Custody and Visitation

[Disneyatic]

I don't post much, but I read all the time....I am having such a struggle that I feel like I need to post to see if anyone else has had the same struggles....this may be long....
My daughter is 13 1/2, for the first 12 years of her life, her dad was hardly involved. He never paid child support (although it kept accruing) and saw her only occasionally (even though there was a custody order).
About two years ago he got married and was not honest with his wife about the past, she found out the hard way when their bank accounts were frozen by the attorney general for child support....SHE (not him) decided that if they have to pay, then they were going to begin enforcing custody, so my daughter had to start going every other weekend, holidays, etc.
DD hates it, she doesn't like being forced to go and having no flexibility. The step-mom has had several outbursts where she is less than friendly (even calling her a curse word one time) to DD and she talks to her like a lawyer and not a child, telling her things that she doesn't need to tell her. Her dad just sits by and lets the step-mom take control of everything.
After a verbal (phone and text) confrontation yesterday with her dad and step mom, I have decided that I am refusing to let her go over there anymore and I have made an appt with a lawyer. I am worried that we won't be able to amend the custody and that she will continue being forced into a situation that it not mentally healthy and is very stressful for her :(

[Disneyatic]

I should add that the 'forced' visitation has been going on since September of last year.

[VWL Mom]

Even though I have no experience in this, I would think that any judge in his right mind would not force a child into a situation that is verbally abusive and detrimental to the welfare of the child. Hopefully the lawyer will give you more insight. My thoughts are with you.

[Itchy]

I would talk to an attorney and family service. Family services can investigate the mental abuse you have eluded to.

IMO no child should endure that if it is occurring.

[SBETigg]

Definitely consult a lawyer. But be aware that until the order is amended that any steps you take to stop her from having to go to her dad's could count against you. Proceed carefully. Have her keep notes and you keep notes of what happens when she's there and how she feels. Dates, times, anything to add details to your accounts. I completely understand your desire to protect your daughter and I hope you can straighten this out.

[Kenny1113]

Sorry to hear. I am not sure, but I think in some states kids are allowed to request which parent they wish to be with at 13. Hopefully the same would apply for custody. Good luck!

[BigB]

Sorry to hear that you are having such a difficult time. When my parents got divorced my younger brother was 14. The judge asked him what he wanted. The judge felt that my brother was old enough to have a choice.

Consult a lawyer, of course, and ask if they owe back support is your DD forced to go? I could be misremembering but a few other people I know were not granted visitation as long as they owed.

Good Luck!!

[ibelieveindisneymagic]

It sounds like you are going through exactly what we went through a few years ago.

We were in a similar situation. DD's father saw her once in a while (about 4 times a year), didn't show up for visition on a regular basis at all until he got remarried and they took him to court (finally) for not paying child support.

All of a sudden, they were taking us back to court for more visitation, time in the summer, holidays, etc. All of the paperwork was written by his new wife and DD was distraught. It was horrible. DD was only 10, so a bit younger, but she was clear that she wanted nothing to do with him in the least.

We did get a lawyer, and although it took a while, we ended up with a new custody order that gave DD's father no access at all. I know a lot of people would be concerned with that, but DD is happy, well-loved by a lot of people (especially me, her step-father who she calls Dad and her Grandma) and it really is for the best.

The hard part was in the middle we did have to have her go for some visits, but it really was for the best, because it showed how far gone the situation really was, and that it was beyond saving. DD came home from one visit and announced "I'm done. I'm never, ever going back again and no one can make me." She never did go back and it was all sorted at the next court date after that.

Take lots of notes, I had everything documented and it made a big difference as we went through the process. Get a good lawyer, and know that the court really does want what is best for the child, so it will work out.

I remember so well how this all felt, so I'm sending lots of support your way!

[kakn7294]

My sister has been going through some similar issues. Having the backing of a professional child counselor may help your situation but in the mean time, you have to still have her go because you refusing to send her can go against you in court and end up being even more detrimental to her situation. Good luck and keep us updated.

[stephicakes]

Wow – this really sounds very similar to what I went through as well. I’ll spare you all the details, but once I got married to my WONDERFUL husband 5 years ago, my DD’s bio father took me to court for visitation. I had sole custody and he was NEVER around but I guess my marriage woke “the sleeping dragon” and her bio father thought, “If I have to pay child support, I want to get my money’s worth” (apparently the $20/week court approved child support was too much for him!). Sad but true. I was a nervous wreck about it and could not imagine sending my teenage daughter to spend time with a man she did not know. We lawyered up and in the end it worked out for us because he was a no-show the next two court dates. Eventually because it was all about the money to him, he signed off on his parental rights and my husband adopted my daughter this past winter. My DD is currently 17.

Here is what I learned:

*I know you mentioned there is a custody agreement, but is there a visitation agreement? If so and you are not happy with it, you can request a “Modification of Visitation”.

*Ask the court for an “Attorney for the Child” or “Law Guardian” to be assigned to your child if you do not have one already (free in our court). This is basically a person that only works with your child (separate from you) to find out what the child wants and what is in her best interest. Then the court knows that the child’s words were not coached by either parent. This will be your best tool. Plus you can also buy time until the court gets your child’s input and may oppose temporary visitation until that is done.

*Refusing to let your child go to a court-appointed visitation will definitely NOT help your situation. I know you want to protect her and as heartbreaking as it is to let her go, refusing will only hurt your case. Comply as much as possible. Show the court you are holding up your end of the bargain. In our state, even "predators" in prison have a right to see their kids (our lawyer told stories of how kids are mandated to be brought to the jail for visits). Ugh.

*Is her bio father & step mom only money motivated? Do they really want to spend time with your daughter? Believe it or not, you may be able to negotiate with them without getting the courts involved. It sounds like they don’t want to pay support nor do they have the financial means to. If he signs over his parental rights, he will no longer be financially responsible for your daughter. If he does that, he no longer can demand visitation. I know how hard it is to be civil to them at a time like this, but “playing nice” may go a long way here. If you can angle it that you “want to help them out financially” and “make it easier on them” with the payments, you may be surprised what they are willing to give up (visitations) if they think they are making out better than you. Play the game.
I know every state is different so talk with your lawyer. Hopefully this helped as a starting point with questions to ask at your appointment. I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV :D

Good luck & feel free to PM me with any questions!
steph :)

[minnie04]

Definitely consult a lawyer. But be aware that until the order is amended that any steps you take to stop her from having to go to her dad's could count against you. Proceed carefully. Have her keep notes and you keep notes of what happens when she's there and how she feels. Dates, times, anything to add details to your accounts. I completely understand your desire to protect your daughter and I hope you can straighten this out.

Great point!! Be very careful how you approach this. Check out all the laws to make sure you can stop her on your own. They are obviously doing this on purpose. If he had no cares to be in her life before then they are just doing this because they have to pay now. With the hopes that you will get sick of the treatment and stop her from going. This way he wouldn’t have to pay anymore, but if you can prove there is mental abuse and it’s unsafe for her to be there then get a good lawyer and take it to the wall!!! Also your DD is old enough to speak in court and they have to listen, but again check all the laws first. I wish you the best in this situation. The poor kids are the ones that always have to pay in the end.. Very sad :(

[tinklover]

Don't stop her on your own, contact the lawyer and document everything!!!!! Your daughter is at the age where she can go into the Judge's chambers and express her feelings to the judge and he will include what she has to say in his decision. I wish you the best of luck and I hope it all gets resolved quickly and your daughter does not have to succumb to that insanity much longer.

[Disneyatic]

Thank you so much to everyone for your replies! I appreciate all the encouragement, advice and hearing other people's experiences.

No good news from the lawyer :( Basically what some have already said, it is not a good idea to keep her from going (violating the custody order) because it can be detrimental when we do go to court.
So, we are going to request a custody modification and begin that process.
I just wish that her dad and (evil) step-mother would consider her feelings in this, but I think that won't happen so we will have to let the judge decide.

I will keep everyone posted. Again, thank you so much for the encouragement. It really helps to vent about it and to hear that we aren't the only ones in this boat.

[Disneyatic]

I have offered to give up any rights to child support if they would give up custody rights. He used to beg me to do that (a few years ago) but now he refuses because "he is her father", and the step-mother is a control freak and she said to my face that "children should not have a choice in these matters." I was shocked that they were going to force her just to prove their point.
They live almost an hour away and have another baby on the way in October, I am hoping these strains will cause them to change their mind eventually.



*Is her bio father & step mom only money motivated? Do they really want to spend time with your daughter? Believe it or not, you may be able to negotiate with them without getting the courts involved. It sounds like they don’t want to pay support nor do they have the financial means to. If he signs over his parental rights, he will no longer be financially responsible for your daughter. If he does that, he no longer can demand visitation. I know how hard it is to be civil to them at a time like this, but “playing nice” may go a long way here. If you can angle it that you “want to help them out financially” and “make it easier on them” with the payments, you may be surprised what they are willing to give up (visitations) if they think they are making out better than you. Play the game.

Good luck & feel free to PM me with any questions!
steph :)

[stephicakes]

:( Just hang in there Liz. I know first-hand the anxiety it brings - not to mention the sleepless nights. It's a helpless feeling when you can't do more to protect your child. Take one day at a time. So much can change overnight, especially with that baby on the way.

You and your daughter are in our thoughts & prayers! :hug:

steph

[DisneyDog]

Poor kid. I haven't experienced this kind of situation from the parent's perspective, but many years ago I was in the child's situation. I was forced to go for visitation when I didn't want to. I was used (as a forced babysitter, as if I was "the help"), I got to listen to my mother being criticized, and I was basically treated like I didn't matter compared to the children of the 2nd wife. Long story short, it HAS affected me greatly as an adult. Fight for your child and her rights. Yes, she will have to visit him for now, but please do everything you can to get her out of that situation. Those people don't deserve to have her in their lives.

[emerzmom]

Get some professional counseling for your daughter and encourage her dad and step mother to attend some sessions. There may be a way to bridge their relationship which would be good for your DD. Almost all children want to have a relationship with their parents if at all possible.
I work for an agency in Houston where we see literally 100's of children each year that are in similar situations. It doesn't always end with the non-custodial parent coming around but it happens more often than you think. Additionally we see the children getting help, validation, and a voice of their own through therapy.
If you can't afford counseling every county in the state of Texas has a program called STAR (Services to At Risk Youth) that provides free counseling for school age youth with a variety of issues. Your situation qualifies for this free service. You can check the TDFPS website (Texas Department of Family Protective Services) for the organization in your county that has the STAR services.
Good luck! Your daugther is lucky she has a mom that really cares!
:tink:
Julie

[MNNHFLTX]

Get some professional counseling for your daughter and encourage her dad and step mother to attend some sessions. There may be a way to bridge their relationship which would be good for your DD. Almost all children want to have a relationship with their parents if at all possible.
I work for an agency in Houston where we see literally 100's of children each year that are in similar situations. It doesn't always end with the non-custodial parent coming around but it happens more often than you think. Additionally we see the children getting help, validation, and a voice of their own through therapy. Based on personal experience, I would suggest this also. I totally agree that the child's mental health and well-being overrule everything else. But we have been on the other side of the coin a bit as well.

We were very close to my husband's niece when she was little (his brother's daughter); she lived with her mom in Vermont but came down to Florida for six weeks each summer to visit us, her dad and her grandparents. Now her dad was far from perfect about many things, including paying child support regularly. Many times it took my MIL and FIL stepping in to either make him accountable or even pay up for him until he could pay them back. We did not approve of his actions at all! Her home situation with her mom was also far from perfect, but we respected her as her mom. In the end, because my BIL was hit-or-miss on payments, her mom went into court to curtail visitation. My niece was 14 at the time and having a tough time with some of the events that happened to her in her life, plus she was angry at her dad for falling behind on payments, so she asked the judge to stop all visitation with her father. In the process of cutting off all contact with him, however, she has cut all contact with his family, including us. That was nine years ago and we have not seen her since. We have tried to maintain contact with her, but she is afraid that inviting us back into her life will mean inviting her father back in too and she is still angry with him. It is, quite honestly, a heartbreaking situation all round. I think family counseling for all parties involved would have been beneficial, but it was not considered an option by her mom. Incidentally, my BIL did get back on track and pay child support until she graduated from high school, even without visitation rights. I want to think that someday she will choose to seek us out again, but am not holding out much hope.

I do feel for you in your current situation and wish you the best in whatever you decide to do.

[Wolf]

No experience with any of this but wishing you and your daughter the best possible outcome in all this...*hugs from alabama*

[gueli]

Sorry for your heartache.
Defiantly consult with the courts to question about an advocate for the child.

These things are hard and disheartening.

Good luck...
:cheer:

stay strong