The problem with bus transportation

[merciantinkerbell]

On our first trip last year my husband used his own manual wheelchair. He's not confined to it BUT is in constant and at times severe pain due to his conditions, using a wheelchair enables us both to enjoy our days out more no matter if its WDW or shopping. We used Disney buses a few times and yes felt guilty about getting on first BUT I stood rather than took a seat because that seemed fair. One time coming back from MK we couldn't take one bus as the driver hadn't got the keys for the ramp so had to wait another 20 mins or so. So, swings and roundabouts. There will be those who take advantage of the system but many, like us, who don't

[Dulcee]

This is really such a tough issue that can get people very very .

We used the buses exclusively on our '09 trip. Prior to that with my family we always had a car. After the '09 trip we rented our car for our '12 trip and will have our own vehicle in '14 again.

I agree it can be frustrating watching scooter after scooter load before you. I try very hard to remind myself that not all disabilities are visible and that not every person who requires a scooter at WDW requires them at home. But being human, and honest, I admit it can get you after a while. I'm also sure there is some abuse, which is unfortunate for those who truly need the extra help.

More frustrating was when I was standing holding a screaming, overtired 1 year old nephew on the way home and not one able bodied person could offer us a seat on a 10pm bus. As childless adults on our trip now we both go out of our way to offer seats to parents with kids or older individuals.

But all of this is why we primarily use a car now. Its just not worth the added aggravation. I don't like judging people I see in scooters, at the end of a long day it can get the better of me. Taking our car avoids that issue.

[MississippiDisneyFreak]

The tone of your thread indicates you think everyone on a scooter is able bodied and simply taking advantage of getting in the bus first. Well, my mother is a cancer survivor who's had surgery on both feet although she has a wheelchair at home rents a scooter when we are at Disney. By looking at her you wouldn't necessarily know her condition so don't automatically assume everyone on a scooter is able bodied. However we don't mind waiting in line if that's the policy and while I don't agree with allowing a huge party load with the scooter I am not going to send her off on her own either. Now for the grown adults sitting while you are holding a small child that is their poor character and not the fault of the person in the scooter

[Goofy4TheWorld]

Ok, and finally, scooters and wheelchairs must be loaded first. It is the only way to safely do it. The bus has to be empty because of the tightness of the aisles. So scooters and wheelchairs will always be loaded first and therefor having them wait in line simply doesn't work.

Bologna, scooters are loaded on packed buses all day, every day, at the Grand Floridian after the bus has already picked up guests at the CR and Poly before stopping at the GF on its way to DHS. There are many other instances where shared-route buses load scooters with people already on the bus (practically every Deluxe resort as well as most moderates have multi-stop routes where this occurs daily).

The solution to this problem is so simple, yet it amazes me how Disney appears unwilling to do it: One line for buses, period. There should not be a separate que for scooters, just make sure all que lines are wide enough for scooters, and everybody gets in the same line. This way if a scooter person wants to load the bus first, they can simply move aside and wait until they are in the front of the line for the next bus, as well as if an able-bodied man who just WANTS to sit down with his stroller, wife, and two exhausted kids and is willing to wait for the next bus, well he can do that too. The way it is now, there is NO guarantee of a seat even if you are willing to wait for the next bus three buses to pass you by.

[Jared]

Right. I think everyone understands that scooters need to be loaded onto an empty bus. Nobody has an issue with that.

I think what upsets some people is that Disney's practice is to load scooters first regardless of the queue that may have accumulated well before the scooter arrived. In other words, there could be 100 people waiting for a bus for 20 minutes, but if a guest in a scooter rolls up as the bus is arriving, he and his party are entitled to board ahead of everybody who had been waiting.

The fairest way to do this is to have all bus queues be wide enough to accommodate scooters and wheelchairs. Then, one the bus arrives, simply count off. If a guest in a scooter and his party would be able to board that bus based on the number of people in front of them, allow them to board first.

If not, then they should have to wait for the next bus.

I'm sure it isn't as simple as it sounds, but it would certainly be a fairer policy.

[JerseyDad]

....other than the time that is eaten up to load the scooters ....I'm not sure if anyone mentioned that the scooter itself "eats up" 3 seats ...minimum. So, when a person with a scooter boards the bus ..and they are with one other person who's walking ...that means that 5 seats have immediately been removed from the bus ....now ...along comes a second scooter ...and maybe they have the rider + 3 people on foot. That's a loss of 7 seats. The scooters are securely strapped down and are quite stable when loaded on the bus. The rider should at least be required to sit on the scooter. I can't see any reason why they can't....and in the past have seen them sitting on it while the bus was in motion. It's not as if the scooter will go anywhere once the bus is packed with all those that were waiting on line...and have been deprived of a seat.

....and ...I really don't need to hear from all the scooter-defenders who in all honesty NEED their scooter. You know who you are ...you know (if you're really honest) that you need it ...your life would be in jeopardy if you didn't use it ...etc etc etc.

....but when I'm standing on a bus stop line at the end of a day at a park ...and the number of people on said line is approaching 250 (at closing time at EPCOT) ...and out of no where this scooter pulls up, and it's not your run of the mill scooter. This one has a canopy like a convertible and a big "let me put all my shopping bags in here" basket on the front ...and it's got decorative ice-cream bar shaped lights dangling off the canopy. And when it's got a second person accompanying ...and when on board, the canopy is taking up room too ......and then ...I see said scooter rider at the resort ....walking around perfectly fine and frolicking by / in the pool at some other time .....that's when I get miffed at the extreme abuse related to the scooters.

....so ...when those who have 'hidden afflictions" get all bent out of shape and get their hackles up when criticism is laid out ...it's understandable.

....just as it is understandable that when I'm taking a luggage cart through POP ....and 2 scooters ...with 2 women ...come flying around the corner near the baggage area (and they were flying) and nearly hit me because of the high speed at which they were traveling, I had every right to yell at them and say "Slow the he!! down". Because, the scooter riders HAVE to understand that just because YOU CAN go faster than the average person can walk ...YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO SO. You do not have the right to blow your little buzzer of horn or bell when you are trying to race the crowd to the buses after Illuminations has ended, because someone like me, who walks pretty fast, does not have the right to yell at someone in front of me who's walking slower than I am. (btw ...I had to wait for these 2 women to load their scooters once while at the bus to MK ...and saw them at the resort getting around all fine & dandy without them)

....so ...those that NEED the scooters ...no one is sitting in judgement of you. If you need it ...then feel good that they exist and are an assistance to you. But ....those of us that SEE the ever increasing use of scooters by people who's rationale to do so is because "WDW is big, and it's Florida, so it's hot ...and I'll be tired without one" ....have every right to be miffed, and critical of the expanding abuse that cuts into OUR enjoyment of WDW.

....yes ...those of us that do not need / use mechanical assistance to get around should feel 'lucky'. But at the same time we should not have to bend over so far backwards in the other direction to be so accommodating that the pendulum has now swung in the favor of those that blatantly abuse. Most good persons will accommodate others in need, but they don't want to feel used while doing so.

.....and ..to those that feel like they are being 'persecuted" ....don't be. Just say a thank you to all that take advantage of the system.


ps: let me add that I live near a major college campus and they provide free transport between campus locations. As such , I just noticed buses that have platforms located at the back of the bus that accommodate scooters and bicycles (I think they lower like a small electric elevator and can hold at least 2 scooters). This may be something that WDW could look into ...because at least it'll save some seats.

[The Hitchhiking Ghost]

Wow so many sitting in judgement of those on scooters

To be fair, I don't think people are passing judgement on those people using scooters, but more so the process of how Disney handles it.

We've all been in that situation, leave the MK at midnight, make you way down to the bus islands, find your queue and get in line with two kids passed out, a 3rd cranky, a stroller that won't cooperate and too many bags of souvenirs that you don't really need. After a 1/2 of waiting for buses, you look at the line and cross your fingers that the next bus is yours! Then just as the bus pulls up, someone pulls up on a scooter, no wait, and gets priority seating on the bus, with their entourage, and now your looking at your watch hoping, maybe next bus. Its a natural frustration and I can certainly see the perspective that the OP is coming from. That's why on our last trip, for the first time, we rented a car. We still took ME to/from the airport to POR, but rented the car on property, which was not only cheaper than at the airport, but saved on days needed.

As much as I understand what the OP is saying, there is another view. Not abled vs. disabled, but the original complaint tends to be more towards when parks are emptying. On our last visit, we took the car to MK but used the buses to get back to our resort for a afternoon swim. When we boarded the bus at POR to return, after a lengthy wait for it in the first place, it began its run around the resort. At its last stop there was a couple waiting that had a scooter. Guess what, the bus was full, other than for standing room only, so our driver had to tell them they'd have to wait for the next bus (keeping in mind not all buses accommodate the scooters). So who knows how long this couple had to wait for a bus that was empty enough that they could board.

Short of paying for more attendants to hand out boarding numbers at the bus stations, I'm not really certain exactly what can be done to make it a better system.

Maybe they should extend fastpass to the buses?

[Renfairwedding]

I use an electric wheel chair. As pointed out not every bus used has accommodation for scooters or chairs. I personally don't have a problem waiting as I have the only seat on the line. Since the bus is limited to on how many EV's it can carry so if they don't load every trip you get a serious back up. I have waited over an hour for a bus to have room to get me back to the resort.

And to point out in most cases we are the last off when we get to the resorts.

As for ridding. Only wheel chairs are allowed to ride in place. We are set with a seat belt Scooter riders must transfer to a bus seat for safety.

[DVCJohn]

Here's what happened far too frequently when we used the bus system the first year. We walked back to the bus stops at the end of the day, with me carrying the exhausted seven year old. We'd wait 15-20 minutes in line. Finally here comes the bus. We're looking forward to getting on and getting the boys back to the room and in bed. Just as the bus pulls up, someone on a rented scooter pulls to the front of the line. They have 5 ppl with them. And we have to stand there waiting longer for them to load the scooter while the rider and their party goes and selects their seats. And what do you know- here comes another scooter. Process repeats itself. By the time all the scooters are loaded and everyone in the party seated, now we can load. But even though we were fourth in line, we have to stand with our kids because the seats are up for scooters and the remaining are filled with the scooter parties. This isn't right. I can see giving priority for wheelchairs, but not for rented scooters. They need to wait in line like everyone else, or have to ride buses specifically designated only for scooters. After getting bumped last year following a twenty minute wait while waiting to go to Magic Kingdom because there wasn't enough room on the bus after all the scooters came rolling out of the Pop Century lobby when the bus pulled up, we just drove to the parks after that. It's a shame because the bus system would be wonderful if not for the way the scooters are given priority. I know we're not the only ones that feel this way.

I am sorry that you had an additional wait for a bus but you need to understand the situations of people on the "RENTED SCOOTERS" before you spout off.
My father is 89 years old. He had damage done to his right leg during WW2. He is unable to walk long distances. I rent a scooter for him so he can get to the buses and from the buses to the parks without major difficulty. We have waited for buses when we could have been first on but the cue was backed up with people waiting longer than us. For my part, I typically stand on the bus so that I am not taking additional seats away from the individuals that give us dirty looks for having the gall to bring a scooter on to a bus. I know Intercot's policy about not being confrontational but this really ticks me off. Walk a mile in someone else's shoes.

[DonaldDuckUSA]

I agree with those saying we should just be happy and celebrate that we're healthy enough to walk. On my vacation, I either tell myself that it's not worth it to get so upset, or I try to beat the crowds, and that's all you can do.

My biggest frustration is this:

I would rather wait and stand then have to be on a scooter. The scooter people would rather be scooter free. The problem I see is when women by themselves or holding a child are standing and men and teenagers are sitting there and not offering their seat. I have given my seat and have seen other men give up their seat but not enough of them do it. Elderly people I have seen standing while a teenager sitting on his can care less. That I believe is the problem.

I WAS GOING TO SAY THE SAME THING! Gentlemen just don't offer their seats anymore. What gives, fellas?

[mechanic]

A lot or good caring people out here who have been raised well. Who would give up their seat for a woman or elderly person. But I think the problem is growing, and really I like the idea of having scooter users wait in line like everyone else. Just like toilet facilities, the handicapped stalks are open to anyone, the buses are open to anyone as soon as there is room. There is rarely a scooter condition that would require you to be first on the bus.
Aslo disturbing is the number of scooter rental ads that have popped up actually advising people
"You don't have to be disabled to rent a scooter"
either way, I will still ride the bus, and I will give up my seat like my dad taught me to. (Though at 52 I sometimes have people offering me a seat!)
I will be happy I can get around on my own.

[Goofy4TheWorld]

What gives, fellas?

The 60's.

I am an able-bodied 32 year old male, and I often given my seat up (actually I just don't take a seat up to start with most of the time) when it isn't a biggie for me. Of course often times if I do not take a seat up in the first place, someone half my age will take my seat for me, so nobody "needy" benefits unless I sit down first then decide to evaluate the folks around me and decide who "deserves" it more than me. However on my last trip there were times when my wife was fighting our exhausted two year old while I was wrestling the "Cadillac stroller" I should have left at home, I got to a point where I felt like I deserve a seat too, and if someone else wants a seat, they can just wait for the next bus, something I have done more than once when a seat was a must for me (although the whole scooter discussion does factor into waiting for the next bus...).

[TheVBs]

....but when I'm standing on a bus stop line at the end of a day at a park ...and the number of people on said line is approaching 250 (at closing time at EPCOT) ...and out of no where this scooter pulls up, and it's not your run of the mill scooter. This one has a canopy like a convertible and a big "let me put all my shopping bags in here" basket on the front ...and it's got decorative ice-cream bar shaped lights dangling off the canopy. And when it's got a second person accompanying ...and when on board, the canopy is taking up room too ......and then ...I see said scooter rider at the resort ....walking around perfectly fine and frolicking by / in the pool at some other time .....that's when I get miffed at the extreme abuse related to the scooters.

....so ...when those who have 'hidden afflictions" get all bent out of shape and get their hackles up when criticism is laid out ...it's understandable.

....just as it is understandable that when I'm taking a luggage cart through POP ....and 2 scooters ...with 2 women ...come flying around the corner near the baggage area (and they were flying) and nearly hit me because of the high speed at which they were traveling, I had every right to yell at them and say "Slow the he!! down". Because, the scooter riders HAVE to understand that just because YOU CAN go faster than the average person can walk ...YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO SO. You do not have the right to blow your little buzzer of horn or bell when you are trying to race the crowd to the buses after Illuminations has ended, because someone like me, who walks pretty fast, does not have the right to yell at someone in front of me who's walking slower than I am. (btw ...I had to wait for these 2 women to load their scooters once while at the bus to MK ...and saw them at the resort getting around all fine & dandy without them)

OMG! I know you're genuinely miffed, but you had me doubled over laughing at this! I needed that. Thanks.

So, having read other responses, I can understand why people get frustrated with what seems like a flawed system. If you're not in a scooter you may be seeing people who appear to be, or actually are, abusing the system. But you may not be seeing a person on a scooter having to wait for several buses before one can take them. You may also not be seeing the level of abuse they're taking because they don't "look" disabled. It's possible that Disney is running the bus situation as best they can.

We're happy to use the buses and happy that we are able to stand and walk. Of course, we know that we may have to wait for more than one bus if there are large crowds, scooters or if we want to make sure we can sit. For us it's worth it to drop those car keys and not have to worry about driving. If that ever changes and we're not ok with the bus system as is, we'll start driving to the parks.

[MississippiDisneyFreak]

I am sorry that you had an additional wait for a bus but you need to understand the situations of people on the "RENTED SCOOTERS" before you spout off.
My father is 89 years old. He had damage done to his right leg during WW2. He is unable to walk long distances. I rent a scooter for him so he can get to the buses and from the buses to the parks without major difficulty. We have waited for buses when we could have been first on but the cue was backed up with people waiting longer than us. For my part, I typically stand on the bus so that I am not taking additional seats away from the individuals that give us dirty looks for having the gall to bring a scooter on to a bus. I know Intercot's policy about not being confrontational but this really ticks me off. Walk a mile in someone else's shoes.

Well said ...we would actually rather wait in line with everyone else just to avoid getting the dirty looks. Believe me my mom would rather be physically able to do without the scooter and then the hate yes hate she gets from strangers makes her feel worse. I'm sorry but she deserves her vacation too..

[Lizzie]

Do they have a maximum number of scooters that can be loaded on the bus? I understand they need to load up first. Its to difficult to fit in and get in safely in if they wait in line with everyone else and try to load on with other people.

Maybe if they had a maximum number of scooters on the bus and a maximum number of people that can accompany the scooter.

[Arielfan98]

This happens all the time every year. I think they should have a designated bus for scooters/wheelchairs only to keep the lines moving.

[JerseyDad]

Do they have a maximum number of scooters that can be loaded on the bus? I understand they need to load up first. Its to difficult to fit in and get in safely in if they wait in line with everyone else and try to load on with other people.

Maybe if they had a maximum number of scooters on the bus and a maximum number of people that can accompany the scooter.

....there are 2 "sets" of 3 connected seats that can be flipped up to accommodate a scooter ...so I'm sure they limit it to 2 scooters per bus. I've never seen more than that.

[Susan A]

"This happens all the time every year. I think they should have a designated bus for scooters/wheelchairs only to keep the lines moving. "

I think having a separate bus would be considered segregation, versus inclusion.

[Arielfan98]

"This happens all the time every year. I think they should have a designated bus for scooters/wheelchairs only to keep the lines moving. "

I think having a separate bus would be considered segregation, versus inclusion.

I see your point. Did not mean to offend any one I was just thinking in terms of what other users have said about needing assistance, but not wanting the dirty looks.

[GoBlueLacheta]

Yeah the 100s of people in line get kinda uppity when they are loading my golf cart onto the bus with flags and rims and fridge off the back.

No but really, this seems like more of procedure issue for Disney rather than a people issue at least over the course of 365 days the park is open. Yes, some clowns take advantage, but far more utilize scooters etc. properly. Just like the schmohawks who drive in the HOV lane by themselves.

ADA laws really have Disney handcuffed so theres nothing thats going to be dramatically done as far as the abusers.