CMs during Wishes....

[Dsnygirl]

So.... just wondering if we were the only ones during our last trip to find the way some of the CMs are handling the crowds during Wishes to be over-the-top and rude??

We were one of the last to cross the bridge from Liberty Square into the hub in front of the castle for Wishes one night, so we were in that awful spot, right on the edge of the crowd.

We had an AWFUL CM who kept yelling (truly yelling) at people to move into the center more to make room for others, to not stand on the tape that was there for the ELP, to not block the walkway... all very reasonable things to be ASKED to do, but not yelled at, pushed at with her arms out like she was cattle-herding us in... and she never stopped, she continued yelling her instructions to everyone right throughout Wishes, totally ruining Jiminy Cricket's talk and the music, and DEFINITELY the mood of the show.

Thankfully, we've seen Wishes enough that we can recite it by heart and enjoy it, no matter what, but what about all the new families that were there for the first time?? Granted, it was a large crowd... but being yelled at and shoved at by a frustrated, annoyed CM certainly wasn't going to help folks enjoy the show, and you'd think that'd be their goal, first and foremost... to help the guests, not drive them away.

It was the worst CM experience I've ever had at Disney, and if we hadn't been so tired by the time we got down Main St., we would have gone & talked to someone about her... her behavior basically caused everyone around her to just ignore her, which of course didn't help... I heard one family say, "I do NOT want to push into the center of the hub, I am on the edge for a reason, so we can get out of here quickly with our baby and not get run over... I am standing where I CHOOSE to stand, and am staying here!" She, of course, just kept yelling and trying to push people in...

Anyone else seen/heard this happen recently?? I know the walkways have to remain open in the case of an emergency, but for the 12 minutes that Wishes runs, couldn't the CM just walk the walkway, gently reminding people to either move along or join the crowd to watch... and let those that are already there enjoy the show??

[BrerSchultzy]

This is pretty unusual, especially considering it mirrors one of the stories told to Cast Members when they are training. It goes like this:

Imagine there is a family that is visiting the Magic Kingdom for the very first time. The kids are little Billy who is 8 and Susie who is 5. They've heard all about how wonderful Walt Disney World is, and they've saved for years to make the trip. They board the Monorail at the TTC, and are greeted by William, who tells them to have a Magical day. They get to the Main Gate, where Bertha welcomes them to the Happiest Place on Earth. They walk through the tunnel, and round the corner on Main St. to reveal Cinderella's Castle in all her glory. Mom and Dad start to tear up, hearing their children squeal with delight. And all day, they create memory upon memory. Each moment better than the last. Their wonderful breakfast at Crystal Palace is trumped by their children singing and dancing with Sonny Eclipse, which is trumped by a truly magical dinner at Cinderella's Royal Table. They've met Woody, Buzz, Donald, Minnie and Mickey. They've bought the hats, taken pictures of the kids clapping on It's A Small World, and oohed and aahed at Wishes. Cinderella even pointed to little Susie during the parade. And all along the way, Cast Members have greeted them with a smile. One cast member even spent ten minutes helping to find little Billy's sunglasses when he left them on a bench.
When the day is over, they take one more walk down Main St, with the lights twinkling, and music playing. Cast members are waving good bye, and they can just feel the Pixie Dust falling down from the sky to land on their shoulders. Dad puts his arm around Mom's shoulder and kisses her forehead, not believing that any day could ever be better than this. On their way out, Joe tells them to come on back, and have a truly magical night, and they make their way up the monorail ramp. They just missed this monorail, but their first in line for the next one. Little Billy is so excited to see the monorail, that he leans over the railing to see if it's coming. He looks and looks, and his parents gaze in wonder and how excited their little boy is to see the monorail coming. Billy thinks he hears the monorail coming, when from directly behind him they hear a voice....

"GET BEHIND THE LINE KID!!!"

Now...wouldn't that ruin the magic of that day?

[Mousemates]

.... He looks and looks, and his parents gaze in wonder and how excited their little boy is to see the monorail coming. Billy thinks he hears the monorail coming, when from directly behind him they hear a voice....

"GET BEHIND THE LINE KID!!!"

Now...wouldn't that ruin the magic of that day?

Yep...and fortunately we have only truly met "that cast member" one time in many trips to Disney (a bus driver at Fort Wilderness). But one bad CM, especially at the beginning or ending of the day, can vacuum the magic out of the day for a child.

[Polynesian Dweller]

The rule at Disney is that Safety trumps Show, and it should. A good show is not good if someone gets hurt.

You may not think that something is unsafe but the CMs are trained to see unsafe things and expected to act. You the guest are not trained nor necessarily able to see the issue. A little yelling at little Billy is a lot better than little Billy getting hurt.

[btharvey]

The rule at Disney is that Safety trumps Show, and it should. A good show is not good if someone gets hurt.

You may not think that something is unsafe but the CMs are trained to see unsafe things and expected to act. You the guest are not trained nor necessarily able to see the issue. A little yelling at little Billy is a lot better than little Billy getting hurt.You are right that safety is paramount, but I disagree that it's ok for CMs to be oafs about it. There are ways and ways to get folks' attention and herd them in the proper direction. I've seen it done by CMs many times. The yellers are few, thankfully, but sadly we've seen one somewhere each and every trip (not toward us, thankfully, though we have had a couple gentle sidles aimed our way).

You can keep people behind a line without shouting and without insults.

CMs should go out of their way to not yell, and CM supervisors and other experienced CMs should look for those CMs who've "lost it" on that day and can't get their magic back. They need help and should receive it. But when you have someone who's constantly ruining the magic, they shouldn't be in public view. There's plenty of back-stage work that can be done by the grumpier among us.

[Ian]

The rule at Disney is that Safety trumps Show, and it should. A good show is not good if someone gets hurt.

You may not think that something is unsafe but the CMs are trained to see unsafe things and expected to act. You the guest are not trained nor necessarily able to see the issue. A little yelling at little Billy is a lot better than little Billy getting hurt.Yeah, I completely and totally disagree with this. In fact, you need read no further than the OP's story to see why:


... her behavior basically caused everyone around her to just ignore her ...

Safety first is one thing, but using it as an excuse to take your frustrations out on the guests by being rude and abusive is something totally different. It makes people tune you out and, in fact, makes them far less safe.

You can maintain safety standards and keep people protected while being courteous and polite and reasonable all at the same time. Also, I'd challenge a little bit the notion that Disney somehow knows everything there is to know about guest safety ... I've been in many situations in WDW where I questioned my and my family's safety and every time it was because of things Disney did not in spite of them. They're not geniuses, they're guys making a bit above minimum wage who may or may not have the first clue about what they should be doing.

At the end of the day, yes ... safety is more important than show, but the two can and should co-exist. They complement each other, in fact, and IMO neither should ever be sacrificed in favor of the other.


CMs should go out of their way to not yell, and CM supervisors and other experienced CMs should look for those CMs who've "lost it" on that day and can't get their magic back. They need help and should receive it. But when you have someone who's constantly ruining the magic, they shouldn't be in public view. There's plenty of back-stage work that can be done by the grumpier among us.You hit the nail on the head. It's basic leadership 101 that if you're trying to quiet an unruly crowd you're only going to make things worse if you join them in being unruly. Calm, quiet, orderly leadership is required in crowd control situations. It's common sense that you don't calm people down by freaking out and acting like a jerk.

And by the way, I'd be shocked if all of these things are clearly spelled out in Disney's policy and procedures documents on crowd control. If they aren't, then we have a bigger problem than just one cranky CM.

[MississippiDisneyFreak]

I think everyone agrees sometimes CM have to ask people to move or something to that effect, its the way certain ones do it that everyone has issues with...I think we've all experienced THAT CM at sometime, ours was a monorail driver...rude, rude, rude...of course, in my opinion the bad CM are the exception and we've mostly experienced warm friendly CM that obviously love their jobs:thumbsup:

[minnie04]

Originally Posted by BrerSchultzy
.... He looks and looks, and his parents gaze in wonder and how excited their little boy is to see the monorail coming. Billy thinks he hears the monorail coming, when from directly behind him they hear a voice....

"GET BEHIND THE LINE KID!!!"

Now...wouldn't that ruin the magic of that day?


OR maybe save his life !!!!!

I agree some of the cast members can be a little mean at times, but for every mean one there are so many that are really good at what they do..
I also think it’s up to US as a visitor to behave too. I have seen many times where parents have let their children do things knowing they aren’t allowed, just because its DISNEY and "hey let them say something to MY kid" In the hope of getting something FREE :ack: people feel they are entitled to something when they are in the parks. I hate that when I see someone doing something they shouldn’t only to get something out of it. The CM are doing a great job and have to be treated with respect!!!

[Aurora]

Ditto Ian's comment. I am a lunch mom at my kids' school. They eat in the cafeteria, and at the end of each lunch period, we're in charge of making sure they're (relatively) quiet before they go back to their classrooms.

There is a lunch supervisor who likes to use her big booming voice to get all the children's attention so they can quiet down. They do.... for about 30 seconds. Then the volume goes back up. The children are reprimanded again, and no one feels good.

Another mom's tack is to walk around, tap the kids on the shoulders who are being too loud or not sitting down while they're eating, and talk quietly to them face to face to remind them of the lunchroom rules.

The second mom is not only more effective at quieting the kids down, but also creates a more pleasant and less stressful lunchtime for the kids. But it takes her more effort to do that than it takes the loud mom to blow up.

If so many visitors encounter "that one CM," I have to assume there's a little complicity about that kind of behavior higher up. Otherwise running into them would be as rare as seeing the Everest Yeti working properly. (Sorry. :blush: )

[Joannelet]

I think this cast member worked at the carousel of progress last year when we were there. She ruined the experience for everyone with her dramatic entrances and booming voice. When my calm 1 year old jumped after her 2nd dramatic entrance and got so scared and started hysterically crying I literally wanted to hit her. I am so mad at myself for not reporting her. All because a dad had exited with his screaming child. If it is such a safety feature that you cannot leave once the ride starts wouldnt it be ideal to have instructions of how to get out if you have to leave etc? As a cast member we are trained for safety and are told when to tell people to back up, not lean on railings etc but we aren't told to scream. That is unacceptable and does ruin the magic for the people around them who are listening.

[Mousemates]

You are right that safety is paramount, but I disagree that it's ok for CMs to be oafs about it. There are ways and ways to get folks' attention and herd them in the proper direction. .....

You can keep people behind a line without shouting and without insults.

Exactly, thirty years ago as a college student I worked traffic control for the police department in a major southern tourist town. Add the heat and humidity of the south to to large crowds of people (frustrated by a city that had no way to handle the number cars that drove through it) and tempers among the public are bound to grow short.

This proved to be especially among those who massed at the corners of busy intersections and wanted you to immediately stop traffic so they could cross the street. And every so often there would be that person who (either out of frustration, ignorance or self-absorption) would choose to cross the line.

I quickly learned that the least effective way to deal with the problem was to yell. All yelling generally accomplished was immediately raises the tension level of everyone and making things worse. The most effective approach was a calmer more measured response.

I share that to say this, in crowded situations cool heads are needed to ease tensions rather than escalate them. And if an employee can't consistently "keep his cool" in dealing with a "less than perfectly behaved general public" he should be reassigned to a position out of the public eye.

[Main Street Jim]

Sure wish I still worked Main Street Parade Audience control :) I was also a TRAINER for those positions. When I trained my Cast on the parade/fireworks route(s), I would tell them to be "aggressively nice", or "nicely aggressive" when it came to moving crowds. This meant using a "PLEASE" whenever you were trying to move people. Example: "PLEASE do not stop in the walkways, folks, this is two-way traffic. PLEASE continue down the walkways." "PLEASE remain behind the line/rope/tape. This is for YOUR SAFETY during our performance of (Spectro/ELP/Wishes)." And I agree with Ian; when you're *constantly* on someone, or a group of someones, to "do something" (using LOUD, obnoxious instructions), people *will* tune you out and ignore said instructions.

Me? I liked to go and talk to the guests in my area :) I would get kids out in the street to "start my parade" :)

Man, I miss my job there :(

[KAT1811]

I couldn't agree with Ian and Mousemates more.

More often than not it's how you say something not what you are saying. Basic psychology dictates that people become defensive when spoken to in an agressive, less than respectful manner and are less likely to react the way you want them to.

You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

Even in the monerail case a kind tone and maybe a small conversation of the dangers of being too close to the monerail would have yielded the same results and kept the "magic" alive.

Yelling just makes you sound like an ignoramus with poor communication skills. Someone who certainly shouldn't be in potentially high stress situations with the public.

[Dsnygirl]

I couldn't agree with Ian and Mousemates more.

More often than not it's how you say something not what you are saying. Basic psychology dictates that people become defensive when spoken to in an agressive, less than respectful manner and are less likely to react the way you want them to.

You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.


And that was exactly my point... boy, I didn't expect so many comments from this post... but really, the CM I'm talking about could have been just as effective (actually, probably far more effective) keeping the walkways cleared if she had just spoken to people individually instead of yelling at everyone. It was rude, intrusive and totally unattractive, and it completely killed the mood of the show.

We've had SO many great CM's over the years during our trips, this was the first time I've EVER felt compelled to complain about one... but I have seen an increasing number of at least cranky ones during parade/fireworks time, and I'm wondering if it's b/c management has gotten after them to really keep the walkways open. I don't remember, in prior years, having so many ropes everywhere... in MK, they basically rope you IN during the ELP near Main St, and won't let people stop at ALL to watch while they're walking along... it's "keep moving, keep moving, this has to stay open for emergencies" the whole time. I do understand that - completely, I'm a nurse - but really, I've been asked to keep moving when I've done nothing more than a brief pause to allow my daughter to adjust her flip flop, and not in the nicest way. God forbid you pause to look at one float! ;) (and we weren't even allowed to go under the rope to watch... once that rope goes up around everyone, that's it, apparently...)

Seeing as so many others have experienced the "angry CM" during these experiences, maybe it does warrant a letter to management, just to flag it... it'd be nice if they could get the "sugar vs. vinegar" message back out there!!

[TheRustyScupper]

1) I criticize and applaud WDW where appropriate.
2) In this case, I do not fault the CM.
3) I have worked parades before.
4) CM's or floats can be coming and people are in the way.
5) AND, THEY WON'T MOVE.
6) In that case, you gotta yell.
7) The OP maybe had a day when no one was moving.

[Jared]

I'm not going to jump into the fray here, because I really do see both sides, but I want to say that I don't envy those parade Cast Members. Those gridlocks often become unruly, and it's a delicate balance between safety and show in those situations. Generally speaking, I am fine with Cast Members raising their voices to get guests' attention if necessary. But without being there, I can't say if it was truly necessary in this instance.

[DisneyKim22]

My heart goes out to the CMs who have to deal with the people who only think about themselves and have no regard for other's safety, happiness, or well being. That being said, the ONLY time I should hear a CM yell at someone is when lives are in immediate danger. I mean, if someone is about to be hit by a float or something, then certainly yell to get his/her attention. Otherwise, Main Street Jim's take is how it should be.

Thankfully in all my 30+ visits, I have only run into one nasty CM (story for another thread), and a few who were completely unengaged in their jobs. Considering all the CM's I've come in contact in those trips, that's not a bad average.

[MissMaryPoppins]

Last summer during the Main Street electrical parade my family and I were heading from Adventure land to Casey's so we could look in some shops to kill time during the parade and fireworks. We had just reached the bridge going toward the Crystal Palace and there was a little bit of a jam. From where I was standing it looked like some people stopped in the middle to watch the parade. Instead of the cast member doing crowd control asking the people causing the jam to please keep walking she began screaming at the us and the other people around us. We literally couldn't move on and someone tried telling her this bit she continued to scream. I can understand having a job to do and I can honestly say I don't hold up lines or crowds so this cast member screaming at us wasn't sitting well with me. I looked up at her and asked where she expected us to go. She told me we needed to keep moving ahead. I pointed ahead to the jam and said " yeah, easier said then done. Maybe they need to get the lecture." She began laughing and tried to make a joke out of it. No one around me was laughing.

Another unfriendly cast member we encountered was at the Brown Derby. A few years ago my grandma, one of my mom's brothers and his wife and kids, plus my parents best friends came to Disney to celebrate my mom's birthday. The day after everyone got in my uncle made reservations for us all to have dinner at the Brown Derby. The reservation was for 12 and everyone was scattered for the afternoon and we planned to meet at the restaurant at a set time. My mom, grandma, and I got there first and I went inside to check in. I explained we would all be there soon and the hostess told me she would check us in and to let her know when everyone else arrived. She was very friendly and helpful. I came back out and sat with my mom and grandma and waited for the others. A few minutes later another hostess comes out and calls our name so I stood up to approach her and she raised and lowered her hands saying. "sit, sit." to me. I looked back at my mom and whispered "woof, woof". So the hostess asked me if we all wanted to sit together since there were 12 of us and said we did. She rolled her eyes, let out a long, dramatic sigh, and said we were just going to need to wait then. She looked annoyed, as if wanting to have my family seated together was a ridiculous request, and told me were just going to have wait. I smiled and said "we're doing that,it's not a problem.". She rolled her eyes again and went back inside. Once the rest of my family arrived I went inside and told the hostess at the desk we were all there. Just as I stepped outside a third hostess came to seat us and we went right past the one who had been so unnecessarily dramatic and she said "have a wonderful evening" as if she was so sweet. I rolled my eyes at her that time and continued walking.

What bothered me most about these situations, especially the second one, is when my family is in Disney World we never complain, we never try to get something for free, we're friendly and respectful of the cast members and other guests, and I don't think any family who does the same deserves that sort of treatment.

[MstngDrvnDsnyLvr]

Unfortunately everyone has bad days and then they take them out on everyone else around. I just smile and in my good southern grace - I just think to myself -"Well bless their heart".

And yes, whispering or speaking firmly yet quietly works best to get the attention of anyone from toddlers to senior adults. I've used this technique many times with great success. It works really well with teenagers, the notably stubborn and "deaf" set.

We all hope for the truly magical experience at Disney 100% of the time, but because not everyone there is having the best of times, we are stuck having to deal with their bad moods, be it a visitor or a CM.

[andreallybadeggs]

Me? I liked to go and talk to the guests in my area :) I would get kids out in the street to "start my parade" :)

Man, I miss my job there :(

Haven't been on Intercot for awhile. Always enjoyed your posts and appreciated your insights. Sorry you are no longer there.