Carousel of Progress to be replaced by 2009?

[Toad]

I've been hearing a lot of rumors lately that WDW's Carousel of Progress and Disneyland's Innoventions will both be replaced with a video screen attraction based on Pixar's Wall-E. Does anybody have more information concerning this matter?

[Roger's #1 Fan]

As far as Innoventions in DL, I read a report yesterday that they have closed the lower portion of Innoventions and that Microsoft is installing a new exhibit in this space. Whether its tied to Wall-E is not clear.

As for COP, rumors of an Incredibles ride and other attractions have been floating around the net for a while. Nothing of any substance has surfaced thus far.

[Disney_Barbie]

I thought Walt specificly requested that CoP stay in operation? Well, I supose if he did request that and if they did want to replace it with something else, I guess they could always move it to a different park, Paris or whatever, I think his request was only that it stayed in Operation right?

[JPL]

I highly doubt that would plan to close an attraction to replace it with an attraction based on an unreleased movie. Wall-E could be the biggest flop ever for all we know. I believe this is pure speculation on the orignator of the rumour. For now I would really take this with a grain of salt.

[Figment!]

... a video screen attraction based on Pixar's Wall-E.Does anybody have more information concerning this matter?According to few sources with connections to Imagineering, the Wall-E based attraction is currently a conceptual project and has not been greenlit.

[Mackflava99]

COP is such a tradition, it would be terrible if it was removed.
As old as it is its still so cool to imagine how advanced it was for the time it was originally made.

[magicofdisney]

This is not directed at the OP but I loathe these CoP shutdown or replacement rumors. The loss of CoP is a thought I don't care to entertain. :(

[Crow]

im afraid it may happen....
sorta got that feelin when had dinner w Imagineer in Sept

[Donald A]

When I was there in November '06 they had just renovated our theater section. I hope the CoP stays. It was Walt Disney's pride ever since he debuted it at the World's Fair. It is about as "classic" as anything in all of the Magic Kingdom!

[RedheadWriter]

I think it is a shame that these new movies come out and we are subjected to new attractions based on them. Can we PLEASE keep some tradition at WDW? It can't all be about the newest and latest thing. Remember, Walt wanted a place where families can have fun together? Keep some older, cherished attractions.

[Jeany031]

I will miss COP that is my favorite ride! And I Do love The Incredibles!:mjump::chip::dale: I hope The Incredibles ride will be official!

[Jasper]

While anything can happen at any time with The Disney Company the stories about CoP closing down have been a dime a dozen for many years now. The stories really pick up when CoP goes on a shorter operating schedule or when it closes for maintenance. Until Disney itself announces something official there is no point in getting too worried about it.

By the way, one way to get any ride, including CoP to stay open is for Disney to see that LOTS of people are visiting it. As we all know CoP is not exactly the first attraction most people run for when they get to the Magic Kingdom. If all of us who really love CoP can get just a couple more people to visit it each time we go that would increase the odds that it stays open. Of course that is still no guarantee that it will stay open but it can't hurt.

[WDWfanatic742]

How was the COP extra fastpass program working with crowds? Was it bringing in more people to the ride or did people just discard them? I didn't see or recieve any fastpasses to it on my last couple of trips. On a good day you can get half of the theather full and if they would actually advertise the thing just a little more it would get the attention it deserves.

If they wanted to move the ride, Epcot would be perfect for it since it deals with how technology and how everything has progressed through the years.

[WDW_Obsessed]

I would be soooo sad if CoP closed!:sad: Maybe I'm naieve, but I would also be very suprised. It seems like CoP is a tradition that imagineers would preserve. I hope so!

[Frog]

Is there a COP at Disneyland?
Which one is the "Original"?
just wondering...
I think it is a cool ride too, but we have to admit that it is pretty corny...
"It's a great big beautiful tomorrow..."

[SignguyTom]

Why do they have to replace anything to put in a new ride? Wasn't part of the reasoning for purchasing 40+ square miles of land to never be restricted for expansion?

[SignguyTom]

Is there a COP at Disneyland?
Which one is the "Original"?
just wondering...
I think it is a cool ride too, but we have to admit that it is pretty corny...
"It's a great big beautiful tomorrow..."

The COP at Disneyland was moved to WDW and the location at DLR became "America Sings." It is currently Innoventions, with many of the America Sings characters residing in Splash Mountain at DLR. :thumbsup:

[lockedoutlogic]

I thought Walt specificly requested that CoP stay in operation? Well, I supose if he did request that and if they did want to replace it with something else, I guess they could always move it to a different park, Paris or whatever, I think his request was only that it stayed in Operation right?

Walt Disney....seemed to never think he would die....but beyond that, he had rapidly progressing lung cancer that killed him within a short amount of time after it was discovered....he didn't actually have enough time to really take care of any of his affairs.....his brother had too

So by all accounts...it would've been highly unlikely that he had any standing orders on how to use theme park rides....remember that the Carousel had only recently arrived in California when he died in 1966....and WDW was swampland with barely a bulldozer moving at the time....
I don't believe there is any way that he "requested" or ordered anything about one thing in all of his dealings....

Disney has been hesitant to remove anything with original Disney stamps ever since....hence perhaps the perception that they are acting on somekind of marching orders from walt disney...

By all the accounts I've seen...Disney was consumed by his EPCOT city and the Mineral King Ski Resort in the time leading up to his death...

morale of the story: don't smoke:thumbsup:

[lockedoutlogic]

Why do they have to replace anything to put in a new ride? Wasn't part of the reasoning for purchasing 40+ square miles of land to never be restricted for expansion?

the service areas of the parks at WDW ring the outside of the existing park footprints...therefore ride "sprawl" is not a feasible option....

There's also operational expenses, staffing, maintenance and a bunch of other issues that become greater as expansion proceeds...

So no....adding without subtraction is not a workable plan.

[Speedy1998]

So no....adding without subtraction is not a workable plan.

Actually right now it is a possibility, because they replaced 20K with something Pooh's playground which is so much smaller, and was supposed be temporary when it was built.

I love COP, but IMHO it should be moved to FutureWorld. I have always thought it would make an excellent addition to an expanded Universe of Energy pavilion.

[lockedoutlogic]

Actually right now it is a possibility, because they replaced 20K with something Pooh's playground which is so much smaller, and was supposed be temporary when it was built.

I love COP, but IMHO it should be moved to FutureWorld. I have always thought it would make an excellent addition to an expanded Universe of Energy pavilion.

The 20 K lagoon is a big sore spot for me....they replaced an original ride with....well...nothing....very cheapskate, in my opinion.
One can only hope that they would one day correct that....

I like your idea about moving the carousel to EPCOT...but they seem to have permenantly abandoned the edu-tainment type ride systems in favor of more "thrill" based rides.....

we'll see:secret:

[Tekneek]

I thought Walt specificly requested that CoP stay in operation? Well, I supose if he did request that and if they did want to replace it with something else, I guess they could always move it to a different park, Paris or whatever, I think his request was only that it stayed in Operation right?

I don't want to sound too cynical, but I doubt that Disney would keep something running only because Walt Disney wanted it that way.

[TheRustyScupper]

1) CoP is my absolutely favorite attraction.
2) I would hate to see it removed/replaced.
3) But, I am realistic
. . . they don't keep it up very well
. . . maintenance on the ride is abysmal
. . . there has been no real period-updating
. . . there are few people visiting

IMHO: I would like WDW to update and maintain the exhibit. I think that would draw in more people. However, I have little faith in that happening.

[CaptainSad]

They can expand. The support buildings can be torn down and move further away from the parks. I'm in constuction and there isn't that much of a problem. You can aways reroute roads,pipe's, wire's,etc. Yes it costs some money but it can be done. You don't need that much imagination to figure it out. They got Space Mountain outside the Railroad tracks after the fact didn't they?

[poeticeclipse]

No way, Jose!

There is a reason Walt wanted this attraction to always stay. It's a symbol of the American family... of how it develops and grows with each new generation. We live in a world now where people are losing touch with the concept of "family." CoP gives hope that no matter what changes around us and how advanced things become, tomorrow is just around the corner.

[Mandalorian30]

1) CoP is my absolutely favorite attraction.
2) I would hate to see it removed/replaced.
3) But, I am realistic
. . . they don't keep it up very well
. . . maintenance on the ride is abysmal
. . . there has been no real period-updating
. . . there are few people visiting

IMHO: I would like WDW to update and maintain the exhibit. I think that would draw in more people. However, I have little faith in that happening.


I agree with everythign you said here. CoP is one of my all-time Disney favorites, and I would be crushed if it did close. But that doesn't mean it's not also in need of a little care and update.

I also agree with everyone who has suggested moving it to Future World. If they decide that it absolutely has to leave MK, at least move it to FW. Don't close it, please!

[animalkingdomguy]

Walt Disney was first and foremost a businessman. WDW is in business to make money, but given the history of the COP I can't imagine dumping Walts signature and favorite attraction. That would be a great insult to the memory of this great man. Besides, it is still popular and draws guests. I'm voting that this rumor is unfounded.

[Mackflava99]

I trully dont want it to go- we need to protest :)

Change is good but so is tradition and the mix is important.
COP is such an icon, so much history and it was so far ahead of its time when it was built-

it would be a shame to lose that- it invisions what Walt's dreams were.

[MegaDisney]

Walt wanted this attraction to always stay.

Is there some documentation about this? A quote perhaps?

I love COP and don't want to see it go, but I am curious as to the basis of the above information.

[jszczur5]

I trully dont want it to go- we need to protest :)

Change is good but so is tradition and the mix is important.
COP is such an icon, so much history and it was so far ahead of its time when it was built-

it would be a shame to lose that- it invisions what Walt's dreams were.

Yeah, let's all protest like we did with the changes to the DDP. Should work out just fine.
CoP is one of my favourite attractions in all of the parks. Even my pre-teen sons don't complain when I suggest going to CoP for the third time in a trip. Their only stipulation - "Don't sing".
Which I do - 'cause I can. Besides, it's one of the few tunes which can drive "It's a Small World" out of your head.
I would have no problems with them moving the attraction to Future World. And, in fact, I would prefer that they back-date the final scene to reflect the 70's or 80's, as this is the only scene which isn't nostalgiac, and therefore, seems out of place. But to close it forever - NO!!!

[DDuck66]

How was the COP extra fastpass program working with crowds? Was it bringing in more people to the ride or did people just discard them? I didn't see or recieve any fastpasses to it on my last couple of trips. On a good day you can get half of the theather full and if they would actually advertise the thing just a little more it would get the attention it deserves.

If they wanted to move the ride, Epcot would be perfect for it since it deals with how technology and how everything has progressed through the years.

We got one of the fast passes in October and went over and used it right away. The ride did seem to have more people on it, and there were several newbies that admitted that they had never been on it before. Just remember "there a great big beautiful...."

[lockedoutlogic]

They can expand. The support buildings can be torn down and move further away from the parks. I'm in constuction and there isn't that much of a problem. You can aways reroute roads,pipe's, wire's,etc. Yes it costs some money but it can be done. You don't need that much imagination to figure it out. They got Space Mountain outside the Railroad tracks after the fact didn't they?

I'll give you a look behind the curtain:

the 20K lagoon site...which everyone assumes could be blown out and expanded for space...has a nice little arrangement behind it...

First is "Gate 3"...which is the main entry and exit point for 10,000 magic kingdom employees...buses constantly roll in and out of there doing drop off and pick ups...it is also the main entry point into the utilidor system

beyond that is access road that disappears between the contemporary and space mountain and ends up coming out at the Grand floridian

also back there are warehouses...a paramedic center...the main fireworks launch banks....retention ponds to offset the water table disturbance cause by the magic kingdom's construction...then Disney University-the main employee training center....a gigantic cast parking lot...(the only cast parking lot).....and the "roundhouse" where the WDW monorails and trains are held and serviced....
not to mention this is the primary point where all the food, concessions, merchandise, costumes, horticulture and basically every necessity is loaded into and out of the magic kingdom

and there is a good old fashioned road that connects the uber high end communities of Windermere and Bay Hill to the Lake Buena Vista Area....

Adventureland is backed up on the Grand Floridian....Tommorrowland wedged between the Contemporary, Bay Lake, and the service areas aforementioned


So how, exactly.....would it be easy to knock down the fences and blow out the footprint of the park? just curious

[Barndog]

As much as I love CoP and would hate for it to go away, WALT AND HIS IMAGINEERS DID NOT DESIGN IT TO LAST THIS LONG.

First of all, remember it was originally built as a temporary exhibit for a World's Fair (although it was always slated to go to DL afterwards.)

The show was built with four rooms: 1900's, 1920's, 1940's, and the finale which, in the original show, it was the 1960's. Each room neatly spanned two decades, or one whole generation.

It was bad enough in WDW's early days when the attraction abruptly jumped 40 years from the 1940's to the 1980's.

But now there is 60 year gap between the last two scenes (1940's-2000's). That's the same time difference covered by the ENTIRE ORIGINAL SHOW (1900's-1960's).

Yes, CoP is a classic. But since it is about the passage of time, the attraction is not at all "timeless".

What will doom CoP is its real estate in Tomorrowland. It simply doesn't fit the theme (and, other than when it was at Disneyland and ended with the trip up to the model of EPCOT, it NEVER HAS fit the theme). And with each passing generation, it becomes less relevant.

Realistically, Disney is not going to build a new moving Carousel theater elsewhere in the resort. My only hope is that when it is eventually dismantled, the sets are relocated in their entirety to a Walt Disney museum (like "One Man's Dream" or whatever is planned for the new DCA). Or maybe they could be rethemed and incorporated into a future Epcot attraction. (Imagine a completely redesigned "Universe of Energy" with ride vehicles passing the four CoP sets while demonstrating how electricity has impacted each generation.)

[goofy for pluto]

Has anyone else noticed that there is no real attention given to the entrance of the attraction, and because of the short wait time you hardly ever see much of a line in front.
I really think if they added a new sign and some information at the entrance explaining that this was Walts view of how the world has changed. that the attraction could draw more visitors.
We Love the CoP and hope that it is always a part of MK. A trip to WDW would not be the same if it was not there. :mickey:

[azcavalier]

Has anyone else noticed that there is no real attention given to the entrance of the attraction, and because of the short wait time you hardly ever see much of a line in front.
I really think if they added a new sign and some information at the entrance explaining that this was Walts view of how the world has changed. that the attraction could draw more visitors.
We Love the CoP and hope that it is always a part of MK. A trip to WDW would not be the same if it was not there. :mickey:

I agree with this. I had heard about this ride, and had been to WDW three times before I even NOTICED it. I even had a bit of a time figuring out where the entrance was. But I dragged my DS and oldest DD on it with me, and i'll drag the DW on it in April because she's never seen it. I thought that it needed to have more attention drawn to it.

[BMan62]

How's this...Put CoP under a major rehab - cut the auditorium and stage size by 1/3, add two new scenes and have it reflect the entire 20th century with a nod in the final scene (2000+) to future technology?

So, the scenes would be 1900 - '10; '20 - '30; '40 - '50, '60 - '70; '80 - '90; 2000+

This would probably shut down the ride for 12 - 18 months, but it would once again be reflective of what Walt imagined it to be.

Whether they kept it in MK or, possibly, moved it to EP (Wonders of Life Pavillion?) could be determined once the rehab plans were Imagineered.

[LarryBoy]

I guess I'm in the group that thinks they won't do away with COP. These rumors have been popping up for decades, I just think it's an untouchable. That being said, I do think it is way past due for a major rehab. With many of the classic attractions getting major rehabs recently: HM, PotC, SSE, IaSW, and I think SM is next. Perhaps CoP is on the list also. I don't think they need to totally redo it, just clean and rehab the first three scenes and then do a new and improved, updated and cool final scene.

[Speedy1998]

I'll give you a look behind the curtain:

the 20K lagoon site...which everyone assumes could be blown out and expanded for space...has a nice little arrangement behind it...


It was another poster that said you could tear down buildings to expand. I simply stated there was a ride that had a big footprint that was replaced with a playground (which was supposed to be temporary). I would bet you could squeeze at least two atractions in the foot print left by 20K.

Actually if you look at the satelite photos on the internet, the foot print left by 20K is bigger than Mickey's toontown fair, and almost as big as Fantasyland. Also from the Satelite photo I can see tons of empty space just outside the traditional boundries of the park. Just need a little imagination to get guest over to it. I mean that's why going over a waterfall was incorporated into the original (DL version) POTC, the imagineers had to figure out how to the ride under the railroad tracks and outside the boundries of the park.

[Speedy1998]

Or maybe they could be rethemed and incorporated into a future Epcot attraction. (Imagine a completely redesigned "Universe of Energy" with ride vehicles passing the four CoP sets while demonstrating how electricity has impacted each generation.)


This would be neat, but why stop at four, if they do that the should recreate the 60's and 80's scenes so you can see electricty being used through the entire century.

[Jeany031]

I love Cop! I really love the Incredibles!

[lockedoutlogic]

It was another poster that said you could tear down buildings to expand. I simply stated there was a ride that had a big footprint that was replaced with a playground (which was supposed to be temporary). I would bet you could squeeze at least two atractions in the foot print left by 20K.

Actually if you look at the satelite photos on the internet, the foot print left by 20K is bigger than Mickey's toontown fair, and almost as big as Fantasyland. Also from the Satelite photo I can see tons of empty space just outside the traditional boundries of the park. Just need a little imagination to get guest over to it. I mean that's why going over a waterfall was incorporated into the original (DL version) POTC, the imagineers had to figure out how to the ride under the railroad tracks and outside the boundries of the park.


Oh...I'm not debating that they have in fact expanded in the past beyond the original plans.....

but given the huge amount of infrastructure that does rim the disney parks in florida...it is not realistic to think that they would devote the funds to do anything like this anytime soon

They are in the midst of a billion dollar rework of California Adventure (one that will most likely fail...in my opinion) and that is roughly the cost of a new themepark...it certainly exceeds what they spent to put that "park" there in the first place.

So while the extra space given back to the MK from the 20K lagoon site...the most we can hope for is a small expansion of fantasy land or maybe a new big ticket attraction (which has been in the rumor hopper for a longtime...Fire Mountain)....even the "green" space that you see behind the lagoon site is actually the firework fallout zone....which is basically a hazmat type site filled with parts of pyrotechnic shells....

Almost everything you see on a satellite shot has some function....don't forget that WDW was built on a swamp...and to build on a swamp you need retention ponds to deal with the diverting of the ground water....so many things that appear to be "undeveloped" are actually serving an extremely important function and are...in fact....already spoken for

But you seem to have a handle on it....so this isn't really a direct response for you...just an fyi to those who typically say "just expand"...it's just not that easy.

I would think that any addition to MK at this time will either be in the old 20K lagoon spot...or the carousel of progress....as they are the two most underutilized locations in the park as it now stands

[DisneyDD2]

well put, lockedoutlogic. i am impressed with your knowledge of disney park happenings.

[wdwfansince75]

First, CoP has always been a "must do". Most trips start with POTC, and end with CoP. (Usually after one last ride on SM). But frankly, on each last ride, I leave by saying "Fare well" to an old friend, not sure if we will meet again. I would be sad to see it go, but just as other dear friends to whom I wished "Fare Well", I will always have the memories. Just as with Horizons, I will get over it. And I visit sites like Walt Dated World to visit other old friends.

However, as with the Air Force B-52, most people who ride it are riding something older than themselves. Most of them would almost certainly enjoy what replaces it more than they do CoP. On my last few trips, I do CoP more for the nostalgia than for the thrill. It's almost like visiting friends in "The Home". Neither of us is what we once were. Perhaps it is time for something new.

I appreciate the arguement that support facilities occupy space that would be necessary for expansion. Sounds like it comes from the logies...but the cost of moving those facilities would be considered in any cost benefit analysis. Such "Best use" considerations are routinely used in renewal programs. Take a look at the implosions and new, best use construction all along the Las Vegas strip.

I will conceed that not all change is good. Few think that Stitch is better than any of its predecessors. But the design, and much of the infrastructure, is approaching 40. If they are not working considering a significant upgrade, or replacement, they are eventually just going to mothball it....and it sits in prime real estate.

How about this dream....Upgrade the ride infrastructure.....keep the first scene....then have dioramas of the family visiting MK over the years....perhaps one scene riding the Swan Boats, and one with Mr. Toad's wild ride....or watching the Main Street Electrical Parade....and close with the family back home, planning their next WDW trip......

[lockedoutlogic]

well put, lockedoutlogic. i am impressed with your knowledge of disney park happenings.


always been a hobby....but it didn't pay too well when i tried to "go pro" :mickey:

[gresh00]

Disney should never close ANYTHING!! With as many visitors each and every year for the past 35 years, everyone's got some rides they miss. And if they do close CoP, it will just be another attraction to add to the list.

I know that having the newest and latest draws attendence, but part of the magic is the recalling your last trips over and over again in your head the week before you go again. It makes me so sad to do it anymore because of all the stuff that's gone from my childhood. With all the money us loyal them park fans have given them over the years, I think they have a duty to preserve some of these old rides, even though they might not get the crowds that they used to. They're Disney, how hard would it be for them to move any defunct ride into a Retroland style park? Like a graveyard for old rides - ONLY - they still work!

I would gladly pay double, triple the admission to get to go on rides like Dreamflight, world of Motion, Horizons, etc. . again.

[MinnieMommie]

Disney should never close ANYTHING!! With as many visitors each and every year for the past 35 years, everyone's got some rides they miss. And if they do close CoP, it will just be another attraction to add to the list.

I know that having the newest and latest draws attendence, but part of the magic is the recalling your last trips over and over again in your head the week before you go again. It makes me so sad to do it anymore because of all the stuff that's gone from my childhood. With all the money us loyal them park fans have given them over the years, I think they have a duty to preserve some of these old rides, even though they might not get the crowds that they used to. They're Disney, how hard would it be for them to move any defunct ride into a Retroland style park? Like a graveyard for old rides - ONLY - they still work!

I would gladly pay double, triple the admission to get to go on rides like Dreamflight, world of Motion, Horizons, etc. . again.

You just brought back one of my fondest memories...Dreamflight. I absolutely loved that attraction! Actually loved Horizons as well. :mickey:

[WorldsFairEpcot]

I have heard rumors for years that a HUGE E-ticket attraction was going in at Tomorrowland' where COP is, and including the old skyway terminal, and the tomorrow land stage. It has been many moons since I have been over to the MK, so skyway terminal may no longer exsist, as well as tomorrowland stage. Help me out folks with that one. COP would fit nicely, and be right at home in Epcot. It could easily fit somewhere in the Innoventions buildings, either east, or west. It is indeed a classic, and deserves to be saved.

[DigitalDaredevil]

If the closed COP, what's next? I think it would really damper my interest in visiting as they are either removing or ruining great attractions with too much frequency.

[lockedoutlogic]

I have heard rumors for years that a HUGE E-ticket attraction was going in at Tomorrowland' where COP is, and including the old skyway terminal, and the tomorrow land stage. It has been many moons since I have been over to the MK, so skyway terminal may no longer exsist, as well as tomorrowland stage. Help me out folks with that one. COP would fit nicely, and be right at home in Epcot. It could easily fit somewhere in the Innoventions buildings, either east, or west. It is indeed a classic, and deserves to be saved.

Both the stage and the skyway stations (one in tommorrowland, one in fantasyland) are still there

the skyway stations are a sore spot for me...I can see them taking rides out for maintenance or appeal issues....but don't leave empty buildings.....that looks very budget

[BirdsOfPreyDave]

Let's move it to Future World to replace the Wonders of Life Pavillion. Because it could never draw the crowds that would justify the cost, though, there would need to be some innovative thinking involved. Since we're moving and updating it, add a few more scenes to cover the eras that are skipped between the 60's and 21st century.

It can be the pre-show for some new Epcot thrill ride. You get in the theater, see the progress of the American family over 100 years, and when you've made the full circle your in the line for some theme-related thrill ride.

Any suggestions on what thrill ride might tie in? Maybe a time machine ride to the future -- they could even use the Body Wars ride with a new movie.

Ok, where do I send my application to work at WDI?

[Coleby]

as of right now, I am going to put this on as I will believe it when I see it. Like others have said, we have been hearing this one for a long time. I think that is what originally brought me to intercot.
I like the idea of moving it, but, I don't agree that EPCOT is the deserving place, to me it just doesn't fit in. But thats my own opinion.
They need to update the ride of course, it has needed that for a long time. They did put a fresh coat of paint, and a new sign a few years ago.

Sadly, as much as I like this attraction, I don't see it sticking around much longer. but I do agree, do something with the skyway loading dock, I mean, the waterfall is great, but really??

[LudwigVonDrake]

I hope they keep Carousel of Progress. It's one of my favorites! :mickey:

[Mackflava99]

It would be silly to remove it- we need to keep some legacy stuff around- and this one has way too much history and meaning- it was a fav of Walt-

Please don't remove it !!!

[Mickey91]

Disney should never close ANYTHING!! With as many visitors each and every year for the past 35 years, everyone's got some rides they miss. And if they do close CoP, it will just be another attraction to add to the list.

I know that having the newest and latest draws attendence, but part of the magic is the recalling your last trips over and over again in your head the week before you go again. It makes me so sad to do it anymore because of all the stuff that's gone from my childhood. With all the money us loyal them park fans have given them over the years, I think they have a duty to preserve some of these old rides, even though they might not get the crowds that they used to. They're Disney, how hard would it be for them to move any defunct ride into a Retroland style park? Like a graveyard for old rides - ONLY - they still work!

I would gladly pay double, triple the admission to get to go on rides like Dreamflight, world of Motion, Horizons, etc. . again.
I agree. And, these older attractions aren't hurting the attendance. 10 of Disney Theme parks are in the top 13 worldwide! How much more can you want???

[GothMickey]

I have heard rumors for years that a HUGE E-ticket attraction was going in at Tomorrowland' where COP is, and including the old skyway terminal, and the tomorrow land stage. It has been many moons since I have been over to the MK, so skyway terminal may no longer exsist, as well as tomorrowland stage. Help me out folks with that one. COP would fit nicely, and be right at home in Epcot. It could easily fit somewhere in the Innoventions buildings, either east, or west. It is indeed a classic, and deserves to be saved.

This rumor pops up every once in a while. Even though it hasn't happened, doesn't mean Disney didn't think about it. This is one I will file away as rumor until Disney announces something. However, why shouldn't Disney close rides and replace them? Some rides just don't stand the test of time. Popularity dies out, better ideas come along. If Disney didn't close and replace rides, then all we would have is a broken down museum. It would cost more to maintain 30 year old rides than to build new, state of the art attractions. And let's not forget about competition. Do you want Universal to have the best rides while Disney's rot? I don't think so.

[JPL]

Not saying this will never happen since CoP is a maintenance nightmare since all the parts have to be custom crafted. But I wouldn't put a date on it just yet and information from a few years back that really fueled this rumour had to do with an agreement reached about CoP being moved to the Smithsionian if and when it closes at WDW. There was even some concept art floating around of how it would be configured with a stationary stage and guest walking around from scene to scene. Add to that around the same time the attraction went seasonal and then on limited hours. This rumour pops up every time people thing Disney has hot ne under utilized property that could make for an interesting attraction ie. The Incredibles. It's basically people speculating on how Disney can utilize the Skyway area and Tomorrowland Theater which while the theater does not offer daily entertainment options for guest it is the only facility available for special events in the MK. I have noticed several choirs and dance groups performing at this location over the years as well as it being used during MVMCP.

[ccp1]

... It's basically people speculating on how Disney can utilize the Skyway area and Tomorrowland Theater which while the theater does not offer daily entertainment options for guest it is the only facility available for special events in the MK. I have noticed several choirs and dance groups performing at this location over the years as well as it being used during MVMCP.

The Disney's Magic Music Days program has really taken off over the past few years, and while it's true that it is a seasonal activity, during the months of February-May there are literally dozens of bands, choirs, and dance teams from across the country performing on WDW stages every day including the Tomorrowland Theater (for quite a nominal fee :) ).

Recently, Disney has created 2 additional school music festivals, Festival Disney, and The Disney Honors. While both of those festivals take place at various resorts (like the Saratoga Springs Performance Hall), directors try to add a Magic Music Days performance onto the trip, to give the kids the opportunity to actually perform in the parks.

My groups have performed with Magic Music Days 4 times over the last 10 years, and I can tell you that there is such a great demand for performance opportunities, there is actually a shortage of performance slots for groups that want to participate. That is why they have the seasonal temporary stage in Tomorrowland (near the SM entrance), as well as one in EPCOT (overlooking HISTA). Things look even tighter as work goes on at the ABC Theater at DHS.

Unless Disney replaces it with another temporary seasonal stage somewhere in MK, I don't see anything happening to the area of the Tomorrowland Theater.

[Jasper]

I've said it before and I will say it again; there is only one way to have any hope of keeping any attraction open and that is by having large numbers of people visiting it. So for anyone who loves CoP or any other attraction that is in danger of being closed, visit early and visit often, and bring your friends!!

Of course even that doesn't always keep attractions open if the maintenance costs become way out of line or if the technology becomes totally obsolete and is unable to be upgraded.

[GothMickey]

CCP1, Disney will be building an enclosed theater in Hollywood Studios for events such as this. Think of the old Hunchback theater. Now think of it as enclosed hosting these kind of events. Yep. That is what has been discussed as being in the pipeline. If Disney does go through with enclosing that theater, then there is no need for Galaxy Palace Theatre.

[ccp1]

CCP1, Disney will be building an enclosed theater in Hollywood Studios for events such as this. Think of the old Hunchback theater. Now think of it as enclosed hosting these kind of events. Yep. That is what has been discussed as being in the pipeline. If Disney does go through with enclosing that theater, then there is no need for Galaxy Palace Theatre.

That sounds like a great addition, but what I was getting at was that, on any given day during February-early June, there are usually at least 4-6 school groups performing at:

- Galaxy Palace Theater,
- Temporary Tomorrowland Stage,
- Cosmic Ray's Starlight Cafe Stage,
- Future World West Stage,
- Future World Fountain Main Stage,
- American Adventure Capital Dome area,
- Dock Stage at Downtown Disney,
- 2nd Stage at Downtown Disney,
- the ABC Theater,
- Performance Hall at Saratoga Springs,
- Recital Hall at Saratoga Springs,
- even the Motion Stage at Pleasure Island.

And, Disney seems to be promoting these school music performance opportunities more than ever. As a choral director that has had the "please, don't cut our performance time because you over-booked the Galaxy Palace that day and now you need to cut groups"-conversation with Magic Music Days staff, I think they are successfully growing a program that needs more stages, not less.

(Gosh, I feel like I just went on a tangent from the original topic. Sorry folks... I love CoP, and get there every visit.. ok, back on track!)

[lockedoutlogic]

That sounds like a great addition, but what I was getting at was that, on any given day during February-early June, there are usually at least 4-6 school groups performing at:

- Galaxy Palace Theater,
- Temporary Tomorrowland Stage,
- Cosmic Ray's Starlight Cafe Stage,
- Future World West Stage,
- Future World Fountain Main Stage,
- American Adventure Capital Dome area,
- Dock Stage at Downtown Disney,
- 2nd Stage at Downtown Disney,
- the ABC Theater,
- Performance Hall at Saratoga Springs,
- Recital Hall at Saratoga Springs,
- even the Motion Stage at Pleasure Island.

And, Disney seems to be promoting these school music performance opportunities more than ever. As a choral director that has had the "please, don't cut our performance time because you over-booked the Galaxy Palace that day and now you need to cut groups"-conversation with Magic Music Days staff, I think they are successfully growing a program that needs more stages, not less.

(Gosh, I feel like I just went on a tangent from the original topic. Sorry folks... I love CoP, and get there every visit.. ok, back on track!)

A stage that is predominantly used for high school groups passing through town would not impede disney's development plans...if it stood in the way

They would find somewhere to put the high school groups if they wanted the programs to continue

But high school groups don't add profit to the parks...so they do it as a service more than anything....

IF they were going to use the stage to build something they could market to attempt to lure repeat customers back from all over the country/ world......

then the wrecking ball would already be swinging....


that...and as stated before...the theater sits empty far too much for them to even give it a second thought if something was in the works....

[johnO]

DW and I love the CoP. But one thing that none of us can stop is the fact that "time marches on", the very thing CoP depicts. If it isnt updated, it will lose relavence. The previous poster who suggested adding scenes is on the right track. If it were to be moved I think the Wonders of Life pavillion would be perfect for a "new and improved" CoP.

Take HISTA for example. In my opinion it's a classic. But kids nowadays don't hardly know or even like Honey I shunk the kids. The film looks way too used and old. It WAS once fantastic but today looks very outdated and tired. If it is to stay relavent then they need to create a new and improved film to keep people interested. Otherwise the crowds fade.

As we get older the newer generations have different tastes, desires etc. that need to be appealed to (however, I think Nemo, stitch and a few others are WAY TOO overdone at WDW) in order to keep people visiting.

The classic characters and exibits can still be relevent if they're presented in a way that can appeal to both us older folks, who want to keep tradition alive, and the younger generations at the same time.

:mickey:

[BrowncatP]

NO, NO, No!! CoP is a oldie but goodie. Disney needs to just update it a little.

[NJ Camper]

Why move COP only to put it at wonders of life then build a new ride where COP was why not refurb COP then build new at wonders instead ??????? would seem to make more sense to me

[goofy for pluto]

I do not think that the ride needs to be redone at all. The fact that they redid the last scene is what dates the ride the most. It is a look at how people thought the future would look, and
there is nothing wrong with that concept. I think Walt would be sad. He wanted the park to be where families could have fun together. He did not believe in talking down to children. What Disney fears most about looking to much like a kiddie park when compared to the other theme parks is exactly where they are taking it.
Look at Spaceship Earth and what they did to the Living Seas as proof. :(

[raysulak]

I think this rumor is just being confused with the return of The House of the Future...

Disney brings back the House of the Future -- with help from Microsoft and HP
Posted Feb 13th 2008 10:44PM by Nilay Patel
Filed under: Misc. Gadgets



The Disney parks have been getting all kinds of upgrades lately, and the latest is the revival of the "House of the Future," which originally opened in the 50s and showcased such space-age household technologies as microwave ovens and plastic furniture. The new attraction eschews the original's pod-shaped exterior, pictured above, for a more traditional look, but it's inside where the action is: Disney, Microsoft, HP and LifeWare spent over $15 million on hardware and software designed to give visitors a glimpse of a hyper-connected future. Tech on display will include home automation, automatic networking, Surface and touch-based computing, and smart appliances -- all things the designers envision as being five to 10 years away. The new House of the Future is set to open in May at Tommorrowland -- any guesses how long it takes before someone builds a complete replica?

[firefan43]

I know I am going to get flamed here, but I have to say it. I cant stand the CoP. That song is horrible (which makes me sad because Walt himself wrote it), and its a "ride" that I could do without ever seeing again. I agree that Disney needs to keep some of the old MK intact, but also think that the CoP space could be used for something better.

[bruin1344]

COP seems like it belongs in EPCOT rather than tomorrowland. Its very similar to spaceship earth. If they want to use the space in MK, move it to EPCOT, dont get rid of it

[bruin1344]

I know I am going to get flamed here, but I have to say it. I cant stand the CoP. That song is horrible (which makes me sad because Walt himself wrote it), and its a "ride" that I could do without ever seeing again. I agree that Disney needs to keep some of the old MK intact, but also think that the CoP space could be used for something better.

hahaha, thats how i feel about small world

[johnO]

Well it seems that the biggest problem people have with it is the fact that the last scene is out dated now and the gap between it and the previous scene. If the last scene was redone to resemble what people think the world of tomorrow will be like now, then pehaps people would like it better..

[senderella]

"It's a great big beautiful tomorrow..."
Who has never gone to COP and then sung this the rest of the day?
It's great!

[Horizon93]

I love CoP. An update, done well, with respect to the original would be fine and in line with what I humbly imagine would be Walt's concepts.

But never, never, never, replace CoP!

[joanakaylene]

i will be DEVASTATED if they get rid of CoP. It's such a classic piece of the Magic Kingdom. I can't believe more people don't go see it.

It always looks like its shut down, even when its not! Perhaps if they got some more CMs out there to promote it, people wouldn't walk right by it like its an empty building.

[NJ Camper]

Replaced would mean something taking its place whats taking its place????

[Rodders]

These rumours always upset me :( I'd hate to see COP go :(

[Mackflava99]

I know I am going to get flamed here, but I have to say it. I cant stand the CoP. That song is horrible (which makes me sad because Walt himself wrote it), and its a "ride" that I could do without ever seeing again. I agree that Disney needs to keep some of the old MK intact, but also think that the CoP space could be used for something better.

You are entitled to your opinion, but you have to think deeper too- its something built long ago that you just need to realize was soooo far ahead of its time, it was something unheard of. Now we say its old, but its there to let us think back to how much improvement Disney has done and how much of the dream has been maintained. We need to keep it open if only to insure the historical aspect is maintained.

P.s. my kids love the song and my wife hates it so they bug her about it all the time.

[Mickey91]

I would hate to COP close. But, Disney doesn't seem to care what anyone else thinks. They will do what ever the $$$$ dictate. :(

[Disney_Barbie]

Sorry to beat a dead horse, but am I alone here? Does no one else ever remember reading about Walt's wish to keep it in operation?
I was quite confident that someone else would come along with the details of it. Surely I didn't make it up, and I never read any lame guidebooks or stupid fake disney "rumor" websites, so I think I must have gotten my info from a reliable source... if only I could remember when/ where it was!
From memory, I think he said it WAY back eithe while it was in the world's fair or when it was in Disneyland. And if I remember correctly there was a bit of a contreversy about bringing it over to WDW. But then that was decided it was ok, because, as Walt's wishes stated, it would still be operational, just now in a different park.
Ring any bells for anyone?