Monorail closed after park closing

[eandrsmom]

Last week we were at MK until 10:50. The park closed at 10:00 then we watched Wishes. We always wait for the crowd to ease up and shop for a bit before exiting the park. When we left the park and headed to the monorail line, we were told that the monorails had closed and to take the ferry to the TTC. The line for the ferry was packed! We didn't get to the TTC until over 45 minutes later. The ferry was hot, crowded, and full of mosquitos. Is this a new practice of shutting down the monorails within an hour of park closing? We'd never experienced this before, and thought it was unusual considering the number of people still exiting the park.

[faline]

My understanding is that the new practice is to close the monorail lines 1 hour after regular park closing time. I don't like the new practice at all either!

[Ian]

It's not really clear why this was done. Some say it was to extend the time they have for monorail maintenance overnight, some say it's related to the construction of the DVC buildings at the GF ... I'm just hoping it's temporary.

[Melanie]

It's not a new practice. Been going on for nearly a year now, so it seems it won't be changing anytime soon.

On a side note, I'm so glad I'm staying at BLT for ICOT15!

[MaterializedHaunt]

That just not right. So how do the people who are at Floridian get back to their hotel? Ferry>TTC and walk? or resort to a jam packed busy? This is truely not Disney magic!!

Also they do have 12 monorails, how can they not have time for maintance? They have other monorails they can bring out... am I right in saying this? I know very little about how monorails are maintained, I do know they take hours to turn on, but thats all. Insight on this would be appreciated!

[Cinderelley]

That just not right. So how do the people who are at Floridian get back to their hotel? Ferry>TTC and walk? or resort to a jam packed busy? This is truely not Disney magic!!

Also they do have 12 monorails, how can they not have time for maintance? They have other monorails they can bring out... am I right in saying this? I know very little about how monorails are maintained, I do know they take hours to turn on, but thats all. Insight on this would be appreciated!

Maybe it isn't the monorails, but the line they run on.

People staying at other resorts use buses all the time. I don't really see a problem with it.

[AgentC]

On a side note, I'm so glad I'm staying at BLT for ICOT15!
Oh no MNSSHP! I forgot about that. Almost regretting my hotel choice for ICOT15 now. When we went to MVMCP , we were at the Contemporary and it was very easy to walk back.


That just not right. So how do the people who are at Floridian get back to their hotel? Ferry>TTC and walk? or resort to a jam packed busy? This is truely not Disney magic!!


For the GF, WL, FT Wilderness and the Poly, the resorts launches should still be running. I think they might offer a bus too, but I am not sure.

[MaterializedHaunt]

People staying at other resorts use buses all the time. I don't really see a problem with it.

Well yes this is true, but buses are their main form of transportation for their resorts, and they know this. But for FL Poly and Contemporary, their main transportation (for MK) is the monorail and they know this as well. So for them to have to take an alternative route is just ridiculous. They are a monorail resort and should have the use of the monorails. I dont have a problem with closing the TTC monorail line, but to close the Resort Monorail is foolish. How many year and year and years have they been running both monorails till 1hour after parks close? And now finially 40 years later they decide to change it? Something fishy here....

[Melanie]

Well yes this is true, but buses are their main form of transportation for their resorts, and they know this. But for FL Poly and Contemporary, their main transportation (for MK) is the monorail and they know this as well. So for them to have to take an alternative route is just ridiculous. They are a monorail resort and should have the use of the monorails. I dont have a problem with closing the TTC monorail line, but to close the Resort Monorail is foolish. How many year and year and years have they been running both monorails till 1hour after parks close? And now finially 40 years later they decide to change it? Something fishy here....

We've discussed this over and over here on the boards and also on the podcasts when it first occurred. Agreed, it doesn't seem fair to those staying in the monorail resorts. Definitely a very unpopular cutback, and yes, I believe that's what it is. Like I mentioned, it's been almost a year now, and it doesn't look to change.

Best bet going forward is for everyone to plan accordingly. Last year my sons and I went to an early MNSSHP in September and got caught in the mess that was the ferry going back to the TTC. If we were to do it again, we'd either leave a little earlier or hold back and let some of the crowd die down. It was frustrating.

[eandrsmom]

Sorry, I didn't know that this had been brought up before.:beat: It kind of makes me rethink our strategy of waiting for the crowds to thin before leaving the park.

[DisneyDawgette]

Huh... Maybe we got really lucky, but we didn't have this problem in June! Maybe we made it out before the hour, but I could have sworn it was well after... But there were still huge lines when we got there! Maybe they kept them open because there were so many people? Sorry about your luck! :/

[Victor Kelly]

We do not stay at the resorts on the monorails. We prefer POP. But, if a customer is spending the kind of money to stay at the MK resorts, then I find removing one of the biggest perks an issue.

Now, since we always drive to where we are going, it is a huge inconvenience to everyone who drives to MK, must take one of only two forms of transportation to the MK from the TTC. Disney effectively eliminated half of their transportation to TTC. Who does something that utterly stupid?

<Puts on pessimist mouse ears>
Maintenance issues after 41 years? With multiple series of monorails?

A monorail carries roughly 300 people. The ferry over 500. The ferry carries more, but is slower. Busy time, 2 ferries running, 2 monorails maybe 3. Ferry takes about 15 to 20 minutes to load, unload and transit the lake. Monorail I will estimate at 10 minutes per monorail.

So roughly, roughly mind you with the number above you get 3000 people per hour on 2 ferries. And with 3 monorails 4500 per hour. Other sources googled claim up to 7000 per hour for the monorail.

Bottom line, the monorail is faster and moves more people than a ferry. Now if my numbers on capacity are wrong, let me know and I will correct my figures.

Why would you get rid of a system like that? The answer money. Pure and simple. It saves money for Disney at the cost of making guests (customers) wait longer and longer for transport to the TTC or their hotels.

I will grant the beam ways may need repair, but why has nobody seen them repairing or doing work? Because it is not being done. Because it is not as much of a maintenance issue as they would have everyone believe.

[Polynesian Dweller]

Victor, one problem with your computations, at busy times they run 3 ferries. One each in the docks and one in transit.

Then one also has to include the number moved on the resort launches, and those walking to CR. After the first hour how many people remain the be moved. That last figure would tell you how much capacity is needed.

Now, yes, the cut back is about money. On the operational cost side the major stockholders, those with tens of thousands to millions of shares are reportedly very unhappy with the daily operational costs and want them cut. And folks at that level can force this. Since the only real way to reduce those is to cut paid staff hours (70% or more of operational costs are staff costs in any business) and shutting the monorail 1hr early is one way to do that.

[Victor Kelly]

You are correct, I did not count a third ferry:thumbsup:. Which would add approx 1500 people to the count per hour.

All thing being equal, the monorail really does do a lot more than it used to in the 70's and 80's. Anyone remember all seats in the monorails? I do. About 6 per seat and about 8 rows. So the newer models carry way more people. Unless it is loaded with strollers.

I did not count the launches as they do not really have a large capacity, and their speed of loading and travel are terrible.

Unfortunately the major stock holders probably get VIP treatment and do not use the public Disney transportation, otherwise they would understand and get just as frustrated. Or they simply never go to WDW to begin with.

I am far from syaing I will never go again, but with rate hikes at the parks and cost of transportation, closer amusement parks and other vacation spots are getting our money now.

[Cinderelley]

Well yes this is true, but buses are their main form of transportation for their resorts, and they know this. But for FL Poly and Contemporary, their main transportation (for MK) is the monorail and they know this as well. So for them to have to take an alternative route is just ridiculous.

They have to take buses to AK and DHS. I still really don't see a difference. TBH, I've stayed at the Poly and with all the stops at different hotels on the resort line and hopping from one monorail to the other to get to Epcot, I prefer to hop on a bus and go straight to my destination.

[Aurora]

They have to take buses to AK and DHS. I still really don't see a difference. TBH, I've stayed at the Poly and with all the stops at different hotels on the resort line and hopping from one monorail to the other to get to Epcot, I prefer to hop on a bus and go straight to my destination.

The biggest difference is in crowd control. You take the number of people who are parked at the TTC or staying at the Contemporary, Bay Lake Tower, Polynesian and Grand Floridian and instead of helping disperse the crowd with a third transportation option, you funnel all those people into the entrances for the other two.

It's obvious from looking at the way the monorail station, boat launches and bus depots are situated that when the Magic Kingdom was built, dispersing the crowds to use three different transportation options was intentional.

P.S.: As a comparison to your point, there are few bus lines that go only to one resort, or resort stop, and back. For the most part, buses make multiple stops as well. On the other hand, if you are staying at the Polynesian, you don't have to transfer to an Epcot monorail. You simply walk to the TTC to catch the express monorail to Epcot.

[Aurora]

Last week we were at MK until 10:50. The park closed at 10:00 then we watched Wishes. We always wait for the crowd to ease up and shop for a bit before exiting the park. When we left the park and headed to the monorail line, we were told that the monorails had closed and to take the ferry to the TTC. The line for the ferry was packed! We didn't get to the TTC until over 45 minutes later. The ferry was hot, crowded, and full of mosquitos. Is this a new practice of shutting down the monorails within an hour of park closing? We'd never experienced this before, and thought it was unusual considering the number of people still exiting the park.

What really irks me is the line that the monorails stop running one hour after the park closing time. With all nighttime fireworks shows extending the "unofficial" closing time by 15 to 20 minutes, it's really disingenuous to imply that anything other than a trickle of people will be leaving right when the fireworks begin. And frankly, if people are racing toward the exits after the fireworks to catch that monorail before it closes, it creates an even bigger safety hazard than already exists.

[Cinderelley]

And frankly, if people are racing toward the exits after the fireworks to catch that monorail before it closes, it creates an even bigger safety hazard than already exists.

I still remember the young guy who died when one monorail crashed into another a few years ago. I am willing to be inconvenienced in order to keep things like that from happening again. I may be in the minority. I may have that opinion, because I'm an ER nurse and have seen too much. But really, you're discussing "inconvenience" versus "safety" on a system that is decades old. I was born the same year as WDW, and I know some of my systems are "breaking down". :laughing: To me, it is a no brainer.

[faline]

It's obvious from looking at the way the monorail station, boat launches and bus depots are situated that when the Magic Kingdom was built, dispersing the crowds to use three different transportation options was intentional.


Actually, when the Magic Kingdom was built, there were no bus stations by the Magic Kingdom. The only way to get there from the Transportation and Ticket Center was via ferry or monorail. All busses funneled to the Transportation and Ticket Center and you transferred there.

[Aurora]

I still remember the young guy who died when one monorail crashed into another a few years ago. I am willing to be inconvenienced in order to keep things like that from happening again. I may be in the minority. I may have that opinion, because I'm an ER nurse and have seen too much. But really, you're discussing "inconvenience" versus "safety" on a system that is decades old. I was born the same year as WDW, and I know some of my systems are "breaking down". :laughing: To me, it is a no brainer.

With all due respect, that tragic accident had nothing to do with monorail maintenance. It was a combination of operating procedure, systems and staff errors (not on the part of the driver). The official reports of the accident are readily available online with full details.

And let me be clear. I'm not discussing "inconvenience." I'm talking about the safety of hordes of people leaving the Magic Kingdom after the fireworks. There is about a 30- to 45-minute window for catching the monorail now at the end of the evening, and it has never, ever been that short. There have been many, many, many comments about people fearing for their and their children's safety in that situation. With the monorail operating on such a tight ending schedule at the end of the day, I fear for the day when someone is injured because of the crush of people.

[Aurora]

Actually, when the Magic Kingdom was built, there were no bus stations by the Magic Kingdom. The only way to get there from the Transportation and Ticket Center was via ferry or monorail. All busses funneled to the Transportation and Ticket Center and you transferred there.

Faline -- good point, you are right. There were also far fewer people visiting Disney World at the time, and only two Disney resorts -- the Contemporary and the Polynesian, so there would have been no need for buses. I've found that the bus depot was built some time around or right after when the Grand Floridian and Caribbean Beach opened (1988), the four still being the only on-site Disney resorts at the time. Epcot resorts started opening in 1990, and other moderates starting in 1991. It seems clear the need for buses near the MK gates became obvious so as not to have to corral ALL the guests onto the monorails or boats when some of them would then just have to catch a bus at the TTC.

The transportation system then was sufficient, and options were added as WDW grew. To reduce one of those as an option at the very point in the day when you need capacity the most seems crazy to me.

[Cinderelley]

With all due respect, that tragic accident had nothing to do with monorail maintenance. It was a combination of operating procedure, systems and staff errors (not on the part of the driver). The official reports of the accident are readily available online with full details.

And let me be clear. I'm not discussing "inconvenience." I'm talking about the safety of hordes of people leaving the Magic Kingdom after the fireworks. There is about a 30- to 45-minute window for catching the monorail now at the end of the evening, and it has never, ever been that short. There have been many, many, many comments about people fearing for their and their children's safety in that situation. With the monorail operating on such a tight ending schedule at the end of the day, I fear for the day when someone is injured because of the crush of people.

Right. THAT accident was about that stuff. My point about that was tragedies do occur. What would happen if one of the beams crumbled under the weight of a monorail? Or one of the tracks that the electricty runs through came loose and hit the ground? What if one of them derailed? Those are just possibilities that I could think of based on my limited knowledge of the system. I'm sure someone who knows how they work could come up with more.

The potential for someone being crushed during a massive crowd movement is there, but I don't hold one corporation responsible for the inconsiderate behavior of people. Those who are doing that should be held accountable on their own accord. I believe everyone should be accountable for their own actions, and yes, I am one of those people who will stand up and tell everyone to back off if needed. But really, that all boils down to convenience too. Everyone is rushing to have the "convenience" of the monorail. They don't want to be "inconvenienced" by the other types of transportation.

[kakn7294]

I read somewhere that when the monorail is closed at the end of the evening, there are now buses offered to the GF and Poly resorts. Last summer, we did not have any problem with catching the monorail from Epcot to the TTC (stayed at Poly) even after Illuminations and wandering slowly from Germany to the monorail.

[MKFD43]

I have a family member who works on the monorails. They say that the fleet is growing old and is constantly breaking down. So maintenence is a big issue. There are days when they need to take them off the loop mid day to work on them due to mechanical issues. And they are short people to work the system. They are constantly getting overtime to fill in open slots. This could also be the reason for ending it an hour after closing. Since the crash tehy have to be retested on operations and not everyone who was working the lines passed.

[brivers222]

Actually, when the Magic Kingdom was built, there were no bus stations by the Magic Kingdom. The only way to get there from the Transportation and Ticket Center was via ferry or monorail. All busses funneled to the Transportation and Ticket Center and you transferred there.

I am glad you brought that up... i was remembering that we always had to go to the TTC even by bus... then in 2004 (my first time there since i was kid) we were able to take a bus right up to the MK.... i thought i was losing it


On our honeymoon we were boarding a Monorail in the contemporary when all of the sudden the speaker came on and said due to smoke in the cockpit we must all exit and find alternative transportation. it took us 2 hours to get from contemporary to boardwalk because of all the people trying to catch busses. Albeit it was still better than being on the other 2 monorails we stranded on the beam...

[Bethanymouse]

We have stayed at a range of WDW resorts over the years. When we do stay at a deluxe it is mostly for the convenience of the monorail. However, even though I had read that the monorail would be closing one hour after park closing, I was extremely disappointed to see it in action. I stay at a monorail resort for this amenity. It seems like disney is making me pay more, for much less.

[Mousemates]

We have stayed at a range of WDW resorts over the years....... I stay at a monorail resort for this amenity. It seems like disney is making me pay more, for much less.

I understand what your saying and where your coming from, but truth be told they don't make any of us pay anything...its always our choice, we don't have to go. If you feel strongly that the monorail resorts are way overpriced without full monorail amenities, choose another resort. (We love the MK resorts, but have opted for other accommodations on our upcoming trip, with this being one of the reasons.)

More and more I have come to think that the only thing that gets their attention is a decrease in dollars...and until their resort revenues take a hit by folks who agree with you, they actually have little incentive to take care of the problem.