Shame on you Disney

[markyv]

Just got back from 7 days in WDW and I am extremely disappointed in Disney surrounding the character meet and greet for Anna and Elsa. 3 to 4 hour wait times are not uncommon. DW and DD waited for 3 hrs and 15 minutes to meet them. Only one park has meet and greets, and countless little girls are being disappointed by not being able to meet them. For $100 a person a day, I expect more from Disney than this.

Fast Pass plus is also a major bummer for those people who like to wing it at the parks. Don't expect to get a single fast pass for an e ride attraction if you are a day guest or someone who doesn't like to plan. I feel really sorry for first timers. To me, at least the old fast pass system was fair, now it is not due to non planners and first timers having to wait stand by while others zoom through the fast pass line. At least the old system rewarded guests who arrived early and got the fast passes for the rides they wanted. Better do weeks in advance now or wait.

[markyv]

Eric,

I see what you saying, but I disagree. Dining reservations are totally different than fast passes. If I want to wing it for dining, then you are correct that I shouldn't expect a reservation, by calling the day of my park attendance. However, with a fast pass system that is fair and works, I could absolutely expect to get a fast pass the same day for just about any attraction I wanted. As a matter of fact, I can't remember a single in all my past trips that I wasn't able to get a fast pass for any ride or attraction that I wanted one for.

Say what you will about lines for Anna and Elsa, but Disney is disappointing a lot of small children who are wishing to meet Anna and Elsa. The children who are getting to meet them, have angry and frustrated parents. Again, for $100 per day per guest, I expect more from Disney. Give me value for my money and I will keep coming back. Spending 4 hours in line to meet your princesses is not a value, we only did this to keep our daughter from being disappointed. There are ways to reduce this wait time.

Add extra greetings and eliminating fast passes are a couple that come to mind.

[gerald72]

Gotta say I disagree with you on both points.

I hear there isn't just one Anna and Elsa meet and greet- meaning you might not get the same pair that the people in line behind you get. But they can't have multiple meet and greets for the same two characters in the same park at the same time. It kills the illusion.
You can't fault disney for having an attraction that is extremely popular. That is a good thing.
Do you suggest they build 2 Toy Story Manias or 2 Mine Trains?

Why do you fault fastpass+ for not benefitting the non-planners? Fault the non-planners for not planning. Do you spend thousands of dollars for your vacation and then just show up, without having read a thing about the place? Everybody's gotta do a little research, and if not- great to those that do.

[mickeyman42]

You seem to be saying the old "First come, first serve" system was better; I don't, for that very reason. Some of us don't come first, and on vacation, some of us don't want to.

I would agree with this. I'd rather book a few fp's 30 days out than race to the parks at 9 and then literally race people to get fp's or else, not ride anything at all, TSM for example. The first come first serve system IMO rewards "craziness" for lack of a better word. it rewards people who are wiling to line up/show up way too early for things in order to be first, or get more fp's. I find the new system to be more fair, than the old system where people would horde fp's all day, collect about 30, then use them later in the day (before the return time was enforced) thats when I felt bad for non-planners and first-timers, because then they didn't know the choice was "show up for rope drop or sacrifice your day in that park."

[Reedy Creek Buccaneer]

I will tackle your Fastpass+ complaint first. I still don't think we have seen this system in all its glory yet. I still envision where we will get to plan our whole day, including those who are not planners. The day where we arrive at the park, decide we want to ride this, this and this, and eat here. And the wonderful computer spits out our schedule.

As far as the Frozen characters go, we all have choices. Your daughter chose to wait for them, just like I may choose to wait 3 hours to ride Space Mountain. Is either the right choice? Probably not, but that is what was important to each individual.

I don't know how many young women are playing the Anna and Elsa characters at WDW, but they may not have enough to provide them at the other parks.

[JRocker]

I agree, the line for the frozen meet and greet is insane, but really; what is the solution?
Disney won't have more than one meet and greet of the same characters in the same park. As has been mentioned, this would kill the illusion.
Having a frozen meet and greet in all four parks will only result in one thing: A three hour wait at four different parks.

As far as the FP+ destruction of spontaneity argument; I never bought into it. You aren't bound to a schedule by some invisible chain of zip ties. If you want to change plans on a whim, you are capable of changing them. Sure, you may not be able to get a fastpass for Soarin' because you decided alter your plans, but that doesn't mean you can't ride it. It's not FP+'s fault that we refuse to stand in line for over XX minutes.

And don't forget, in most cases, first timers thought you had to pay for the old fast passes. The first timer that fails to plan today is really no different than the first timer who failed to plan two years ago.

[Katzateer]

Since the Frozen characters have proven to be so popular I think Dsney needs to step up and make them more available. A co-worker who is a seasoned WDW visitor waited over 4 hours with her 9 year old sister. It isn't just the little kids that want to see them.

A character meal at Epcot, a meal outside the parks and maybe another meet and greet. Give the fans what they want. For $100 a day park admission it seems WDW could make these characters more available.

As far as FP+ I like the new system. I think they will continue to improve it. While not perfect, I think if you really want to ride or see an attraction, you can. With the old system, I went several trips not being able to get on Toy Story Mania and Peter Pan ( no FP's available ). With the new system, I have gotten on each time.

[Main Street Jim]

I think Dsney needs to step up and make them more available. A co-worker who is a seasoned WDW visitor waited over 4 hours with her 9 year old sister. From what I have seen and read, the sisters had only been available from 9am - 5pm. Now, they're available all day long, until the park closes. Hopefully, that will relieve some of the long lines.

[texas211]

I agree with Mark, I truly dislike the FP+. I think it doesn't allow for impromptu decisions based on weather, crowds, etc. I may book my FPs x-months out for Epcot. That day may be a rainy day. I prefer to go to MGM on rainy days.

But nothing we can do about it. Stuck w/ it, and all these are gadgets people "must" have now. I hate the bracelets in general.

Well, there is always DL.. J/K... That is truly a nightmare.

[Septbride2002]

I would agree with this. I'd rather book a few fp's 30 days out than race to the parks at 9 and then literally race people to get fp's or else, not ride anything at all, TSM for example. The first come first serve system IMO rewards "craziness" for lack of a better word. it rewards people who are wiling to line up/show up way too early for things in order to be first, or get more fp's. I find the new system to be more fair, than the old system where people would horde fp's all day, collect about 30, then use them later in the day (before the return time was enforced) thats when I felt bad for non-planners and first-timers, because then they didn't know the choice was "show up for rope drop or sacrifice your day in that park."

Bolding mine

I have to agree! We are riding Soarin for the first time in several trips because I refuse to race there just to get a shorter wait time for fast pass. Now with the ability to plan a few months in advance I know we will have the chance to ride the ride. :D

[Bruegge]

I would agree with this. I'd rather book a few fp's 30 days out than race to the parks at 9 and then literally race people to get fp's or else, not ride anything at all, TSM for example. The first come first serve system IMO rewards "craziness" for lack of a better word. it rewards people who are wiling to line up/show up way too early for things in order to be first, or get more fp's. I find the new system to be more fair, than the old system where people would horde fp's all day, collect about 30, then use them later in the day (before the return time was enforced) thats when I felt bad for non-planners and first-timers, because then they didn't know the choice was "show up for rope drop or sacrifice your day in that park."

Totally agree, isn't rope drop just really "One More Line" to wait in....

The stress of getting there on time just to wait, then run and get the fast pass for the ride YOU ARE STANDING IN FRONT OF RIGHT NOW!!! never was fun, good or looked forward to by my family.

[markyv]

Totally agree, isn't rope drop just really "One More Line" to wait in....

The stress of getting there on time just to wait, then run and get the fast pass for the ride YOU ARE STANDING IN FRONT OF RIGHT NOW!!! never was fun, good or looked forward to by my family.

I have never arrived at rope drop, and again, I have never been turned away from getting a fast pass for TSM, Peter Pan, or Soarin. I have found fast passes available for these rides as late as noon......granted they were for late in the day, but still I was able to get them. Some people like me, don't even decide we want to go to to Disney in 60 days advance notice. What does the AP pass holder or Florida resident do? If you live in Orlando, should you have to plan your day trip to Disney well in advance of going.

Also, I never suggested multiple meet and greets in one park, but you can't tell me you can't have 1 line with multiple rooms/sets of characters. You also can't tell me that they can't incorporate Anna and Elsa into a character meal or add another meet and greet in Epcot. This will not just add another 3 hour line. It will give patrons a choice of where to see the characters and will result in shorter wait times.

[SBETigg]

I've heard about the wait times for Anna and Elsa, and I agree with you that it's not good. My kids are older and this doesn't affect me, but I wouldn't want to be the parent that tells a young fan, "no, sorry, the line is too long." I think they need to add Anna and Elsa meet and greets in other parks/locations.

Also, yes, spontaneity is compromised with the new FP system and first time visitors who want to see it all (or as much as possible) should plan ahead. But for return visitors, I feel like I can still have some spontaneity. Your FPs can be changed and it's only the really major rides like Soarin that I might not get on without some planning. But, at this point, I'm okay with not riding everything on every trip. Or with waiting in line occasionally. And first time visitors should probably plan ahead anyway if they want to optimize their time, so... I actually really like the new system. No running here and there to get Fastpasses and then backtracking to ride later. I think once it's really tweaked and optimized, it's going to be great.

[VWL Mom]

The Anna and Elsa lines are insane but they are new too and I think Disney is trying to adjust. They did extend the hours recently and for all we know may be trying to find them an additional home. When they were first introduced I had read that because they are face characters they need to hire for that position. Maybe they just should have waited until they had enough positions filled.

As far as FP, we've used them and like them. Since I have an AP I just went and checked what was still available for a party of 4. There are quite a few still headliners available:

MK: All 3 Mts, Buzz, Jungle Cruise, Peter Pan
EP: Test Track and Mission Space are gone, Soaring is available
AK: EE, Dinosaur, Safari
DHS: TSM gone, RnRc, Tot, StarWars are available

Looking at it I think Epcot would be the only unsuccessful afternoon park for rides.

[big blue and hairy]

Personally I like FP+, I never was thrilled about running to a ride at rope drop either. I did it, but didn't much like it.

No offense, but why should I, who is willing to plan ahead and be more relaxed, have to give that up for someone who wants to "wing it". Try winging it in a large city for dinner just about anywhere, and you'll end up at McDonalds more often than not.

I use FP+ for Toy Story Mania, which I like, but is not my favorite ride, then DW and I walk back to RRC, and wait maybe 10 minutes and ride twice! Why would I want to give that up?

:sulley:

[Jillirose]

I have said it before, I feel sad for the first timers - people who dream about Disney, save and get there on the day with their children and discover that they can't get any fastpasses for the signature rides and the rides are 80+ minute waits. I'm sure many regulars are like me, and just showed up the first trip not knowing what to expect. I was able to ride enough of the big name rides that I wanted to learn more and return (again and again - eventually staying at Disney hotels). I guess they no longer need to cultivate these type of customers.

In some ways it feels elitist to me. The old way at least let anyone who got there a chance for a fast pass. Now, it's only folks who can afford Annual Passes and those paying to stay on campus. Say what you want, but a fastpass for Great Movie Ride is a joke.

I also miss the spontaneity - we actually enjoyed letting things flow - sometimes we scored fastpasses, sometimes not.

[yankeesfan123]

I have said it before, I feel sad for the first timers - people who dream about Disney, save and get there on the day with their children and discover that they can't get any fastpasses for the signature rides and the rides are 80+ minute waits. I'm sure many regulars are like me, and just showed up the first trip not knowing what to expect. I was able to ride enough of the big name rides that I wanted to learn more and return (again and again - eventually staying at Disney hotels). I guess they no longer need to cultivate these type of customers.

In some ways it feels elitist to me. The old way at least let anyone who got there a chance for a fast pass. Now, it's only folks who can afford Annual Passes and those paying to stay on campus. Say what you want, but a fastpass for Great Movie Ride is a joke.

I also miss the spontaneity - we actually enjoyed letting things flow - sometimes we scored fastpasses, sometimes not.


I felt bad for first timers BEFORE!

If the didn't know to show up at rope drop to run to TSM or meet anna and Elsa, they had no shot!

Now, they can comfortably book those experiences in advance!

First timers weren't experts who knew how to use the old system to its full potential.



Big picture:

There are pros and cons. Some pros are big for some people, some cons are bigger for others.

[big blue and hairy]

Disney certainly doesn't hide the My Disney Experience and Magicbands. You get tons of reminders about them.

:sulley:

[joonyer]

Here's my thoughts. (and worth exactly what you paid for them :D)
Disney Parks are a business offering goods and services for a price. Visiting them is a premium big$$ vacation compared to many other vacation options. Don't like what you're paying for? Vote with your wallet. Go somewhere else on vacation. We do that often.
No one is entitled to short lines for anything. We choose to visit the most popular theme parks in the world. And they are popular for a reason. But that makes them really crowded. And we still we elect to go there along with millions of others and we expect not to have to wait in long lines?
How dare they make us wait.

[Arielfan98]

My feelings are indifferent to the new FP+. I think the old one was fair and the new one is fair according to improved technology. Everyone has access to a computer nowadays and I think FP+ is fair. I don't understand how one can go to a park and say "Oh yea let's try SM today", it seems like even for those that aren't planners can figure out their favorite rides ahead of time and divy it up based on day, it's not a lot of work.

Secondly, I agree there is an issue with the Anna and Elsa meet and greets. Obviously they should incorporate more meet and greets in other parks. I do not think doing that would stress guests out because once word gets out, guests will recognize that they have more than one park to go to to meet Anna and Elsa. Someone also mentioned more character meals with them and I think that is a good idea. Furthermore, I think Disney should do more to make the line to meet the sisters more interactive/include characters to entertain the kids like Olaf or Kristoff or Hans while they wait in lines. Do trivia questions for the kids based on the movie on tv screens and have parents text the answer and see how many kids got the answer. There is always something Disney can do to make it easier to wait.

[IloveJack]

I remember one fan's famous poignant Twitter picture of Aurora standing all alone in her corner while a crowd surrounded A&E in the other, and as someone who didn't like the movie, that just seems like an injustice.


Just an FYI, they only allow one family in the room at a time. Hence, Aurora stood in the corner and watched my kids meet A&E, and then they stood in their corner and watched my kids meet her. No other guests were let in until we exited the room.

[wellsm]

I'm pretty sure that Disney has multiple rooms with multiple pairs of the sisters in them.

Just like they do at the Town Square Theater.

I'm sure that Disney doesn't like 3 hour lines. That's 3 hours you could be elsewhere in the park - having fun, buying food and merch.

I'm also sure there are only so many rooms they have for the M&G at the Princess Fairytale Hall, and so many CMs who can be A&E.

What else can they do?

More rooms? If they could, they would.
Decrease the experience time. I guess this would help, but after waiting in that line do you really want just 15 seconds with the characters?
Decrease the standards of the CMs so they can hire more? Nobody wants this. Do you really want your kids to say "What was wrong with Elsa?" Or, to have an inexperienced cast member who breaks character in front of the kids?


It's supply and demand. It's like the complaints I saw when the movie came out and Disney didn't have much out for merch in the parks and in stores. People wanted their stuff, and they wanted it now. What did they expect Disney to do - pull out their cloning device? :)

With Frozen being THE hot property right now they are doing what they can to meet a huge demand. I think Disney is doing a good job at meeting that need the best they can.

[princessgirls]

I see this more as a HUGE Demand problem, that Disney is adjusting too. They certainly do not want you waiting in line for 3 hours. Anna and Elsa are the new Queens of the Kingdom.
A friend of mine who writes for our Paper wrote a funny piece of how Anna and Elsa have dethroned the other princesses. His piece was fun.

There are always the "non-planners", that just show up, I often wonder how that really works out for them? How much time is wasted figuring things out while on site. My inlaws tour like this. THEY WASTE SOOO MUCH TIME!!! It makes me NUTS:thedolls:, so I don't do anything with them anymore.

The "Planners" can get a full out day in. Up and out early, they have their game face on, fast pass plus times and dining reservations made. Their plan is solid, but they can adapt to a change if necessary!!

We all have to adapt to the new system, and it will change as Disney tweaks it. It's here to stay! I have not yet experienced it, but I will use it to the fullest when I go back. For the money a Disney vacation costs, being a planner is the way to go!
Julie:mickey:

[Mrs Bus Driver]

Shame on Disney? Really, I once waited in a 3 hour line to take my DD on Rocket Rods at Dl. I did for my DD I could have easily skipped it, could have told her no. But when it comes to my DD, it was one of those experiences we shared. These days she won't wait more then 30 minutes. RRs was a little disappointing but we still had fun and we are still both Disney fans. :mickey:

[RunDMV]

Why do you fault fastpass+ for not benefitting the non-planners? Fault the non-planners for not planning. Do you spend thousands of dollars for your vacation and then just show up, without having read a thing about the place? Everybody's gotta do a little research, and if not- great to those that do.

And here is what Disney and you dont get. I plan, schedule, organize, direct all day long at work. I run from one meeting to the next while telling my office manager to schedule more meetings. When I am on vacation, I dont want to do that.

Oh yeah, there is one more thing Disney doesn't get: my money.

[Aurora]

Apparently Disneyland has debuted a Frozen "pre-parade" float that features Anna, Elsa and Olaf, so guests can at least see them in person if they don't want to wait in insane meet lines.

Personally, I figure out other ways for my kids to have a good time if a favorite character or ride becomes unavailable. (And to me, a 3-hour wait means they're unavailable. ;))

[joonyer]

And here is what Disney and you dont get. I plan, schedule, organize, direct all day long at work. I run from one meeting to the next while telling my office manager to schedule more meetings. When I am on vacation, I dont want to do that.



Me neither, but I don't expect to go on a vacation to any popular destination and be able to find a premium hotel room, or a table at a popular restaurant, or good seats for a Broadway show, without having made reservations in advance. Taking a vacation to any popular place takes lots of planning in advance if you want to enjoy the most popular attractions. Expecting Disney, maybe the most popular vacation destination of all, to be any different is being unrealistic.

[RunDMV]

I, OTOH, WANT to plan. I don't show up at the airport and buy my ticket day of flight, after all.
If I did want to "wing it", I wouldn't have gotten Free Dining plan six months in advance, to have my flights, room and meals all paid and waiting for me when I got there.
I do have to plan, or at least run for buses to keep schedules, and for me a vacation is letting me decide my own activities without the obstacles of the "real" world.
That includes private "appointments" with princesses and thrill rides.

Like we've been saying all along: Planning's a haul, but you reap the rewards. :cloud9:
That's the whole point. One used to not have to plan each meal out 6 months in advance. It got to the point for our family (2-3X a year visitors for 2 plus decades) just gave up on table service. This is just too much planning for us. You like it? Go. Ill pass.

Let's not even get in to the impossibility of meeting family at WDW and trying to coordinate vacations.

There will always be the never-say-die Disney supporters who will go no matter what. I'm not one of them.

[RunDMV]

Me neither, but I don't expect to go on a vacation to any popular destination and be able to find a premium hotel room, or a table at a popular restaurant, or good seats for a Broadway show, without having made reservations in advance. Taking a vacation to any popular place takes lots of planning in advance if you want to enjoy the most popular attractions. Expecting Disney, maybe the most popular vacation destination of all, to be any different is being unrealistic.

That's a silly analogy. No reasonable person thinks you dont have to make some kind off plan. But planning meals 6 months out and trying to plan rides that are blocked out before and after you ADR and then trying to coordinate it family and friends is too much for a lot of people.

[VWL Mom]

Just an FYI, they only allow one family in the room at a time. Hence, Aurora stood in the corner and watched my kids meet A&E, and then they stood in their corner and watched my kids meet her. No other guests were let in until we exited the room.

That right there would tend to slow things down. Perhaps Aurora needs to find a new home for the time being.

[yankeesfan123]

And here is what Disney and you dont get. I plan, schedule, organize, direct all day long at work. I run from one meeting to the next while telling my office manager to schedule more meetings. When I am on vacation, I dont want to do that.

Oh yeah, there is one more thing Disney doesn't get: my money.

Planning a vacation isn't unheard of. Disney World isn't the only vacation destination that you need to plan for.

Maybe a beach or cruise vacation (minus excursions, because that involves planning) will work for types like you?


Visiting Disney is like visiting a major city or another country.

You can't go to NYC, Vegas, London, etc and just show up and be able to eat wherever you want, see any show you want, or visit any museum or historical sites on a whim and plan to make an effective use of your time. You get dining reservations, buy tickets to shows ahead of time, and plan the best times to effectively visit museums/sites ahead of time.

[lindique]

Let's not even get in to the impossibility of meeting family at WDW and trying to coordinate vacations.



That was my problem too. On my last trip, I found out that 2 people from 2 other offices in my organization were going to be in Disney World at the same time as me. They live and work in different cities so I don't see them very often.

It was extremely difficult to arrange times to get together. First we had to be in the same park that day. And secondly, we had to find a time that no one had a hard-to-get fastpass.

I am not a fastpass+ hater. But it sure made meeting up with people not in your immediate group very difficult.

[DonaldDuck1117]

First, there are multiple rooms at MK with Anna and Elissa, just like Mickey up front. I will agree that there should be meet and greets with them at MK, Epcot, and Studios. It wouldn't make 3 hours lines at each location, it would decrease them overall. And yes, face characters are harder to cast but it's not impossible. With the size of workforce Disney has they can certainly find more women to play them.

I happen to love FP+. I'm a night person. We like to sleep in, get to the park around lunch time then close them down each night. FP+ allows us to do that and still get FPs for the most popular attractions. Before, if I wanted one for TSM I had to get up early and be there at rope drop. Now, I can sleep in and know I'm riding TSM with a short wait.

And, you know you can ride rides without FP. Just because you don't have a FP doesn't mean you aren't allowed to ride. In our last trip before FP+ there were no FPs left for Soarin and it was an 80 minute wait. I hadn't ridden Soarin the trip before so you know what I did? I got myself in line and waited my 80 minutes, just like old times. Do you guys remember those days? When there was no such thing as FPs? When if you wanted to ride X you got in line and waited how ever long it was.

If you want to wing it you certainly can. No one is stopping you. Get to the parks at opening, head to a kiosk, grab a FP, then go ride the popular rides while their wait is short. Or, come later and just know you are going to have a longer wait-just like old times.

FP+ and MDE aren't going anywhere. The system is already starting to show why it was developed in the first place-people are spending more because of it.

[AgentC]

That right there would tend to slow things down. Perhaps Aurora needs to find a new home for the time being.

I'm not sure if has happened yet but I did see it reported somewhere that Aurora was moving out of Fairytale Hall.

[Aurora]

That right there would tend to slow things down. Perhaps Aurora needs to find a new home for the time being.

For a second I thought you were talking about me. :blush:

[minnie04]

I have said it before, I feel sad for the first timers - people who dream about Disney, save and get there on the day with their children and discover that they can't get any fastpasses for the signature rides and the rides are 80+ minute waits.

I agree the "first timers" will have a hard time getting on all the rides they want, BUT if you are saving your money and making time to get to WDW. I think some planning has to go into it. I know when we first went back in the day we never had to plan anything (1992), BUT AGAIN times have changed and it's almost a must to plan out your days in the parks. If you know anything about WDW you know it gets crazy crowded all year now, so you should be planning at least most of your trip so you won’t be wasting time with a map wondering around looking for things to do...

The meet & greets are another story. I have never waited in a line longer then 30mins to meet a character for my kids (when they were small) I know as a parent we will do whatever it takes to make it happen for our kids. We have all been in this position. Disney need’s to work on this one. And make it right for all those little ones waiting in the HOT sun to say hello to A&E. Maybe they could make the lines fun by having some kind of entertainment for the kids (parents) to help with the wait. There is nothing worse than waiting in a line with a child that is super excited to meet someone and tell them they have to WAIT!!! Its torture on kids and PARENTS. By the time you get to the front you are disgusted and some kids are over it.... and their excitment has turned into crabby faces (not all ,but some) so the beautiful picture you were hoping for has changed into a :mad: :sad: :humph: :pout: :rolleyes:
"Smile honey" PLEASSSSE...lol " I promise we are going to EAT & DRINK something as soon as we are done" I have seen this so many times. It almost becomes the parents mission to make sure that 3 hour wait wasnt in vain.. :mickey:

Or god forbid you make it to the front and they say " BLANK WILL BE RIGHT BACK THEY HAVE TO STEP AWAY"!!!!!!! are you KIDDING ME :thedolls:

[MNNHFLTX]

My family and I have never been into the character meet and greets, so I'm not up on this stuff, but can't people get a FP+ in advance for the Anna and Elsa M&G? If it is a must-do for a family and the standby lines are that long, why wouldn't folks just use their FP+ option?:confused:

I am an ardent planner by nature, but even I don't want to plan that much on my vacations (and if I did, my family probably probably commit mutiny). It appears that there are plenty of people out there who are finding positives in the system and investing in WDW trips, but I'm not one of them at the moment. I haven't been there in 1-1/2 years, which is a long time for me.


You can't go to NYC, Vegas, London, etc and just show up and be able to eat wherever you want, see any show you want, or visit any museum or historical sites on a whim and plan to make an effective use of your time. You get dining reservations, buy tickets to shows ahead of time, and plan the best times to effectively visit museums/sites ahead of time.I can't speak for Vegas or NYC, but you absolutely can go to London on a whim and see almost everything. Musuems are free and open to anyone (the huge national ones, anyway) and even the other historical sites you can pretty much walk-up and get in right away, especially if you get there early. You can get discounted tickets to some of the most popular theater shows the same day in Leicester Square. As far as the restaurants, the only ones you need reservations for will also be the most expensive; if you can afford to eat there, more power to you! ;)

[Terra]

Here's my thoughts. (and worth exactly what you paid for them :D)
Disney Parks are a business offering goods and services for a price. Visiting them is a premium big$$ vacation compared to many other vacation options. Don't like what you're paying for? Vote with your wallet. Go somewhere else on vacation. We do that often.
No one is entitled to short lines for anything. We choose to visit the most popular theme parks in the world. And they are popular for a reason. But that makes them really crowded. And we still we elect to go there along with millions of others and we expect not to have to wait in long lines?
How dare they make us wait.

This exactly. Sorry original poster. I DO understand the frustration, but at the end of the day it's the parent(s) choice whether to say yes or no to the line.
I've said no. There have been a few tears, but life goes on. So much more to do there. Personally I think it's silly to wait that long in line, especially if the child is young enough to not have the concept of time down, THEN get irritated and say my kiddos were grumpy, I was grumpy, etc.

Disney is a business at the end of the day. Like this poster said, don't like it, vote with your wallet.

For us, living local, we still take actualy vacations there AND do day trips. We plan accordingly. And generally I let my kiddos know up front if there is something we can't do [especially because I do have an ASD son] and he needs structure and to know what is happening before we get there.

[DisneyFan1979]

Personally, I feel that any good vacation requires a bit of planning. For Disney for me that has always meant thinking in advance about what park I'd like to go which day, which day I'd like to take off to visit area relatives or the outlets, do I want to take time for Universal, etc? From there I make some dining reservations, usually an extra one or two so if our plans changes I can cancel one. And now with Fastpass+ I also have to select some rides in advance. On my last trip, we really only used 1-2 Fastpasses a day to catch the biggest rides. Even then, our plans still changed. For example, I made fastpass reservations for afternoon at AK for the safari. It was raining lightly that day so instead I went to the safari as soon as I got there and just waited in line. It all worked out in the end.

This planning is no different from how I plan trips to other destinations. When I take trips to big cities, I plan what things I want to do each day to minimize travel time and to assure a nice balance of activities each day.

[AgentC]

My family and I have never been into the character meet and greets, so I'm not up on this stuff, but can't people get a FP+ in advance for the Anna and Elsa M&G? If it is a must-do for a family and the standby lines are that long, why wouldn't folks just use their FP+ option?:confused:


Yes, it is a FP+ attraction. When it first opened the FP+ were hard to get but now that they have the longer hours, it doesn't seem to be a problem except perhaps for guest who do not reserve until that morning.

I just played around and I can't get an Anna and Elsa FP for tomorrow (6/18) but I can get one for Thursday 6/19.

I do think when they should eventually add Anna & Elsa to one of the princess meals but I don't fault them for the lines. My daughter has not met Anna and Elsa yet because I generally do not do wait of more than 30 minutes for characters. Next time we go back if she really wants do meet them, I would FP.

[k10]

True, but then...who's IN a line? People obsessed enough to wait in it.
On one of the other Disney boards, we used to kid the fact that three-hour lines were creating empty lines at all the other attractions (except for the Mine Train and Be Our Guest): "Stay in line, suckers! Signed, Space Mountain Fans" :thedolls:

FP+, like it or not, is designed for things you absolutely couldn't leave your six-month-planned trip without doing. If you wanted to wing it, then you would face exactly the same problem as trying to find a reservation at Le Cellier on the spur of the moment, and if you could say, "Eh, lines too long, it's just the Frozen characters; there's just a twenty-minute wait for Rapunzel instead" then you wouldn't BE mad at Disney for "mismanaging" the lines.
I'm not going to argue with the folks who think they "have" to do M&G's with the two, but it certainly seems to be pinning blame on Disney for somebody else's problem.
(Yes, these are the things you can be liberated enough to say when you're not an obsessed Frozie.)

kudos to this

[k10]

I agree with Mark, I truly dislike the FP+. I think it doesn't allow for impromptu decisions based on weather, crowds, etc. I may book my FPs x-months out for Epcot. That day may be a rainy day. I prefer to go to MGM on rainy days..

I have to disagree w/ this, based on my experience in January.

Booked all our FPs prior to trip. Once down in Disney, didn't stick to a single one. We got to the parks, went to the kiosks to change them. Or we used our MyDisneyExperience phone apps to change them at will.

I always go into my trips w/ a plan and then audible on the fly once things get going. FP allows for this, in my experience.

And I have to add...

I was just scrolling through and saw someone write the phrase "...isn't fiar...". C'mon. Everything is "fair". If I am willing to wake up at 6, enjoy my resort, then take a nice leisurely bus to my park of choice for rope drop, it's not about fair. It's about loving the early morning park experience. Less people, no lines, no NEED to use a FP and then getting the most out of $100 for that day. And if, after I've been in the park and done all the high-traffic rides and I want to get a FP for it later, good for me. I've set myself up for the best possible day I can have and no one, not even Disney, is to blame if I hadn't. (***I'd also like to add that at rope drop, I am 100% opposed to running to attractions. I like my face and my teeth. I'll keep them in tact, thank you. I like to enjoy walking into the park, enjoy the view as I walk to TSM or Soarin' or the like. Running = an embarrassing accident waiting to happen.)

Honestly. It's like being at a family Thanksgiving and listening to all the late-arrivers wonder why no one saved them a drumstick.

[RunDMV]

Disney.....loves guests who are planning big family reunions of six people or more. I don't know about your own family, but on Disney's side, think you'll find them rather willing to provide a lot of multi-family planning options available.
(Back in the early 00's, they had a special private e-mail/chat app you could set up between the group, where everyone could e-mail, PM, and view each other's itinerary reservations, but that was during one of their earlier promotions, and think third-party technology has progressed since then.)
As long as they are all on ths same resevations, but you already knew that.

If my immediate family wants to stay 10 days at the poly and my sister's family can only do 6 days at the All Stars, forget about it.

[yankeesfan123]

I have to disagree w/ this, based on my experience in January.

Booked all our FPs prior to trip. Once down in Disney, didn't stick to a single one. We got to the parks, went to the kiosks to change them. Or we used our MyDisneyExperience phone apps to change them at will.

I always go into my trips w/ a plan and then audible on the fly once things get going. FP allows for this, in my experience.

And I have to add...

I was just scrolling through and saw someone write the phrase "...isn't fiar...". C'mon. Everything is "fair". If I am willing to wake up at 6, enjoy my resort, then take a nice leisurely bus to my park of choice for rope drop, it's not about fair. It's about loving the early morning park experience. Less people, no lines, no NEED to use a FP and then getting the most out of $100 for that day. And if, after I've been in the park and done all the high-traffic rides and I want to get a FP for it later, good for me. I've set myself up for the best possible day I can have and no one, not even Disney, is to blame if I hadn't. (***I'd also like to add that at rope drop, I am 100% opposed to running to attractions. I like my face and my teeth. I'll keep them in tact, thank you. I like to enjoy walking into the park, enjoy the view as I walk to TSM or Soarin' or the like. Running = an embarrassing accident waiting to happen.)

Honestly. It's like being at a family Thanksgiving and listening to all the late-arrivers wonder why no one saved them a drumstick.


Two things:

1. To your "fairness" point, I agree. Disney doesn't owe us anything. What one person views as "fair" might not be viewed as "fair" for another. The old system didn't work for a lot of people. Disney gives you this fast pass option and you can use it or not.

2. To your point about being able to easily change FP and such.... You went in January. The slowest time of year. Experiences may be different for people going in the summer or holiday season.

[waymickey]

My biggest problem and fear about the new FP+ is that I am not very tech savvy. I bought my first ever smart phone this year because of Disney. I just downloaded the app for MDE. That is as far as I got. I have no idea how to use it. I am worried that when I get there I will have no idea how to change plans or make new FP+ res. Before this it was pretty easy stick my key to the world card into the fast pass machine and out pops my FP.
Yes first timers were confused and they still will be. But now people who have visited over and over again may be confused too. I do feel that this puts some people at a disadvantage.

[VWL Mom]

I have no idea how to use it. I am worried that when I get there I will have no idea how to change plans or make new FP+ res. Before this it was pretty easy stick my key to the world card into the fast pass machine and out pops my FP.


There are kiosks available to make changes or add FP+. You will also find very helpful CMs with iPads around them. I was pleasantly surprised to see the amount of support staff out in August.

[ANG]

Big picture:

There are pros and cons. Some pros are big for some people, some cons are bigger for others.

Seriously.

People will complain either way

[k10]

Two things:


2. To your point about being able to easily change FP and such.... You went in January. The slowest time of year. Experiences may be different for people going in the summer or holiday season.

Marathon Weekend in January, though. But you might still consider that low occupancy compared to summer and holiday seasons.

[MargaretMessler]

I can't speak for Vegas or NYC

I was just in NYC this past weekend, the only things we planned ahead of time (and that was only less than a month) were Broadway show tickets and a guided tour of the UN facility. Everything else we did "on a whim", we didn't have a problem getting into any place to eat or anyplace else.

I absolutely expect to plan tours or special events months out for WDW, and I don't even mind making ADRs for meals, but the whole idea of booking FP+ months in advance seems like a little too much.

Perhaps WDW might consider "holding back" a certain amount of FP+ timeslots for day of reservations as a compromise. It's not like they will go unused, business is certainly booming

[CaptSmee]

From what I have seen and read, the sisters had only been available from 9am - 5pm. Now, they're available all day long, until the park closes. Hopefully, that will relieve some of the long lines.

This is correct so Disney is rresponding. My friend went to the MK earlier this yr and sprinted at opening to the line & saved about 3 hrs wait. No FP+, then get there early, just like any other majpr attraction. TSM FP were gone daily by 10 or 11 am with the old system. It isn't mismananagement, just ridiculous the popularity.

[Terra]

This is correct so Disney is rresponding. My friend went to the MK earlier this yr and sprinted at opening to the line & saved about 3 hrs wait. No FP+, then get there early, just like any other majpr attraction. TSM FP were gone daily by 10 or 11 am with the old system. It isn't mismananagement, just ridiculous the popularity.

Absolutely correct! I remember we didn't get to ride Soarin' for many months because by the time we got there between 9-10am, the FP was gone.

It really does boil down to sometimes you simply can't do everything or may have to skip something. OR decide it IS worth the long wait.

[thejens]

Love WDW, but come on- they have not succeeded unless the guests are having a good time. A three hour wait time is ridiculous. There are ways for lots of kids to see characters at one time and you don't have to have lots of different lines in the park. I feel quite sure that Micky is, um, multi-tasking, during quite a few of his photo ops.

If folks are paying a premium for the outstanding value of WDW, then WDW has failed if folks do not feel they are getting a good value. No one (well, no one should) expect WDW to be cheap. But everyone should expect their experience to be MAGICAL.

This is not MY standard, this is WDW's. Three hour line does not equal magical or even tolerable.

Step it up, Disney.

[Terra]

Love WDW, but come on- they have not succeeded unless the guests are having a good time. A three hour wait time is ridiculous. There are ways for lots of kids to see characters at one time and you don't have to have lots of different lines in the park. I feel quite sure that Micky is, um, multi-tasking, during quite a few of his photo ops.

If folks are paying a premium for the outstanding value of WDW, then WDW has failed if folks do not feel they are getting a good value. No one (well, no one should) expect WDW to be cheap. But everyone should expect their experience to be MAGICAL.

This is not MY standard, this is WDW's. Three hour line does not equal magical or even tolerable.

Step it up, Disney.

But theoretically where is it written that lines must be minimal wait in order to have a "magical" time?
Disney can't make people have a magical time if they don't have the right attitude going in. It's not up to Disney to decide how long the lines are. It's up to the people in the end. If the demand is high, FP are out, then the line may be long. So again people can choose to wait or not wait. That doesn't automatically negate the experience of actually seeing the character/interacting/riding the attraction/seeing it/etc of being magical. That is up to the person.

Example? I know good an well if I go to EPCOT on the fly and can't get a FP for Soarin' it's up to me to wait in the 70+ minute line. I've done it. And I adored the attraction just like every other time.

It's up to [general] you to decide what is worth it and what's not.

Another example. DAS [the new way] isn't the best system for my ASD sons. However, we still have a grand time! Because we choose to have a grand time.

Sure Disney is in the business of being magical. However they provide hundreds of things to do in each park. If someone is basing their whole vacation on just one thing for it to be magical, then honestly, that is 'user error' IMHO.

[minnie04]

Example? I know good an well if I go to EPCOT on the fly and can't get a FP for Soarin' it's up to me to wait in the 70+ minute line. I've done it. And I adored the attraction just like every other time.

I agree!! I was never able to get on Soarin' since it opened. I would never make that long line nor get up early to be at the park to get a FP only to be turned away since they were gone so early. Well in October last year we finally said "how long could the line really be?” and decided to wait :wait:.......and wait :whistle:...... and wait :bang: ... well finally we got on the ride and loved it. Was it worth the wait...not really (meaning if there were no FP+ we would never ride it again), but since there is a FP+ way to get on it. We will and have been back on it since then. Now we will only do big rides like that with FP+ AND make sure we pick a good time to be there for it. :mickey:

[Jack Skellington]

Just returned from our trip a couple days ago. We did end up seeing A&E and it was great. We were able to score FP+s for the line (acting on a tip on this board from another intercottee). We waited a grand total of 10 minutes. I can confirm they are using multiple pairs in multiple rooms in Fairytale Hall. And yes, we saw Aurora as well, and yes she waited while each group visited with A&E first.

Yes, there were lines, with times posted at 180 minutes at points during the week. We would have never considered standing in such a long line DDs 5 and 21 Mo. would have completely melted down. There were things we could not do, because the line was too long, TT for example. Others in our party did not get to ride TSM, because they got FP+s for RnR.

I do feel bad for first timers or others who don't take the time to plan and research. But, only for a moment. I am not staying on property and I somehow got an email stating that I was able to make my reservations when my 30 day window opened. Not sure how that worked, but it did. There are tonnes of advertisements for the new FP+ system and I believe they are on TV as well.

Would first timers know they had to be there at rope drop and then RUN to TSM or Soarin, etc? Same issue under the old system.

I really liked using the FP+ system and the Magicbands. Great way to skip the lines and get the most out of the day and NOT have to be there right for Rope Drop. We have small kids now, there's always something that stymies our grand plan to be leaving the room by 7:30am..... It's nice to know we already had our FP+s in hand ready to go. We ended up winging it a few times, changing our plans using the app and/or the kiosks. One day I think we got a total of 7 FPs including our 3 originals and 4 additionals afterward. My only gripe with the system is that more often than not, FP+ guests end up skipping all the cool interactive queue elements (HM, TM, 7DMT, SM, Pooh).

I can see other benefits to the new system. If you wanted to, it is possible to be at one park in the AM for Rope Drop and ride the top E-tickets, then go back to your resort for a nap/swim/recharge and then hit another park in the evening with FP+s in hand already. You could potentially do more in each day with a little planning.

I don't mind the planning, but even before non-planners or non-pre-researchers missed out on a lot.

To me, planning is half the fun!

JS:mickey:

[Disney Doll]

Let's not forget that they have already improved the Frozen meet and greet. When we were there in February they were in Norway without any fastpasss capability. Moving them to a fastpass area in MK is a huge plus. I feel like based on the popularity of the movie and merchandise outside of WDW everyone should expect Frozen to be a huge draw. That's the kind of thing you check into if your kid is gah gah for Frozen.

I actually think the current fastpass system works better for first timers. They are doing a lot more marketing to put the word out. The magic bands that come with the flash drive explaining the whole system are hard to miss. With the old system fastpass was something lots of newbies didn't know about. Many assumed it was a special perk not available to anyone.

[Daisy'sMom]

We use to love getting up in the am and deciding to go to Disney for the day. But first the ADR system made it almost impossible for us to enjoy a nice meal. Then the FA+! We have been discussing whether we should renew our passes next year. Especially since we went to Universal a few weeks ago and were able to have a nice dinner and the wait times were enjoyable. Reminded me of Disney past.:mickey:

[tiggerifictwo]

I think it is all about peoples attitudes. You can choose to enjoy your day whatever you are doing or choose not to. My family and I went to disneyland this year. It was much more crowded than we expected. We could have said well this vacation was horrible, we didn't get to do everything we wanted, disney *****. Instead we slowed down , got a bubble gun for my son waited in the lines we wanted to and watched countless kids and adults enjoying the bubbles. i watched people screaming and yelling at thier kids and eachother and i found it very sad. One cast member said to us I remember you guys you are always smiling. I was glad he remembered us but thought really why in disney are we remembered for smiling. Children and adults need to realise you are not entitled to anything. There does not have to be any fast pass at all, you may not be able to go on a ride or see a certain character. If you think disney is no fun don't go simple as that.