Is DDP "killing" Disney dining??

[MickeyMousse]

My neighbors just came back from being at the world 1/12-1/21. Said the crowds weren't bad at all and the longest wait time was 75 minutes at Soarin'!

They brought up the difference they found in dining this time around. Last year they were on the dining plan and felt like a majority of the places they ate at the food wasn't at the top of their game, the wait staff was not attentive and they felt rushed.

This time they decided against the dining plan and says it was an entirely different experience. They ate at most of the same places, finding the food to be very good, the wait staff much more attentive and friendly and they felt more relaxed.

I've never done the dining plan, so I could not comment except for "wow, really???"

Wondering what my fellow Intercotees think??

[DizneyRox]

killing? No...

Killed

You just got the wrong tense...

[JPL]

DEAD and Buried!!

Variety is gone along with other unique menu items. Most Menus have been dumbed down. The quality of food has dropped off along with the portion sizes. The list goes on and on:mad: Oh and almost forgot to mentio prices continued to rise.

[luvdiznee]

Even though this thread seems to be about food, but since crowd levels were mentioned, I'm just hoping that the wait time for the new attraction at DHS, Toy Story Mania, is going to be a bit less. We missed it our last trip. :thedolls::mickey:

[SBETigg]

I think this is a matter of their frame of mind. The dining experience itself doesn't change if you are on the plan or not. The servers still get tips at the same rate now that tips are not plan-inclusive. The menus are the same, and I'm sure the chef isn't in back deciding to massacre the food of anyone on the dining plan.

But back to your point in the subject header, yes, the dining plan is having an undesirable effect on dining at Disney. I like the savings on the plan and the convenience of paying in advance, but I hate that the menus have changed to become more generic and less interesting with the plan in place. They seem to be cutting corners on table service dining since the implementation of the plan. And having to make those ADRs so far in advance is a bummer. I loved it when you could just walk up and get in, no hassle. This has all changed with the plan in place whether one buys the dining plan or not.

[medic9016]

But back to your point in the subject header, yes, the dining plan is having an undesirable effect on dining at Disney. I like the savings on the plan and the convenience of paying in advance, but I hate that the menus have changed to become more generic and less interesting with the plan in place. They seem to be cutting corners on table service dining since the implementation of the plan. And having to make those ADRs so far in advance is a bummer. I loved it when you could just walk up and get in, no hassle. This has all changed with the plan in place whether one buys the dining plan or not.

Do you think some of the changes are a reflection of the economy? I also really liked when you could walk up to any place you wanted to eat.

[Johnno52]

I agree the DDP has killed dining for us also and we no longer purchase it (as I have mentioned many times). We are going next week for 16 days and not one ADR. While at BW we will go to Swan and Dolphin and when at OKW we will dine mostly at DD. We will do counters wherever we are at the time but as I mentioned above for sit downs. This at least until WDW gets back to better food choices. :thumbsup:

[thrillme]

I tried it and it was OK (after all it was sorta free). The disappointment is that there was a time in which there was no need for ADR's. You could get into most any place. When the DDP started up that sorta KILLED the walk ups.

[JPL]

Do you think some of the changes are a reflection of the economy?

This started long before the economy went downhill. This was caused by greed. Now not just Disney's greed but the also the greed of some guests who would simply order and calculate the most expensive places to eat and the most expesive choices in said restaurants in order to maximize their "value" or "savings" on the plan.

[elmjimmlm]

And having to make those ADRs so far in advance is a bummer. I loved it when you could just walk up and get in, no hassle. .

I have had the DDP for the past 2 years and I wish that I didnt have to plan my entire trip on where we are going to eat...There are also times when the place that we are going we are not in the mood for but go because most likely we will lose our credit...
I did notice this year that several places we ate at there were walk ups that were turned away because they were told that they were booked only to see many, many empty tables our entire meal...I dont understand that at all...

[cindchan]

I tried it and it was OK (after all it was sorta free). The disappointment is that there was a time in which there was no need for ADR's. You could get into most any place. When the DDP started up that sorta KILLED the walk ups.

I agree! Last time I have the DDP, because it was free with the package, and I almost didn't get to use the Table Service, because I could never find a place!! You apparently had to book before you even got to Disney! I hate doing that, because I usually decide that morning what park I'm going to. I don't want to be tied down to a schedule, because I have to reserve every meal! :mad:

[mouseketeer mom]

I have had the DDP for the past 2 years and I wish that I didnt have to plan my entire trip on where we are going to eat...There are also times when the place that we are going we are not in the mood for but go because most likely we will lose our credit...
I did notice this year that several places we ate at there were walk ups that were turned away because they were told that they were booked only to see many, many empty tables our entire meal...I dont understand that at all...

Agreed on this one. Planning your ADR's at home is one thing, but then once you get there, well, the day kind of unfolds in its own way, and we find that we don't want that specific ADR anymore, or the time is bad, whatever. Its a headache.
Also, like you said, we scramble to make our ADR's and found that there were so very many empty tables around us, even at Ohana's! What is that all about???

[DizneyRox]

I'm going to guess that now they book 100% using ADRs. Makes staffing easier, etc. They can say at several days out now, OK, we're 50% booked, so we need 5 servers, 1 cook, etc. Tell everyone else to not show up and BINGO! They run with their expected profit margin, etc. So what if they have to turn people away at the door, they may or may not have to, but if they run with what they know, they won't be "wasting" any money on salary IF people just don't show up.

With all the other penny pinching going on I would totally expect the above to be true. Maybe it's not, but not being able to walk up to so many places these days, something is just not sitting well.

[Dragongirlx]

It is a bit of a pain that you have to make ADRs to get in to eat. The first year we went we could just walk up and get in to restaurants.
The second time we couldn't do that but if we went to guest services the same day we could usually find something,
The third year I made ADRs because there were certain restaurants we wanted to go to but we found it quite restriciting to have to get places at a certain time and our holiday felt too planned.
Last year we were offered the dining plan as part of the holiday package but we didn't take it as we wouldn't have used all the options on it and we decided we wouldn't book ADRs but just try and get reservatiosn by going to guest services or phoning the reservation line while we were there (as phoning from the UK can be quite expensive). We couldn't get into a single restaurant and we were willing to take anything, and walking up did no good even out with the peak eating times.
This year we are going to have to book to get something and I only hope the online booking is up by our 90 days.
I think this is definatley due to the increase in the use of the dining plan - epecially because we tend to go when the free dining is offered.
I wish Disney would look over this agian and maybe consider saving a portion of each of the popular restaurants for walk ups only - I live in hope

[VWL Mom]

DEAD and Buried!!

Variety is gone along with other unique menu items. Most Menus have been dumbed down. The quality of food has dropped off along with the portion sizes. The list goes on and on:mad: Oh and almost forgot to mentio prices continued to rise.

Not to mention the new relaxed dress codes in the signature restaurants. Even my kids know to put on a polo shirt and khaki's when they go to them.

IMO Disney needs to rethink the system. For years there have been "meal plan" options at resort vacation spots. There was a set menu offered (3 choices) on the plan and other dishes that were add-ons. This allowed the kitchen to satisfy those on the plan and still be creative for those that were looking to dine rather than just eat.

[RocknBev]

"Killing" seems to be a bit harsh but I do believe it has had an impact on quality of food, ability to reservations and sometimes service.

I wish they would experiment with some restauruants that would not accept ADR's for table service so that if the "mood strikes" you could walk up and have table service. But I also understand that business and work force doesn't quite work that way....if you don't have any idea on how many to expect how do you plan food and staff? I am happy the WDW has changed the ADR's to 90 days now instead of 180....it seems a little more reasonable although I know some would still like it to be 24 hours!

On our trip a couple of weeks ago, DDP was very helpful for my DBro who wanted to enjoy all of WDW without the worry of how much it would cost in the end! We had great meals with me planning ahead and his trip was paid for with no surprises expenses with his teenagers ordering pricey meals.

If people want 5-star quality food off the DDP, I am sure downtown Orlando has restaurants that can satisty every need. I believe WDW is still doing a good job trying to cater to the average WDW consumer and keep most happy. There is still GREAT food and service available at WDW. Most people go to Disney for the WHOLE experience not just the food.

[MickeyMousse]

My neighbors never mentioned anything about problems w/ADR's, just that they noticed a difference in the food and service DDP vs paying out of pocket. And it wasn't at just one restaurant they revisited, it was at many.

[DizneyRox]

My neighbors never mentioned anything about problems w/ADR's, just that they noticed a difference in the food and service DDP vs paying out of pocket. And it wasn't at just one restaurant they revisited, it was at many.
Exactly... While I couldn't care less about the DDP, some people like it, and that's fine. My problem is the concessions that Disney has made as a result of the DDP that impact me as a cash customer. The menu selections are my biggest pet peeve. It's almost gotten to the point where you get the same menu at any restaurant (much like the merchandise).

Reservations have been impossible since poeple have these "credits" that they MUST USE or the world will end. Since they DID pay for them, I somewhat undersand, but I can't help but think there would be more availability if people didn't have to use every last food credit and if they just ate when they needed to. So, this impacts me too, since now I need to play the same game. And as I've stated int he past, I make reservations all the time, even without a trip planned, just in case I do end up going. I do this because of the lack of available ADRs, which I understand DOES make the situation worse, but you gotta look out for #1.

When gratuity was included, I feel service DID suffer. If you know what you're getting for a tip regardless, you really don't have to go above and beyond. I wouldn't... If I know there's some unknown at the end of the tunnel, I'm on my best behavior till I find out what it is. Sure, sometimes I'm disappointed, but sometimes not. It' just human nature.

So, I maintain, dining in Disney is dead. Disney won't go back and put choice on the menu. Quality won't get better, at least not until the DDP is gone and the restaurants can make their own choices about what's good for the bottom line. And in the mean time, even cash customers can just hang on for the ride.

[SBETigg]

My neighbors never mentioned anything about problems w/ADR's, just that they noticed a difference in the food and service DDP vs paying out of pocket. And it wasn't at just one restaurant they revisited, it was at many.

Yes, but I fail to see how their option of not choosing the dining plan would affect their food. The dining plan is still in place. It's not as if the kitchen staff preps special food for those not on the plan vs on the plan. They're in the kitchen making food. Why would they take time to care who's on the dining plan or not?

I'll grant that before the plan was implemented that the food was better in general. But I won't allow that buying the dining plan or not has any effect on what is served to you at the table on a meal to meal basis, though it may arguably impact service. Do your neighbors really believe they were served better food because they were not on the dining plan? That someone making their food is paying deliberate attention to how people are paying for it? I would think that they simply enjoyed it more when believing themselves free of something they actually considered a hassle to them.

[BMan62]

I'm going to guess that now they book 100% using ADRs. Makes staffing easier, etc. They can say at several days out now, OK, we're 50% booked, so we need 5 servers, 1 cook, etc. Tell everyone else to not show up and BINGO! They run with their expected profit margin, etc. So what if they have to turn people away at the door, they may or may not have to, but if they run with what they know, they won't be "wasting" any money on salary IF people just don't show up.

With all the other penny pinching going on I would totally expect the above to be true. Maybe it's not, but not being able to walk up to so many places these days, something is just not sitting well.


Agreed on this one. Planning your ADR's at home is one thing, but then once you get there, well, the day kind of unfolds in its own way, and we find that we don't want that specific ADR anymore, or the time is bad, whatever. Its a headache.
Also, like you said, we scramble to make our ADR's and found that there were so very many empty tables around us, even at Ohana's! What is that all about???

Empty tables could be a sign of 1) Staffing at ADR levels, so as not to have dining CMs standing around, or 2) People scheduling multiple ADRs for the same basic time frames and not canceling when the decide or 3) No shows for whatever reason

As to the OP statement: No, I don't think the DDP has killed Disney dining, but I do believe that it has put a premium on finding variety.

[dnickels]

Yes, but I fail to see how their option of not choosing the dining plan would affect their food. The dining plan is still in place. It's not as if the kitchen staff preps special food for those not on the plan vs on the plan. They're in the kitchen making food. Why would they take time to care who's on the dining plan or not?

I'll grant that before the plan was implemented that the food was better in general. But I won't allow that buying the dining plan or not has any effect on what is served to you at the table on a meal to meal basis, though it may arguably impact service. Do your neighbors really believe they were served better food because they were not on the dining plan? That someone making their food is paying deliberate attention to how people are paying for it? I would think that they simply enjoyed it more when believing themselves free of something they actually considered a hassle to them.

I can't speak for the OPs friends, but I think it's the general long term trend you mentioned. Obviously it makes no difference whether I'm on the DDP or paying cash if I walk into Le Celier tonight and order a steak, I'm getting the same meat prepared the same way. But in the macro long term sense (and I'm just making up numbers here) what is happening is that really good steak dinner that used to cost $60 out of pocket has been reduced in size/quality/side dish selection so that the quality is comparable to the $30 chicken pasta meal.

Prior to DDP if you wanted the really good meal in a restaurant and were willing to pay for it you would actually receive something of higher quality. With the introduction of DDP and the 'pick anything on the menu' idea, that $60 dinner was hurting Disney a lot more than the $30 dinner so the more expensive one gets watered down.

Also as others have mentioned, I remember when I was a kid my dad would make reservations in the morning. We'd wake up and decide we wanted to go to park A and make a reservation at park A. I can't imagine having to decide where I'll want to eat 180 or 90 days in advance.

[bkfree]

I'll be the Lone Ranger on this one. We have always used the Dining plan and we LOVE it.
I also always make my ADR's in advance and love that also. It takes away alot of stress about where we are going to eat dinner each day. We also usually pay one or 2 meals OOP, usually breakfast buffets.
I have never seen any difference between the meal or service whether we used the DDP or paid OOP.
We just returned in Dec from trip #3 and again we have no complaints at all about our meals for service and I am sure we will again use the DDp next time.
I would hate if they did away with ADR's and that change might cause us to stay offsite as not to have to fight the throngs of walkins for spots.
One thing I do when I make our ADRS and they ask if we are using the DIning Plan, I just answer that we are not sure yet.

[Luv Eeyore]

When tips were included in the DDP, we definitely noticed a difference in service. Our biggest beef (pun intended) is with the difficulty in getting ADR's if you don't call at the very beginning of the booking window and the decided lack of variety in food choices, especially for our kids. I understand that lots of kids are picky eaters, but given the level of creativity Disney is capable of, one would think they could come up with more food choices.

[SBETigg]

I can't speak for the OPs friends, but I think it's the general long term trend you mentioned. Obviously it makes no difference whether I'm on the DDP or paying cash if I walk into Le Celier tonight and order a steak, I'm getting the same meat prepared the same way. But in the macro long term sense (and I'm just making up numbers here) what is happening is that really good steak dinner that used to cost $60 out of pocket has been reduced in size/quality/side dish selection so that the quality is comparable to the $30 chicken pasta meal.



I wasn't talking about the long-term trend. I agreed that long term, the dining plan has affected the food. But now that the DP is in place, the OP stated that this family felt their food was better this time specifically because they didn't buy the dining plan vs the last time when they did buy the dining plan and it wasn't actually a statement on the long term effects of the dining plan on the food. I was questioning that the food could have actually been better for someone off the dining plan vs someone using the dining plan ordering the same food from the same menu in the same restaurant? I don't think so. I just don't believe that the kitchen discriminates between patrons paying one way vs another.

[dnickels]

Maybe I mis-understood, I thought the OPs friends were comparing their experience from a year ago to their experience just recently? Did I miss something where they saw a night to night difference between being on DDP and paying out of pocket?

I agree with you there's no difference on a nightly basis but I think over a year there definitely is.

[SBETigg]

But in that case, your argument is that the food has gotten better since WDW implemented the DDP?

Now we're belaboring the point, but let me try to explain my position. My understanding is that the OP said the neighbor used the DDP a year ago and went without it recently, and they thought the food was better recently. The dining plan was still in place on both trips, they just opted not to buy it. So how does this fit the argument that the dining plan as made it all worse? Did I misunderstand the original post? The neighbors found the food better now, with the dining plan in place but just that they didn't buy it. This is not making a statement on long-term DP effects. This is saying that the food is better when you don't buy the currently offered Dining Plan. And I don't see how that statement could possibly be true.

[SBETigg]

Maybe I mis-understood, I thought the OPs friends were comparing their experience from a year ago to their experience just recently? Did I miss something where they saw a night to night difference between being on DDP and paying out of pocket?

I agree with you there's no difference on a nightly basis but I think over a year there definitely is.


But in that case, your argument is that the food has gotten better since WDW implemented the DDP?

Now we're belaboring the point, but let me try to explain my position. My understanding is that the OP said the neighbor used the DDP a year ago and went without it recently, and they thought the food was better recently. The dining plan was still in place on both trips, they just opted not to buy it. So how does this fit the argument that the dining plan has made it all worse? Did I misunderstand the original post? The neighbors found the food better now, with the dining plan in place but just that they didn't buy it. This is not making a statement on long-term DP effects. This is saying that the food is better when you don't buy the currently offered Dining Plan. And I don't see how that statement could possibly be true.

[MickeyMousse]

My neighbors made the point that the DDP food and service they had last year was definitely lacking compared to their recent trip when they paid OOP and ate at the same restaurants.

I have to wonder if some kitchens/servers might take better care of OOP vs DP. And yes, they know by the order receipts who is OOP and who is DP.

[DizneyRox]

My neighbors made the point that the DDP food and service they had last year was definitely lacking compared to their recent trip when they paid OOP and ate at the same restaurants.

I have to wonder if some kitchens/servers might take better care of OOP vs DP. And yes, they know by the order receipts who is OOP and who is DP.
In terms of service, yes, I would say it's possible that they got better service this year since tip IS NOT included than last year when they knew what the server was going to get.

In terms of quality of food, I agree, the chef's don't discriminate between DDP guests and OOP guests. Maybe it would come out to your table hotter/fresher than last year when they may not have cared enough, but that shouldn't make a huge difference.

But yes, long term food quality for the entire resort, including choice, quality of the food, quantity, have all suffered due to the DDP.

[MMFreak]

I agree with SBETigg.

If it was so bad how could it improve? By the way for those that suggested it was a tip thing, last year the diner was responsible for the tip just like this year so service would not have been the issue.

Perhaps they just happened to hit restaurants last year that had servers having a bad day (shrug). I think that Disney food is good. I have used the dining plan on some trips and other trips I have not. I find it easier as you know the bulk of your meals are paid for. We go to the same restaurants every year dining plan or not.

Everyone will just have to agree to disagree. Life is short don't sweat the small stuff. Enjoy an amusement ride, a parade, perhaps a show, the atmosphere. If you want 5 star dining I am sure there are other restaurants outside of Disney that can give you all of the attention and wonderful food that you require on your vacation :mickey:

[mermaidmarian]

I think the DDP has Disney Dining in a death grip; I think it is pure speculation whether the patient can be saved or not, although I am hopeful.

We have never done the DDP, as I am an avowed "winger" and the (since revised) 180 booking window, DDP, requisite ADRs and "winging" are wholly incompatible. Consequently, our dining habits at Disney rarely include TS dining now; we eat chiefly CS at the parks and FC at the resort, with notable exceptions for 1-2 character meals and a trip to the Biergarten each trip. A trip to Disney is no longer much of a dining experience.

It might help fill beds and parks for longer stays, but it has to be a money loser for the Dining Division and it has done a real number on the quality of their product.

I think they should eliminate the whole program and find other ways to create a perception of value for guests, without removing what is actually of value.

[Aurora]

My neighbors made the point that the DDP food and service they had last year was definitely lacking compared to their recent trip when they paid OOP and ate at the same restaurants.

I have to wonder if some kitchens/servers might take better care of OOP vs DP. And yes, they know by the order receipts who is OOP and who is DP.

A couple of questions:

Did they vacation at the same time last trip -- i.e. January or low season?

Were they talking about the variety of the food choices or just saying that the food was in general, hotter, tastier, etc.?

As an aside, hate to sound like an old fogey, but years ago (cue harmonica), one assumed that when you visited WDW, you were going to eat poorly. The food quality IMHO has risen in great increments over the last, I would say, 8-10 years, on and off the plan.

I do think they need to do something about the ADR debacle. I think that's just frustrating all the way 'round.

[mermaidmarian]

Did I misunderstand the original post? The neighbors found the food better now, with the dining plan in place but just that they didn't buy it. This is not making a statement on long-term DP effects. This is saying that the food is better when you don't buy the currently offered Dining Plan. And I don't see how that statement could possibly be true.

This is how I understood the OP as well. I agree that there could be no way that the fact of not being on the DP from one year to another (all other variables being equal) would have any effect on the quality of food/service received. For that to be true, there would have to be two tiers of service, product and menu offerings; one for DDP guests and one for non-DDP guests. To my knowledge, no such tiered system exists, and I would be greatly surprised to learn I was wrong.

[motherof4]

In response to your question about ddp I have 4 children 3 are teens and I wouldn't do disney without the dining plan it is great and they give alot of food so much to the point you are so full you can't move. there is no way I could afford going to disney and eating meals and snacks without being on this plan.It's up to you but if you have a large family it is totally worth it.

[DizneyRox]

It's up to you but if you have a large family it is totally worth it.
Can you explain how the size of the family matters? The cost for the DDP is $38.99 per adult. There isn't a discount for more than 2, etc, so the economics don't matter the more people in your party.

I know for us, we spend well less than the $80 per day the DDP would cost us on food. We would't normally eat until we couldn't move so why would I pay more for something that would make me feel obligated to?

Now, if you are talking about the "free" dining, YES, the more poeple you shove in the room and blanket them with "free" dining, the value gets better, but the guest limit on rooms tends to limit their exposure to this as well. Values ARE a better value with the "free" dining promotions. Moderates are less of one, and the deluxe are even less. This is why I believe ethat Disney will start offering different levels of dining plans based on the level of accomodations. Values will probably get the quick service plan, moderates will get the standard dining plan, and deluxe will get the deluxe dining plan. We'll see in a few months, but the quick service was just introduced so I'm almost willing to bet they are tweaking it for the eventual tiered "free" dining promotion.

[DisneyFr33k]

Lots of issues here. We personally love ADR's as we are a "planning" family. We like knowing when and where we will eat our table service each day and know we won't have to wait in line for a table - which can get long. We went last October and didn't find a decline in quality of food or service. We were disappointed in the changes to the DDP - tips no longer included and removal of the appetizer. If they had to remove something, at least make it a choice if would we like an appetizer or dessert.

Just our two cents. We all have different expectations and react to those being met or not.

[jszczur5]

And having to make those ADRs so far in advance is a bummer. I loved it when you could just walk up and get in, no hassle. This has all changed with the plan in place whether one buys the dining plan or not.

Oh my goodness, I must be in the minority here. I love the DDP (especially because it has always been "Free"). Planning our park days, and where we are going to eat each meal is the highlight of my pre-planning. I surf all the different boards, read dining reviews, look at people's pictures of food, drool for days, and plan accordingly.
Every year, we revisit old favourites, and try some new places. Some are a definite home run ('Ohana and Kona) and others are a mere single (Coral Reef), but I treasure the experience of each. Planning my ADR's is my favourite part!!
I don't feel the need to order the most expensive item on the menu, nor do we take most of the desserts offered at the CS locations. We don't abuse the program. We just enjoy it for what it is.

[TheRustyScupper]

1) For those of us who like great food, DDP KILLED dining.
2) For those who simply want to pig-out, DDP is wonderful. (Greed is good?)

NOTE - PERSONAL OPINION: The DDP has allowed people to take kids to finer eateries. Many kids misbehave or do not behave well, as they don't get to better restaurants often. And, many of the parents don't know any better. That is one reason we avoid Signature eateries at WDW. (Of course, we also say away due to the dumbed-down menus.)

[Hammer]

1) For those of us who like great food, DDP KILLED dining.

NOTE - PERSONAL OPINION: The DDP has allowed people to take kids to finer eateries. Many kids misbehave or do not behave well, as they don't get to better restaurants often. And, many of the parents don't know any better. That is one reason we avoid Signature eateries at WDW. (Of course, we also say away due to the dumbed-down menus.)

Rusty, I do not totally agree with your opinion, though I agree with it to an extent. It has dumbed down the menus at regular TS restaurants, but not the Signature Dining establishments. I'll use California Grill as an example. First time I dined there was 2000 (pre-DDP) and have been consistently dining there ever since. While there have been slight changes, the menu has basically stayed the same. Most of the sushi choices are the same or slight variations, goat cheese ravioli is still there, as is the signature pork tenderloin and Beef filet (though the sauce seems to change about every 3 months). A menu I viewed from December 2008 had an appetizer choice of seared loin of rabbit. Hardly a "dumbed down" menu choice. The only signature where I have seen a noticeable change to lesser cuts and menu choices is Artist Point and is consequently off our list (as is Yachtsman, but that is due to the high end steakhouses we can dine at home and Yachtsman doesn't offer any different experience than these places).

Now, as to the OP's question. It is my opinion that the DDP has watered down the choices at
1 TS credit restaurants, though there are one or two restaurants which still have a couple of unique entrées. It is just not at the level of variety that it once was. Personally, I've had at least good service if not higher at WDW restaurants, regardless if I am using the DDP on a trip or not.

[Maleficent's Dad]

I am not a fan of the DDP, but like DizneyRox stated above - the service would more likely be affected than the food quality in set restaurants. Chefs aren't picking out those who are on the plan vs. those who are paying OOP.

1) For those of us who like great food, DDP KILLED dining.
2) For those who simply want to pig-out, DDP is wonderful. (Greed is good?)
Well stated, and unfortunately, very true. Our society feels that "more is better." Very sad. I mean, really, do you have to glutton yourself to the point of being "stuffed" at every meal? Is that how a lunch or dinner is deemed to be of good quality today? Quantity over quality? Mass food over healthy portions? Really very sad. Just read some of the above posts - people freely admitting that they ate so much food ("too much food") and left restaurants so stuffed/full that they couldn't move. It makes me sad that this is what we've become.

Just look at the problems that our country is facing with health care due to obesity. And I'm not just talking about a small percentage - overweight = greater risk for health problems; this equates to greater burdens to the rest of the nation when it comes to health care premiums.

The DDP has allowed people to take kids to finer eateries. Many kids misbehave or do not behave well, as they don't get to better restaurants often. And, many of the parents don't know any better. That is one reason we avoid Signature eateries at WDW. (Of course, we also say away due to the dumbed-down menus.)
Well Rusty, on the rare occasion, I do have to disagree with you - but only to an extent.
Both of my kids go to Signature Restaurants in WDW often; but we have never utilized the dining plan. My kids do know how to be have, and we do expect them to do just that.
But I must admit, since we're in WDW, (1) we plan plenty of dining experiences for the kids (ie: Character Meals), and (2) I fully expect to see kids in most eateries - it is a family destination...

The only signature where I have seen a noticeable change to lesser cuts and menu choices is Artist Point and is consequently off our list
Good point, Christine - I'm always curious as to why more people haven't noticed Artist Point's demise. While not a total train-wreck, it is not the same place that it was three years ago - that is for certain. The quality - and to quote Jym - consistency have greatly diminished. Yet it still gets raves... :confused:

It is my opinion that the DDP has watered down the choices at
1 TS credit restaurants, though there are one or two restaurants which still have a couple of unique entrées. It is just not at the level of variety that it once was.
I believe that this sums it up best. Well stated! It was the point I was trying to make originally. :mickey:

[Utopia74]

Went in May of 05 with my best friend, just prior to the introduction of the DDP. Went again in May of 08 and used the Deluxe DDP.

From a food standpoint, I enjoyed May of 08 even more than May of 05. Getting an appetizer, entree, AND dessert all included was heaven, LOL..and we did it twice a day (TS for lunch, and TS for dinner). Without the DDP, I rarely got dessert or appetizer because I'm a tightwad by nature, but having it all included forced me to eat like a pig, and I loved it. (Though I can absolutely see how some might think that's too much food, especially the Deluxe DDP)

But in terms of menu quality, it really didn't seem all that different to me. We went to a lot of the same places in 05 and 08 (Coral Reef, Cali Grill, Flying Fish, Le Cellier, Boma, Kona Cafe, etc) and none of the menus seemed 'dumbed down' or inferior the second time around. Maybe you gotta go further back than 2005 to see the changes?? (05 was my first trip since like 93).

The only downside is that it is tougher to eat where you want to with ADR's. In 05, we made ZERO reservations ahead of time. We just totally winged it, calling for reservations the same day, and got everything we wanted. Last year, we called 2 months in advance for ADR's, and barely got a couple places (Le Cellier, Cali Grill).

All and all, the DDP is fine with me, and no use complaining about something that's probably not gonna change.

[Stickey]

The increased usage of the DDP has negatively impacted TS dining at WDW. I do not think that it has "killed" quality dining, but it has certainly damaged it. Reduced menu selection is the key factor.

Hopefully, the QS DDP will reduce the demand on TS restaurants. The DDP pushed increasing numbers into TS locations. Many of these people would not have been interested in visiting TS restaurants if they did not need to use TS credits. WDW management must rededicate itself to the goal of providing a variety of quality dining experiences at WDW.

We have never noticed a difference in the service, or food quality between our visits with the DDP and without the DDP. Service and quality appear most affected by the crowd level in the specific restaurant. An early ADR works better than a prime-time ADR.

ADR's are a vital part of making your dining plans at WDW. The return to the 90 day reservation period is a positive change. A system with no ADR's would create chaos and lost time. A small amount of planning is not difficult. Many forget that attendance levels at WDW have increased significantly over the years. Increased demand at TS locations is not due only to the dreaded DDP.

[cgriff]

To those who believe that the DDP has lead to limited variety and quality, what explains Yak & Yeti then? I was pretty sure that it was on the DDP, and it has been getting rave reviews for variety, quality, and portions...

[DizneyRox]

To those who believe that the DDP has lead to limited variety and quality, what explains Yak & Yeti then? I was pretty sure that it was on the DDP, and it has been getting rave reviews for variety, quality, and portions...
I think Yak & Yeti is NOT Disney owned and operated, which puts it in the same category as Rainforest Cafe (same owners actually). They can do whatever they want to with regards to food, etc. Not Disney's problem if they do or don't make any profit or how they go about making that profit. I might guess they make it more from the merchandise than the food.

[cgriff]

I think Yak & Yeti is NOT Disney owned and operated, which puts it in the same category as Rainforest Cafe (same owners actually).

That is interesting, Rox, thank you... So, outsourcing as a force for good... Y&Y *is* on the DDP, correct?

[Goes4FastPass]

The DDP didn't kill dining. Tinkering with dining to maximize profit at every turn has had a bad effect.

To those who say, "The economy has made it necessary for Disney to give customers less value for more money" I say, "Even my grandson knows Mickey is a person in a costume."

There's a lot of blame to go around here. A candy apple isn't a candy apple any more. It's carmel and chocolate and peanuts and raisens and sprinkles and icing and the size of a grapefruit. No wonder it can't be a DDP snack! Guests want it. Disney sells it.

[DizneyRox]

That is interesting, Rox, thank you... So, outsourcing as a force for good... Y&Y *is* on the DDP, correct?
I don't know about the DDP, never been a fan, I don't spend much time thinking about it or planning around using it.

Outsourcing is often a good thing [for profits] actually. For Disney, they don't need to worry about salary, benefits, etc. In the case of these outsiders having eateries, I presume that Disney is in some sort of contract where they get a certain amount of money for the location. There are rules in place the company must follow, but after than it's up to them. It's good or Disney because they can just bank on that money from licensing.

If they are on the DDP, I'm guessing that there's some agreement with Disney to get a certain amount per credit redeemed, and they just need to work within that amount. If they offset that with merchandise sales, or whatever, that's up to them. I'm just guessing on that end, but from what I've seen laces like Rainforest really do some brisk business on the merch. The food is the lure, but the money is in the "Made in China" trinkets.