced bad behavior. :(

[Disney4us2]

Well, logged on this a.m, and got Seven Dwarfs mine train and TSM! Woot woot! Persistence paid off!

So glad you were able to get the fast passes.:joy:

[RunDMV]

Let's take a look at FastPass vs. FP+ in the same vein....

With the original FastPass system, it was first-come, first-served. People who knew the system, whether they were staying on Disney property or not, got what they wanted by arriving early and stockpiling FastPasses (until they actually started enforcing the time windows). People who didn't know the system - first time visitors, for instance - ended up standing in long queues whether they paid the extra money to stay on Disney property or not.

A lot of first-timers or one-timers paid a lot of money to stay on Disney property and enjoy a visit, only to get shut out of some attractions or have to wait while the above mentioned group zips right on through. (I blame this on the 80/20 rule, but that is a whole different soapbox.)

Believe it or not, there are still some people who do not do research before visiting.

So, Disney comes up with this new system to do a number of things:

Cut down on stockpiling FastPasses (FP)
Allow more visitors to get FP
Allow those staying on property access to FP before those staying off property (weekenders and AP holders who know the system well and play it for all it's worth)


You already pay more than standard (for the area) for rooms on-property. To me, that means you are already paying for FP+ and Disney Transportation. Why shouldn't those people get a bit of "preferential treatment" on what they are paying extra for?

I am not a fan of the FP+ system myself, but I just don't get some of the complaints. Next thing you know, people will complain about Single Rider lines because they (can) make the Stand-By line move slower.

There will always be complaints, so let's just make the best of the situation while we can.

OK...off my soapbox now... :soapbox:

your "stockpiling fastpass" comment has me scratching my head.

[MNNHFLTX]

your "stockpiling fastpass" comment has me scratching my head.

I agree. One of the main purposes of FP+ was to keep guests committed to spending all of their time in Disney World parks and not venture elsewere (and in the process, spend their money on food and souvenirs to increase revenue). I think that was probably the main motivation for creating the system.

[PopPhan]

your "stockpiling fastpass" comment has me scratching my head.

Before they started enforcing the FastPass Return window, some people would collect FastPasses throughout the day. They had no intention of returning during the window on the ticket. They would wait until they were ready to leave the park and use all of their FastPasses at once. This took FastPass availability away from people who would return at the appointed time. I had actually seen people with FastPasses for 5 or 6 attractions near the end of the day trying to figure out in what order they would use them. (And they were proud of how many they collected.)

That is what I meant by 'stockpiling' FastPasses.

Sorry for the confusion.

[RunDMV]

Before they started enforcing the FastPass Return window, some people would collect FastPasses throughout the day. They had no intention of returning during the window on the ticket. They would wait until they were ready to leave the park and use all of their FastPasses at once. This took FastPass availability away from people who would return at the appointed time. I had actually seen people with FastPasses for 5 or 6 attractions near the end of the day trying to figure out in what order they would use them. (And they were proud of how many they collected.)

That is what I meant by 'stockpiling' FastPasses.

Sorry for the confusion.

still has m confused. a person couldn't "stockpile" more than about 5. if they did, the number of people doing that would be so small as to be statistically insignificant.

[Cinderelley]

Let's take a look at FastPass vs. FP+ in the same vein....

With the original FastPass system, it was first-come, first-served. People who knew the system, whether they were staying on Disney property or not, got what they wanted by arriving early and stockpiling FastPasses (until they actually started enforcing the time windows). People who didn't know the system - first time visitors, for instance - ended up standing in long queues whether they paid the extra money to stay on Disney property or not.

A lot of first-timers or one-timers paid a lot of money to stay on Disney property and enjoy a visit, only to get shut out of some attractions or have to wait while the above mentioned group zips right on through. (I blame this on the 80/20 rule, but that is a whole different soapbox.)

Believe it or not, there are still some people who do not do research before visiting.

So, Disney comes up with this new system to do a number of things:

Cut down on stockpiling FastPasses (FP)
Allow more visitors to get FP
Allow those staying on property access to FP before those staying off property (weekenders and AP holders who know the system well and play it for all it's worth)


You already pay more than standard (for the area) for rooms on-property. To me, that means you are already paying for FP+ and Disney Transportation. Why shouldn't those people get a bit of "preferential treatment" on what they are paying extra for?

I am not a fan of the FP+ system myself, but I just don't get some of the complaints. Next thing you know, people will complain about Single Rider lines because they (can) make the Stand-By line move slower.

There will always be complaints, so let's just make the best of the situation while we can.

OK...off my soapbox now... :soapbox:

First off, if people aren't researching before their vacation, they are still going to miss the opportunity to get their Fastpass + at 60 days out, so this doesn't help them.

If you want a good situation where Fastpass + isn't working, I'll share mine with you. I'm taking a terminally ill friend. I have no idea what time of day he will feel up to riding rides. Under the old system, we would show up when he felt well and get a fastpass. Yes, we would run the risk of not getting the rides we wanted if we showed up late, but someone else would have gotten it. If he felt well early in the morning, we could get on whatever we chose.

Now, I am having to try to decide what times will work for him 60 days in advance. Yes, we could still just show up, but some rides such as the 7DMT are going to be booked up well before we even arrive, so my only option is to try to get it at 60 days out. I am doing my best to pick times that would be good for him, but I can't be 100%. With this system, if we don't use it, it is lost. No one else can pick it up. Yes, there is the standby line, but I am sure it is long, and I don't want to put him through that. And before anyway says "well, there's always next time", I hope there are many next times while I am there, but there may not be any for him.

[pixiesmimi]

That happened to us last year. We booked a last minute trip in October because of DH being overseas and were too late to get FP+ for a majority of the rides, especially Mine Train. Because of it being shut down off and on that week for rain, we ended up not being able to ride it because the lines were just too long. There were not many good rides we could get FP for, just the ones that really didn't need a FP. I was frustrated the whole trip and feel like we wasted our money except for the Wine and Food Festival because we didn't get to ride very many of our favorite rides. I'm still not sold one this new FP+ system.

[joonyer]

First off, if people aren't researching before their vacation, they are still going to miss the opportunity to get their Fastpass + at 60 days out, so this doesn't help them.

If you want a good situation where Fastpass + isn't working, I'll share mine with you. I'm taking a terminally ill friend. I have no idea what time of day he will feel up to riding rides. Under the old system, we would show up when he felt well and get a fastpass. Yes, we would run the risk of not getting the rides we wanted if we showed up late, but someone else would have gotten it. If he felt well early in the morning, we could get on whatever we chose.

Now, I am having to try to decide what times will work for him 60 days in advance. Yes, we could still just show up, but some rides such as the 7DMT are going to be booked up well before we even arrive, so my only option is to try to get it at 60 days out. I am doing my best to pick times that would be good for him, but I can't be 100%. With this system, if we don't use it, it is lost. No one else can pick it up. Yes, there is the standby line, but I am sure it is long, and I don't want to put him through that. And before anyway says "well, there's always next time", I hope there are many next times while I am there, but there may not be any for him.

Your friend may be eligible for a DAS (Disability Access Service) Card. If you haven't done so already, it may be worth your while to check into it before you go.

[Speedy1998]

I remeber the days before fast pass when eveyone stood on one line.

:mickey:

In many ways I think the trip was alot less stressful back in those days.

[manutd1]

Just get a FP for which you can....stand in line for the rides you can't. I have found that attractions that a FP that can't be achieved....if you keep checking wait times...you'll find an acceptable time. I think people are too obsessed with getting a FP for certain rides...I.E. The new mine ride.
If people simply get there before rope drop on a non morning EMH...go right for that ride....you can easily do it 2 times....with the second maybe having a 30 min wait (at worst)....but lets be honest...30 min. is not long really.
I for one loved the old system....( i knew how to get maximum fast passes all day) and with the new system you can STILL get 6-7 FP easy and for rides that you really want to use it on...not including, HM, POTC...Small World and others. You just have to make sure you are at a kiosk at the moment you can get more...with no delay...(which is a lot like the old way) Yes, the mine ride does run out of FP fast...but that is an attraction Id do first thing in day. FP+ CAN be "worked" and within the rules....you just have to research it and understand it.
I will add that I am realizing the NEW system is actually easier to plan with and if you maximize it..you can still get a lot of FP's I really like FP+ a lot.

[manutd1]

your "stockpiling fastpass" comment has me scratching my head.
With the old system...I could have ALOT of fast passes in my wallet..I mean 6-7 easy. Disney never enforced the return time so you could just keep getting them as soon as the previous ticket told you you could .....with never using the first yet.
Even when they did enforce the return time...If you simply got one the minute you were able to...you could still really get a lot that way.
No different with FP+ One just to make sure that the moment you exit an attraction using the last FP+ that you pre selected...you need to run to the kiosk (just like we did the old system..only to the attraction) and get your 4th and a soon as you use it....bam, adios..make a v-line for the nearest kiosk...or cast member holding an iPad. And get another. And so on.

[azcavalier]

Interesting that you mention single riders line as I have noticed that this appears to be the latest 'abuse'. I noticed that there were a lot of families in the line that when at the front would then say 'oh (s)he's too small/ afraid to ride by themselves - can they go with me/Daddy?' So then the family would split into groups of 2. Even though they were in the single rider line, I never once saw them denied and there were quite a few of doing that.
It's sad and reinforced bad behavior. :(

Oh, I've seen this enforced plenty, and we never go during "high" times. I'm seen parents pitch a fit when they went through the Single Rider line with their kids and then got split up. Poor CMs that have to deal with those people. We heard one flat out ask an irate Mom, "Ma'am, this is the SINGLE RIDER line. It clearly states that YOU WILL BE SEPARATED. Did you not understand that?" And when they refused to be separated, the CM made them go through the Stand-By line.

That was on Test Track, BTW.

[faline]

Oh, I've seen this enforced plenty, and we never go during "high" times. I'm seen parents pitch a fit when they went through the Single Rider line with their kids and then got split up. Poor CMs that have to deal with those people. We heard one flat out ask an irate Mom, "Ma'am, this is the SINGLE RIDER line. It clearly states that YOU WILL BE SEPARATED. Did you not understand that?" And when they refused to be separated, the CM made them go through the Stand-By line.

That was on Test Track, BTW.

I have also seen them enforce this rule - both on Test Track and on Expedition Everest.

[MrsJ1022]

I think the new system makes you plan down to the minute and some people like to vacation that way, but my family likes to go with the flow...and having to plan every moment 60+ days out isnt fun....

i think the old fastpass system had its flaws as well, but at least when you actually had to GO to the ride to get a fastpass it spread people out around the park. if you wanted to ride everest first thing but also wanted to get fast passes for the safari you had to choose which direction you wanted to go in. i dunno. not a huge fan of FP+

[MouseHouser]

It's my impression that the new system is designed for one purpose: to coerce guests to spend more on lodgings if they want the same quality of experience they're used to.

And this is coming from a person who believes capitalism is a big part of what makes this country great.

But there is something called price-gouging, and it's very unseemly. That's how I view this, which is why I use the word "coerce" and not "encourage." It's at the point where Disney management seems to want to charge "all the market will bear," and that's going too far, imo.

There's also a thing called corporate responsibility. Disney is a cultural institution that has become part of our national heritage. It's an increasingly profitable, major American corporation that owes its success to its loyal patrons. When they go too far with pushing the profit motive down our throats, they begin to descend the slippery slope of greed.

Walt would never have lost sight of his mission to provide a place where adults and kids can have fun together. Current management needs to back off a bit from these thinly-veiled money grabs. They make it increasingly difficult to ignore that people are manipulating our wallets, and to simply focus on the magic that Walt created, we grew up with, and for which everyone on this site has a special place in their heart.