Wait, Really?? REALLY??? [Archive]

Ian

11-23-2008, 07:58 PM

What hurts even more is that this year for the first time I am going to actually get to go to not one but TWO Eagles games... I'd hope they play moderately better next week and then sell the tickets for whatever you can get for them. No way I'd sit through one of these stinkers. :ack:

You can't even play the "Well at least we'll get a better draft pick" card because they don't know what the heck they are doing in the draft for the most part. Gold standard my fanny!Reid's horrific personnel decisions are the main reason this team is so terrible. There's like four guys on this entire team who can actually play.

He'll trade out of the first round again for two bags of Cheetos and a large pizza and then in the 3rd round he'll draft some worthless fat guy from McNee State that no one has ever heard of because he has "good character." Then he'll cut the guy after camp, even though we have no one else to play his position and he'll convert some other stiff from another position to fill in.

Those of you not paying attention, don't laugh ... that pretty much actually happened! :mad:

11-23-2008, 08:39 PM

36 to 7 ???? :rotfl::woohoo::joy:

Sorry, Ian... couldn't resist. The :thedolls: made me do it.

:D

sportsguy2315

11-24-2008, 12:43 AM

Look on the bright side, Brad Childress (ex-Eagle Offensive Coordinator) has the Vikes in the playoff race :) But hey, at least you haven't taken to chucking snowballs at the players (a la Norte Dame)

gueli

11-24-2008, 12:51 AM

Sorry,
Kind of a runover from another post Ian, But would you rather have Brett Favre now???

Sorry that your team has fallen so far & so hard...
Having been rooting for loosers for much of my life, I feel for you.

But like you say at least philly won the world series...(how far off is BB season?):mickey:

Itchy

11-24-2008, 07:24 AM

Sorry for your pain but apparently you have not been following the RAMS. I dont think that they could beat their way out of a wet paper bag.:(

JerseyMouse

11-24-2008, 08:12 AM

Say it with me, Ian...Pitchers and Catchers, Pitchers and Catchers.

I actually did some laundry from our recent 2 week WDW trip during the game.

For me, the most inexcusable part was Reid sending one of the coaches to tell McNabb he was benched. The ultimate slap in the face to a guy who once threw 4 TD's in a game for him on a broken ankle.

McNabb deserved better that this.

Epc0tphr34k

11-24-2008, 08:58 AM

the only thing andy proved by removing mcnabb from the game is that mcnabb is not the problem. I would honestly like to see marty mornhinweg shown the door before andy is. marty is the poorest excuse for a football coach known to man.

Ian

11-24-2008, 09:47 AM

For me, the most inexcusable part was Reid sending one of the coaches to tell McNabb he was benched. The ultimate slap in the face to a guy who once threw 4 TD's in a game for him on a broken ankle.I totally agree. It shows that, not only is Reid totally inept, he's also gutless.

If I was McNabb, I would have immediately marched over to Reid and gotten in his face. But unfortunately, that's not McNabb's style. He just doesn't seem to have any fire in his belly. I can't decide if this team has quit on Reid or if they've quit on McNabb.

Either way, it's time for wholesale changes. Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like it's going to happen. Most of the media "insiders" say that there's zero chance Reid will be fired.

Which means yes ... time to start counting down the days until pitchers and catchers report.

alphamommy

11-24-2008, 09:59 AM

I feel your pain. I'm a Lions fan. They've won one playoff game in my lifetime.

At least here, we have the Red Wings.

Ian

11-24-2008, 10:13 AM

You know, we have the Phillies here, so it's not like we don't have at least one winner in town.

But that's not the point. The point is, this team has been going in the wrong direction for not one, not two, not three, but four seasons and management hasn't done anything about it. They're making money, Reid is a good little solider and toes the company line ... so they don't care. They're businessmen, not football men.

I love football and I love the Eagles. I have for as long as I can remember, but this has got to stop. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Hammer

11-24-2008, 10:14 AM

Which means yes ... time to start counting down the days until pitchers and catchers report.

That's pretty funny from a guy who has admitted on these boards that baseball is his least favorite sport. You talk of your love of the Flyers. They seem to be doing well (hockey is my least favorite sport) so try concentrating on them :puck:.

We were listening to the game driving down the shore with my parents (who are up from Florida) so we could get a Bucs score. Merill Reese, who is can be pretty much a homer, couldn't find anything positive to say.

I am already planning my annual Spring Training weekend...

Mackflava99

11-24-2008, 10:19 AM

I was shocked to see McNabb benched- though he is not the brightest guy and always seems to try to force something to happen.
After last week's " I didn't know the tie rule" and " i hope it doesnt ruin the superbowl" remarks.... Donavan isn't going onto my All-sharp minded player team....

Kolb is really bad- but don't compare him to Pennington- Chad is a winner- regardless of his arm. If you had a big game to win and you had to choose between mcnabb and Pennington, who would you choose?
Oh Chad's arm is shot, but he finds ways to win

Ian

11-24-2008, 10:35 AM

That's pretty funny from a guy who has admitted on these boards that baseball is his least favorite sport. You talk of your love of the Flyers. They seem to be doing well (hockey is my least favorite sport) so try concentrating on them :puck:.I was speaking metaphorically ... in other words, pack it in. The Eagles season is over. Time to move on to something else.

And just to be clear, I said baseball was my third favorite sport behind football and hockey. I'm not much of a basketball guy.

But just because I like football and hockey more than baseball doesn't mean I don't like baseball. It's more like 1A, 1B, and 1C with basketball sitting at number 2. ;)

Hammer

11-24-2008, 11:10 AM

Ian, the Flyers are doing well, though, so you do have a sports team to make you happy now to take your mind off the Eagles. No need to wait for pitchers and catchers.

Since we are stating things for the record, I do like all the major sports (even hockey) but I am passionate about baseball, followed by basketball (both pro and college). Baseball and basketball get my disposable income, where as the other 2 do not, though I'll watch them.

Ian

11-24-2008, 11:15 AM

Yeah, but you can't get deep into hockey this early in the season. It's just a grind at this point.

After the holidays, then yeah ... I'll start getting into the Flyers heavy duty.

barnaby

11-24-2008, 12:38 PM

This Eagles team has declined in talent every year since the '04 season. The year with Garcia was a bit of an abberation.

I appreciate the fact that McNabb and Reid had some good years here.
But this team has been stagnant and going backward for a few years now.
Reid and McNabb's time has come to an end, IMHO.
Time to move on.

Start Kolb, lets see what he's got.

But its time to rebuild.

Ian

11-24-2008, 02:53 PM

The really scary thing is just how far from good this team might be.

I honestly believe the defense is good. I think their issue is primarily related to the fact they can't get off the field! If the offense could sustain some drives and give the defense a rest, I definitely think they're good enough.

You look at yesterday's game, for example. The defense held the clamps on Baltimore almost the entire game. But by the end, they were just gassed from being on the field for so long.

I think they could use some upgrades at defensive end and they absolutely have to move Lito along in the off season, but with some tweaks I think they'd be fine on that side of the ball.

But the offense?? That's another story. You potentially need new players at virtually every position outside of running back (and that's assuming you're okay with Westbrook and his injury problems). Yes, you can salvage some of our wideouts ... DeSean Jackson can obviously play and I think Curtis would be better with a top receiver on the other side of him ... but other than that the rest need to move on to browner pastures.

The line is aging badly. You have to figure out what to do with Runyan and Thomas. Shawn Andrews has obviously flaked and could quarterback possibly be a bigger question mark??

It's bad how far away this team really is. It's not a tweak here and a tweak there. They need a major overhaul and I have absolutely zero confidence that Reid can engineer it.

barnaby

11-24-2008, 04:55 PM

It's bad how far away this team really is. It's not a tweak here and a tweak there. They need a major overhaul and I have absolutely zero confidence that Reid can engineer it.

Agreed there.
This team has a long way to go. :(

Defense – I think they could use a few more playmakers. Dawkins is aging and needs to be replaced. And I am not sold on the LBs yet. And definetly on the D-line.
But overall, the defense is solid. They are on the field way too much and to see your offense stink that bad, it has to be demoralizing.

Offense – Many holes. Need a TE, FB, a true #1 WR to compliment Jackson and Curtis. You can’t run Reid’s offense with players that lack the talent to execute. The O-line is aging and your’e not sure what to expect out of Andrews. They could use a backup RB, maybe a guy good enough to split carries with the smallish and injury-prone Westbrook.
And I think McNabb is done. Give Kolb a chance. If Kolb flops , start over at QB too.

Overall, I think this team is several years from being capable of competing in a tough, tough NFC East.

Ian

11-24-2008, 05:08 PM

PirateLover

11-24-2008, 05:50 PM

The thing that people have to remember here is that for many years... we had a GOOD team. A team that went to four NFC Championships. A team that lost by 3 pts in a Super Bowl. A team that was supposed to be built to win it all... However at a certain point (after Super Bowl year I would say) it became blatantly clear that management/ownership stopped being concerned about WINNING and just was obsessed with money. It's hard to understand when you don't live in Philly, but the Eagles are no longer a team... they are a brand. And it's a shame because I don't even know how many thousands (not a typo) of dollars my family has spent over the years on this team. The funny thing is, my dad turned his back on the Flyers for a while because he was disenchanted with Bobby Clarke's treatment of Lindros and Roger Neilson. He also was mad at the Phillies for awhile because they were always either cheapskates or overpaying terrible players. Yet he refuses to totally give up on the Eagles. He thinks that if they do poorly, that maybe they will realize they need to change. I don't know that they will. I think the only way it changes is if we fans stop the cash flow, and I don't see that happening.

As far as me not going to the games, I can't sell them. I don't know if I made this clear but I have never been to an Eagles game in my life. My fiance was really excited to get the monday night tickets for my father and I. Even if they are playing badly, it's still a bonding experience. And my whole fam is going to the Dallas game. If they only win one game the rest of the season, it better be that Dallas game!

Ian

11-24-2008, 07:08 PM

On a somewhat related and equally annoying note, did anyone happen to catch the NFL Countdown crew chastising Eagles fans for being so hard on Reid and McNabb yesterday before the game??

I was like, "You have got to be kidding!!!" We've put up with FOUR YEARS worth of ineptitude now. In any other city, they'd be screaming along with us that it was amazing the coach still had a job. But since it's Philly and since the story has to always be about how ungrateful and terrible Philly fans are, they backed Reid.

Tom Jackson actually had the nerve to say that we better "be careful what we wish for!!"

Can you imagine????

Hammer

11-25-2008, 09:30 AM

Blame Canada!
By Lee Russakoff
Mon, 24 Nov 2008 22:11:24 GMT
Sadly, this is all going to be Donovan’s fault.

That’s what Andy Reid is going to try to sell you.

There’s nothing wrong with the system (what could be wrong with throwing the ball 764 times a game?)…it’s just the quarterback. Time has caught up with No. 5. Donovan had a good run, but he can no longer execute the complexity of Andy’s 400-page playbook (who would have thought there were so many ways to throw a three-yard out?).

Throwing the ball on third-and-one every time takes a youthful exuberance that McNabb can no longer muster.

It’s the quarterback that time has passed by, not the play-calling/scheme/talent evaluation.

Kevin Kolb will prove that.

Yup, that’s what Andy will be selling. Big Red will be touting his QB-in-waiting as the messiah. Kevin Kolb—the man with the small pedigree and even smaller arm—will be the man who will fix all of Philly’s problems.

You’ll see.

Sure, Kolb’s also the guy who threw the longest pick-six in NFL history and looked as bad as (if not worse than) McNabb in Sunday’s loss to the Ravens…but don’t think too much about that.

Just blame this all on McNabb and move on.

Andy won’t throw Donovan under the bus in his press conferences, of course. He’ll use his limited vocabulary to praise what McNabb has done for the Eagles, say this whole thing “starts with me,” and wish D-Mac all the best in the future.

But his actions will say otherwise. He thinks it’s Donovan. Has to. Because if it isn’t McNabb, it’s him…and that can’t be the case. Andy’s "too smart" to believe his system isn’t working.

So the ’09 Birds will cut ties with No. 5, return the rest of this average roster, and keep insisting on Big Red’s outdated scheme.

Reid will implicitly tell Philly, “It’s not me, it’s him.”

And it will ring just as hollow as when all of my ex-girlfriends say it.

McNabb has had a horrible year, and an even worse month. But until the guy who brought in the other 52 Eagles on the roster is gone, this team’s relevancy will fade faster than James Van Der Beek.

I’m no Donovan McNabb apologist. No. 5 is what he is--a very good NFL quarterback who has accuracy issues and a tendency to tighten up in close games. I’m not sure he can ever “win the big one.”

Still, to suggest the Eagles problems are in any way tied to Donovan’s flaws is ridiculous and antithetic to the evidence in front of our eyes. Donovan is the same guy, the same quarterback, he was when the Eagles made the Super Bowl.

It’s the league that has changed. And it’s Andy who’s failed to change with it.

The days of the “Greatest Show on Turf” are long gone. The West Coast offense craze has run its course. Defenses have adjusted, and the gimmick that was so hard to stop five years ago can now be shut down with relative ease. (Especially when you try to run it with no playmakers.)

Look at the teams succeeding in today’s NFL. The Giants have three running backs that pound on you, the Titans wouldn’t know a forward pass from the Tennessee Pass (which is ironically located in Denver), and the Ravens, the team that just throttled the Birds, go to the air less than John Madden.

Old is new again in the NFL. Teams that win control the clock by running the ball and stopping the run. Unless Andy Reid adapts to this “new” way of thinking, the Eagles cannot succeed.

Unfortunately for Philadelphia, adapting is one of Andy Reid’s many weaknesses.

And unfortunately for Donovan McNabb, blaming others and refusing to change anything about himself is one of Andy’s strengths.

barnaby

11-25-2008, 10:59 AM

Man ... tight end, wide receiver fullback, backup running back ... how long have we needed upgrades at these positions and yet year after year Reid either picks complete stiffs or just overlooks the positions completely and drafts another bust of a lineman??

Amen to that.
Reid good picks (Brown, Lito, Westbrook, McNabb) far outwiegh the bad ones (Justice, etc, too many to name:mad:).

The thing that people have to remember here is that for many years... we had a GOOD team. A team that went to four NFC Championships. A team that lost by 3 pts in a Super Bowl. A team that was supposed to be built to win it all... However at a certain point (after Super Bowl year I would say) it became blatantly clear that management/ownership stopped being concerned about WINNING and just was obsessed with money. It's hard to understand when you don't live in Philly, but the Eagles are no longer a team... they are a brand.

My family had season tickets all the way back to when they played in Franklin Field and I had them for a time with my dad duing the Ryan/Kotite/Rhodes years. When they moved to the Linc, we had to get rid of them because of the outrageous costs for the tickets and seat licenses. My dad was semi-retired at the time and I was in college, so we just couldn't afford the them. We sold them to a family friend, so my dad still gets to go a few times a year.

But your'e right, they were a good team. That 2004 team was very good, the offense was incredible. That 04 team could compete in the NFC East this season.
But the team has lost good talent (Owens), locker room presence (Reese), and has drafted poorly year after year since 2004. And it shows.

But I do think ownership wants to win. Because winning brings in money. No one pays to see a bad team. But I think Reid has just fallen behind and is now so far behind, catching up is gonna take alot. We may not see a playoff football team here in Philly for years.

Blame Canada!
By Lee Russakoff
Mon, 24 Nov 2008 22:11:24 GMT

......It’s the league that has changed. And it’s Andy who’s failed to change with it.......

......The days of the “Greatest Show on Turf” are long gone. The West Coast offense craze has run its course. Defenses have adjusted, and the gimmick that was so hard to stop five years ago can now be shut down with relative ease. (Especially when you try to run it with no playmakers.)....

Good article, I think he is spot on, especially about no playmakers. Reid's offense isn't going to get it done anymore, even with the talent needed to do it. He needs to adapt if he wants to still have winning teams.

One thing I do think though is that McNabb is too blame a little, more indirectly. I don't think his teammates have confidence in him anymore and I don't think McNabb wants to be in Philly anymore. So I think it is time to move on and start fresh.

Ian

11-25-2008, 11:01 AM

I could have written that article myself. It's the same things I've been saying for the last 5 years.

Sadly, I think he's exactly right. This same tired, pathetic "scheme" will be back next year with the same tired, pathetic players with the key exception that we'll have a rag-armed, unproven QB at the helm.

Hammer

11-25-2008, 02:22 PM

And it gets even better...another article from the same writer:

Gold Standard, Tin Cup

Since everyone is piling on Andy Reid, Donovan McNabb, and the Eagles these days (myself included), maybe it's time to tear into Jeffrey Lurie a little bit.

The man who gave us "The Gold Standard" apparently doesn't have enough money to pay his debts. Or, he just figures he needs $8 million more than the city of Philadelphia does.

The Philadelphia Inquirer is reporting that the Eagles have owed the city $8 million since 2001, and are refusing to pay.

According to the Inquirer, the city helped out the Eagles by building sky boxes in the Vet. The city agreed to let the Eagles keep all of the revenue for 15 years, but after that, both entities were supposed to split the money earned from the luxury seating.

That money, $8 million, should have come in 2001. It's seven years later, and the city has yet to see a dime. The city sued the team in 2004 for more than $10 million, including back payments and interest.

The Birds (current value, according to Forbes: $1 billion) maintain that the city caused a canceled exhibition game that led to losses for the team. They apparently feel that the city owes them money, and have countersued. So now that it's in the courts, there's no great hurry to settle up. Let the court costs mount up and sooner or later, they probably figure, the city will cry uncle and walk away.

With the city of Philadelphia running a record deficit, this is an outrage. You can't blame the Eagles for Philly's problems, but you can blame them for welching on a deal that was enormously profitable for the organization.

At a time when Philadelphians across the region are losing their jobs, and the city is closing libraries and other public works programs because of a severe financial shortfall, the 5-5-1 Eagles are making more money than the Philly mint.

Playing hardball with a city that has given the Eagles organization tax break after tax break takes some brass...but denying the city money at a time when it is struggling to stay above water--that's more pathetic than the product the Eagles are putting on the field.

Mr. Lurie, this city has supported your team at every turn and will continue to do so despite the mucky future that lies ahead. It's time you return the "favor" and pay Philadelphia the money it is owed.

PirateLover

11-25-2008, 07:51 PM

But I do think ownership wants to win. Because winning brings in money. No one pays to see a bad team. But I think Reid has just fallen behind and is now so far behind, catching up is gonna take alot. We may not see a playoff football team here in Philly for years.

I think they want to compete, not win. I don't think they want to be embarrassing losers though.

Ian

11-25-2008, 07:54 PM

Wow, Christine. That article is really an eye opener, in many ways.

What shocks me the most is that the media has apparently sat on this story for 7 years.

I guess it just goes to show how good the Eagles PR machine is at silencing dissent among the local press. You bad-mouth us, you get nothing.

Stich8818

12-04-2008, 03:28 PM

Ian I can see your fustration...but then look at me a Browns fan..Lets see..

- The star WR cannot even catch a cold ( apparently he needs another 5 hour energy drink)

- The tight end complains that his boss did not call him cause he was sick

- That said boss sends a profaine email to a fan

- The QB that most everyone wants to see,gets hurt in his second start, on a freak break

- Then the QB that was a pro bowler last year,gets hurt.

- Down to 3rd string QB starting this week against the TITANS!

- And of course there is the speculation that Bill Cowher may or may not come to Cleveland

I guess could be worse..could be a Lions fan (sorry to and Detroit fans)

-

Ian

12-10-2008, 02:21 PM

Browns fans have it tough, but hey at least their star wide receiver didn't shoot himself in the thigh like a dope.

I suppose now that the Eagles have won a couple games there will definitely be no regime change next season. It'll be the same story it was last year ... "We finished strong, if not for a few key injuries to Brian Westbrook, etc. etc. blah blah blah ... " so everyone will be back and it will be business as usual.

barnaby

12-13-2008, 03:00 PM

I suppose now that the Eagles have won a couple games there will definitely be no regime change next season. It'll be the same story it was last year ... "We finished strong, if not for a few key injuries to Brian Westbrook, etc. etc. blah blah blah ... " so everyone will be back and it will be business as usual.

I was thinking the same thing after they beat the Giants last Sunday. NOw they have a reason to keep Reid and McNabb.
Don't get me wrong McNabb has played well, but I just think it is time to move on.
Reid is frustrating too. It only took him 11 weeks to figure out they could run the ball. :mad:

It stinks when you have to root against your team to lose. :confused:

Ian

12-13-2008, 04:22 PM

Reid is frustrating too. It only took him 11 weeks to figure out they could run the ball. :mad:You know what really cracks me up?? All the sports pundits in town are all talking how Reid has suddenly had some epiphany about how he has to run the ball to win. And they talk about it like this is some first ... like it's never happened before.

I can remember at least two previous seasons (the Jeff Garcia season first and foremost) where the exact same thing happened. Reid passed and passed and passed and the Eagles lost and lost and lost and then suddenly, miraculously, Reid remembered the run and the Eagles started to win and SAINTS BE PRAISED Reid had finally figured out it was important to stick with the run!!

Hogwash ... if he does, in fact, stick around for next season (which he will) I can 100% guarantee you we'll be having the same maddening conversation at this time next season.

I'd be perfectly happy to have McNabb back next season. Even with all his flaws he's still one of the best QB's in the NFL. But Reid has got to go. :ack:

barnaby

12-14-2008, 01:13 PM

You know what really cracks me up?? All the sports pundits in town are all talking how Reid has suddenly had some epiphany about how he has to run the ball to win. And they talk about it like this is some first ... like it's never happened before.

I can remember at least two previous seasons (the Jeff Garcia season first and foremost) where the exact same thing happened. Reid passed and passed and passed and the Eagles lost and lost and lost and then suddenly, miraculously, Reid remembered the run and the Eagles started to win and SAINTS BE PRAISED Reid had finally figured out it was important to stick with the run!!

Hogwash ... if he does, in fact, stick around for next season (which he will) I can 100% guarantee you we'll be having the same maddening conversation at this time next season.

I'd be perfectly happy to have McNabb back next season. Even with all his flaws he's still one of the best QB's in the NFL. But Reid has got to go. :ack:

The sad thing is after making a run (pun intended) to the playoffs in 2006 with Garcia, Reid came out the next season and made a recovering QB McNabb throw the ball 40 times a game. :confused:

I'd wouldn't mind seeing McNabb back. He is still one of the best QBs in the league. Reid is the obvious probelm.
But I think this team needs to start over, and think it is time for oth to move on.

Ian

12-14-2008, 06:41 PM

The sad thing is after making a run (pun intended) to the playoffs in 2006 with Garcia, Reid came out the next season and made a recovering QB McNabb throw the ball 40 times a game. :confused:Exactly. And that's what's been, for me, the most maddening part about Reid's tenure with the Eagles.

To my untrained eye, this guy has had the same problems repeat year after year since he got here 10 years ago. As someone who would almost certainly be fired if I repeated the same mistakes over even half of that time period, I find it extremely mystifying that Lurie and Banner have kept him around this long.

That really leads one to believe whether or not winning is truly what this ownership is committed to. :confused:

Missy_Mouses_Dad

12-15-2008, 05:16 PM

Try being a Packer fan. We have a defense that is offensive and makes me sick to my stomach. An offensive line that is a shambles. Just got rid of a punter who could barely kick it past the line of scrimmage. And a very good quarterback in Aaron Rodgers (currently better stats than Favre), who is running for his life and not getting any credit for having a good season...Plus our gm is an idiot who trades down every draft to get "numbers" and the coach is about to be run out of town...we don't have a good basketball team, and lost CC on the Brewers. To top it all off it's 5 degrees with a windchill of -15. I will get home and the dog will probably have relieved himself on the bed..

barnaby

12-15-2008, 11:32 PM

Try being a Packer fan.

Still beats being an Eagles fan - at least the Pack has a Super Bowl win. And a few at that. ;)

Ian

12-17-2008, 02:06 PM

And a very good quarterback in Aaron Rodgers (currently better stats than Favre), who is running for his life and not getting any credit for having a good season...I can't speak for what people are saying about him around Green Bay, but on the national stage I think most people are recognizing how well Rodgers is playing. In fact, I just heard Mike & Mike (ESPN Radio) the other morning talking about how none of the Packers' collapse this year was Rodgers fault and how well he has played despite the lack of talent around him.

Plus our gm is an idiot who trades down every draft to get "numbers" and the coach is about to be run out of town...we don't have a good basketball team ... Sounds exactly like Philly!

To top it all off it's 5 degrees with a windchill of -15. I will get home and the dog will probably have relieved himself on the bed..:rotfl:

Now that was funny!

DAKustodial

12-22-2008, 11:05 AM

barnaby

12-22-2008, 12:19 PM

That was a horrible, horrible display of playcalling and quarterback play yesterday. Absolutely terrible. I know if Jackson catches that ball in the corner the game is tied up, but that was McNabb's only good pass of the day yesterday.

I don't know if I want to watch another game that Reid coaches or McNabb plays in ever again. It is THAT bad as an Eagles fan. I have tickets to the Cowboys game that I've been looking forward to for the entire season and I think I'm going to try to get rid of them. It really is a shame for Jim Johnson's defense too...they were brilliant again yesterday.

Not sure you can put that loss on McNabb.
There were 2 WRs out, wind was blowing 30, McNabb was off and the Skins were playing a 2 deep and dropped a safety for another CB.

And Andy throws the ball 46 times!!! :mad:

Sure McNabb was shaky, but the last drive when it counted he hit Jackson square in the hands and made some other good throws.

This loss and the fact the Eagles will most likely miss the playoffs lies squarely on the shoulders on Andy Reid and his stupid playcalling.

Sad thing is Andy will be back next year, McNabb will be gone, and we will be stuck with a rag armed Kolb. :(

Ian

12-22-2008, 01:15 PM

You know if the Eagles don’t fire Reid after yesterday’s game … you can be 100% certain that they don’t give a hoot about winning. That game was just a total microcosm of the same problems that have plagued this team since he took over.

Consider the following:

Despite coming off 3 games in which they won largely by having offensive balance between the run and that pass, Reid called 48 passes out of 62 plays yesterday. And that’s in a game where conditions on the field dictated the run (very windy) and they were missing two of their starting wideouts. At one point, Reid called 16 passes in a row.

Their time management was, again, miserable. It never should have come down to that final play running out the clock, because they shouldn’t have WASTED their timeouts like they always do. In addition, they ran like a minute 45 seconds off the clock down to the 2 minute warning to run just three plays. The biggest bonehead play of that final drive was one I haven’t heard anyone mention yet … they throw the ball to LJ Stiff … er … Smith for like 6 yards. He catches it and takes off towards the sidelines. Immediately after crossing the 1st down marker, he inexplicably turns the play back inside and gets tackled inbounds!! He gets 0 extra yards by turning the play inside and, in fact, probably gave up a yard or two vs. heading for the sidelines.

The Eagles had 7 dropped passes yesterday, which just showcases AGAIN the fact that their receivers are totally substandard.

Ian

12-28-2008, 07:29 PM

Okay ... so that was the single most exciting day in Eagle football I can remember in a long time.

Watching it unfold all day, having everything break right for the Birds in the early games, and then just watching them flat out embarrass the overrated (and hated) Dallas Cowboys ... that made my year.

PirateLover

12-28-2008, 08:23 PM

Try being at the Linc all day. What an experience. Glad I didn't sell that ticket!

barnaby

12-28-2008, 10:44 PM

What a roller coaster season. Frustrating, but in the end it worked out so far.

I just hope Andy sticks with the run next week. Gonna have to stop Peterson too.

Game is 4:30 next Sunday.

Daddy Mouse

12-28-2008, 10:50 PM

Try being a Lions fan.

DAKustodial

12-29-2008, 12:47 PM

I am the biggest sucker on the planet, but I'm happy that I am. I kept my tickets, went to the game yesterday, and had an absolute blast! I was getting text messages from my wife while we were tailgating a little, and everyone in the stadium knew that the Birds could get in with a win.

It is amazing though...Reid runs the ball and the Eagles put up a lopsided number. A lot of that was because the D kept scoring, but still. The Vikings game should be interesting next week!

Missy_Mouses_Dad

12-29-2008, 01:11 PM

Yesterday was the most enjoyable I can remember watching football in a long time. Da Barez lose, Da Cowboys lose, Da Giants lose...

There is nothing better than watching Mr. Jones cry as his beloved 'boys get spanked. How about an Eagles/Indy Super bowl. that way the Eagles can make both Mannings cry in one season...

Can Philly handle that many championships in one year?

magicman

12-29-2008, 01:53 PM

You know if the Eagles don’t fire Reid after yesterday’s game … you can be 100% certain that they don’t give a hoot about winning.

I wish they would have fired Mr. Reid when you recommended it a week ago.

As a Cowboy fan, it appeared that the Eagles & Mr. Reid cared about winning when it counted. (I wish I were fortunate enough to be rooting for a team in the playoffs...enjoy it:mad:;))

Ian

12-29-2008, 02:40 PM

I know people will rip me for this, but I still think Reid is very overrated and should be fired.

What I take away from games like yesterday's is this ... if the Eagles are capable of playing like that, how come they finished 9-6-1 and were so inconsistent all season??

Lately, it's become a hallmark of Reid teams, these mid-season collapses and late season miracle runs. But I blame the coach for not keeping his team focused (or himself, for that matter) all season and putting them in a better position to be successful.

And as DAKustodial pointed out, Reid runs the ball and he wins ... so why last week did he "forget" that and refuse to run the ball again?? He's maddening!

No, I'll root for my team (the Eagles), but Andy Reid is not the Eagles. The Eagles were around long before Andy got here and they'll be around long after he's gone. I'm a fan of the team, not the coach.

Pagan

12-29-2008, 02:59 PM

The Philadelphia Eagles.....the New York Jets of the NFC.

*ducks*

PirateLover

12-29-2008, 05:55 PM

I pretty much stand by all the statements I made earlier in this thread as well. When the Eagles win it's great, but there has been so much inconsistency with this team lately that I really think (and hope) this run will be the last hurrah with the current set up. I don't really care if we have to go into rebuilding phase for a year or two. To be honest, even if the Birds were to win it all this year, I would be happy, but not half as happy as I was for the Phils or as happy as I would've been had the Birds won in '05. That whole season was just a magical run that I'll never forget. I loved that team. There are very few people that I care about now on this team... I love Brian Dawkins, he's my hero. Also Westbrook and Runyan. Those are really the only three that I would love to see win it all. McNabb just makes me ill with his smugness. After yesterday's game he said "I proved you all wrong." Umm.. no. Try executing a hurry up offense at the end of a Super Bowl without puking and win the game, then you'll "Prove" something. :ack:

Ian

12-29-2008, 06:09 PM

I'll tell you, I wouldn't even include Westbrook in my list of players I like on this team. He really turned me off with the way he handled that whole overpayment thing and also with his contract re-negotiations.

Plus, he can't stay healthy. He's great when he plays, but ... he doesn't play enough.

And McNabb, yeah ... I mean that guy just doesn't get it. Never has, never will. I used to feel bad that that handful of idiots booed him at the draft, but honestly he's such a whiney crybaby that now I just don't even care.

PirateLover

12-30-2008, 11:54 AM

I was never quite sure what side I fell on with the Westbrook situation. I think that comparatively he was always underpaid and the Eagles could've done a good faith gesture and let him keep the dough. On the other hand, he did put his name on a contract (even though NFL contracts are the biggest joke since they aren't even guaranteed).

I wouldn't hold being injury prone against him as he isn't one of those players that milks an injury. He has played through many of those injuries and he plays his little heart out every time. I will never forget watching him run clear across the field chasing down the interception and assisting in the tackle during the Browns game I went to. He ran so hard that he could barely walk back to the sidelines. That image really resonated with me.

Ian

12-30-2008, 11:59 AM

I wouldn't argue that he plays hurt and plays hard every game ... in some ways he reminds me a little of Allen Iverson minus the attitude problem ... I'm just not a big fan of guys who reneg on contracts and I really was annoyed with the way he handed that $3 million.

He complained all season that he "wasn't getting paid", which was ridiculous. He spent money that he knew wasn't his!

barnaby

12-30-2008, 12:29 PM

Try executing a hurry up offense at the end of a Super Bowl without puking and win the game, then you'll "Prove" something. :ack:

Although McNabb definetely choked, try running a hurry up offense with no timeouts and little time on the clock beause the head coach wastes time outs and is the worst clock management guy in the NFL. ;)

Ian

12-30-2008, 05:28 PM

Although McNabb definetely choked, try running a hurry up offense with no timeouts and little time on the clock beause the head coach wastes time outs and is the worst clock management guy in the NFL. ;)Sort of a funny story related to this ...

We were watching the Minnesota and Tampa games this Sunday and my cousins and I were laughing like crazy because Gruden and Childress (both limbs of the Andy Reid coaching tree) had some horrific time management issues in their games.

We were like, "It runs in the family!!"

PirateLover

12-30-2008, 05:51 PM

Barnaby you are right, Reid was definitely the culprit who put him in that position. That being said, it's times like those that separate the champions from the also-rans. Right now, McNabb is still an also-ran and has proved nothing except that he never knows when to stop running his mouth.

PirateLover

01-11-2009, 07:55 PM

Boy, that old adage is true, "Winning changes everything." I still have my grudges against Reid and McNabb but boy was it fun to watch them kick giant booty in the 2nd half today. Reading through this thread, people who don't live here or follow this team like a religion as most of us do, probably think we are all nuts for complaining so much about a team that is headed to the NFC Championship for the 5th time in 10 years. :blush:

Ian

01-11-2009, 08:30 PM

Look ... outsiders can say whatever they want. And I'm sure they will.

But the fact remains that, when most of the things in this thread were said, the Eagles were playing like a dead dog. They deserved the criticism we heaped on them. It's not like they were playing well and just catching some bad breaks. They stunk.

I'm happy they've turned it around. I'm still not a huge fan of Reid. Naturally, though, I will root for the Eagles, as I always do. They're my team. I pull for them every week, but I also criticize them when they don't play up to potential. That's what fans do and I'll point it out again ... Andy Reid is not the Eagles. They were here before him and they'll be here after him.

Anyway, the way I see this just serves as vindication that we were all right to rip them. Obviously, they were dogging it, because we all see now that they're a much better team than what they gave us mid-season.

barnaby

01-12-2009, 01:06 PM

Just enjoying the ride.........:D

DisneyDog

01-12-2009, 01:13 PM

They are just paying homage to that famous Philadelphian -- Rocky Balboa. Down and out, but come back fightin' at the end.

Missy_Mouses_Dad

01-12-2009, 01:28 PM

I don't care what the reasons were for the Eagles win. I just like seeing Eli Manning (and his brother) pouting.

Both games s/b very good.

Jimenyfan

01-12-2009, 02:45 PM

I'm just enjoying this one game at a time. I've been an Eagles fan for to long to start getting excited about what might be.

PirateLover

01-12-2009, 04:50 PM

Ian I totally agree. They really WERE playing that terribly. I was just noting that if one hadn't watched those games they'd be really confused. The difference is night and day. I'm not jumping on the "destiny" bandwagon like so many others... I think many are extra excited because of the Phillies...but I am enjoying it.

diz_girl

01-15-2009, 04:20 PM

Ian

01-15-2009, 06:39 PM

Actually, Amanda, that's such a great Philly story ... I'm glad you shared!

barnaby

01-15-2009, 08:03 PM

my Dad (along with his brother) sold his season tickets at the end of last season.:( They had the tickets for almost 50 years. The Eagles haven't won a league championship in all of that time, so my guess is that they'll win this year. When I talked to my Dad yesterday, he said the same thing, before I even brought it up.

I wish that I could have bought them (3 tickets - section 117 - row 19), but I was just coming off of my maternity leave, which depleted my savings, so I didn't have the $20K to buy the stadium builder's rights from them.:(

My Dad started taking me to games when I was five, pre-Jaworski, I think that Roman Gabriel was the QB then. We used to live in Oxford Circle when I was a kid and I remember taking the L and then the subway to the games. Then we moved to the 'burbs (Lower Bucks County) in '77 and we started driving to the games. Which is where I began my appreciation of Merrill Reese. Sorry to wax nostaligc.

Oh well.

I have a similiar story.

My dad had season tickets when they played in Franklin Field too. He was at the 1960 Championship game. We had tickets at the Vet too. He used to take me during the Buddy Ryan era, than Kotitte and Rhodes. I was at the 2 losses in the wild card round when Ryan was coach. I was at the Giants game when Byars creamed Pepper Johnson. And also I was at the Monday nightgame where Cunningham bounced around like a ping pong all than zipped a TD pass into the end zone to Keith Jackson (I think it was Jackson)

But the season before the moved into Linc, they charged big $$ for the seat license and my dad was semi-retired and I was in college. So we couldn't afford to get the tickets but passed them along to a friend of my dads. Unfortunately, they aren't in my dads name anymore. :(

I haven't been to the Linc yet. ***** we got rid of the tickets when the Eagles started there run there. We got rid of the tickets before the last season in the Vet so fortunately we didn't get to see the Bucs beat the Eagles in the NFC Championship game.

I do miss going though. But they are so expensive now, I don't miss having to shell out the cash for the games. Plus, I have become a sissy since I hit my 30s and can't take sitting in the cold.

diz_girl

01-16-2009, 04:55 PM

Actually, Amanda, that's such a great Philly story ... I'm glad you shared!

Thanks.

Two other Philly stories to share (and I'll mention just these two, then I'll stop) -

There were several times when, before entering the stadium, my Uncle Mike (not the uncle who owned the tickets with my Dad) would give me his bottles of beer so that I could hide them in my jacket. They didn't frisk kids, so I would walk right in with the beer. I think that he also had my sister smuggle in beer when she went to the games.

One time when, after getting off the L after a game, my Uncle Mike persuaded my Dad to go to a bar with me in tow. This was back in the 70's when it was OK to bring kids into bars (real bars, not the TGI Friday's kind). It was my first time in a bar. Mom was not amused. Of course, this is the same Mom who, when I was five and home sick, dragged me to the bowling alley anyway and just gave me an empty coffee can in case I was sick. I brought that up in conversation with my parents about 25 years later. Dad was not amused.

barnaby

01-16-2009, 09:11 PM

There were several times when, before entering the stadium, my Uncle Mike (not the uncle who owned the tickets with my Dad) would give me his bottles of beer so that I could hide them in my jacket. They didn't frisk kids, so I would walk right in with the beer. I think that he also had my sister smuggle in beer when she went to the games.

Thats too funny because my dad and bro-in-law used to have me do the same thing. They pay'd me like 50 cents a beer. :D

Ian

01-17-2009, 07:37 AM

Thanks.

Two other Philly stories to share (and I'll mention just these two, then I'll stop) -

There were several times when, before entering the stadium, my Uncle Mike (not the uncle who owned the tickets with my Dad) would give me his bottles of beer so that I could hide them in my jacket. They didn't frisk kids, so I would walk right in with the beer. I think that he also had my sister smuggle in beer when she went to the games.

One time when, after getting off the L after a game, my Uncle Mike persuaded my Dad to go to a bar with me in tow. This was back in the 70's when it was OK to bring kids into bars (real bars, not the TGI Friday's kind). It was my first time in a bar. Mom was not amused. Of course, this is the same Mom who, when I was five and home sick, dragged me to the bowling alley anyway and just gave me an empty coffee can in case I was sick. I brought that up in conversation with my parents about 25 years later. Dad was not amused.Oh man ... classic!!

DAKustodial

01-18-2009, 11:09 AM

Just a few hours away...I am so hyped up for this game I can't even sit still for two seconds. I've been watching Brian Dawkins videos on youtube all weekend and I put on my #20 jersey as soon as I woke up this morning. Go Birds!

Ian

01-18-2009, 11:37 AM

Yep ... DS and I are already sporting our #20 jersey's, as well.

DD will put her McNabb jersey on (don't ask ... the only pink jersey I could find in her size) at game time.

:thumbsup:

PirateLover

01-18-2009, 12:05 PM

If I'm home (like today) I don't put my #20 jersey on until right before the game. We're a pretty superstitious family. Got the ribs all seasoned up and ready to go into the oven in a little under an hour. Here we go....

PirateLover

01-18-2009, 12:07 PM

Yep ... DS and I are already sporting our #20 jersey's, as well.

DD will put her McNabb jersey on (don't ask ... the only pink jersey I could find in her size) at game time.

:thumbsup:

You didn't HAVE to get her pink! ;)
I've never had a pink jersey. I did buy pink Eagles and Phillies hats to support breast cancer charities though.

Jimenyfan

01-18-2009, 05:00 PM

Grrr, really allowing 24 points in the half. I haven't given up just expressing my frustration.

Ian

01-18-2009, 09:17 PM

barnaby

01-18-2009, 09:48 PM

So once again, Philly fans prove that they know more about their own team than anyone else.

I had to endure a week's worth of people (including McNabb) telling me why I had to eat crow for criticizing them and then they go right out and prove that I was correct all along.

I'm sorry ... this team cannot get it done with Reid at the helm and McNabb under center.

People will try very hard to slough the blame off on Jim Johnson's defense, but the truth is McNabb was horrible in the first half (they should have been at worst tied with AZ at the half) and he had a golden opportunity to prove everybody wrong about him at the end ... 2 and 1/2 minutes to score a TD and what does he do?

Same thing he always does ... mess all over himself.

The fact that I had to endure a week's worth of, "I told you so's" from McNabb and his patsy Deion Sanders only to be forced to watch him once again throw away a Championship Game he should have won? Wow ... words can't express my feelings right now ...... :mad:

The defense got them there and let them down in the biggest game of the season.

But your'e right, it was all McNabb.

I have a theory - they lost as a TEAM.
McNabb was erratic, but still had a good second half.The receivers dropped balls.
The defense couldn't stop them the first half, was great for 20 minutes of the second half, but allowed a 7 minute drive in clutch time.
McNabb is McNabb and looked nervous in final mintues. But Curtis dropped one in his hands on 4th down.
And Andy Reid still hasn't figured out clock management.

And oh yeah, lets give a credit to Wizenhut and the Cards' players for a well-executed game plan.

But with all that said, yes I want to see Reid and McNabb gone because they have proved so far that they can't win when it counts.

Time for a fresh start, even if that takes a couple of bad years.

gueli

01-19-2009, 01:04 AM

The fact that they got this far after falling apart in the first part of the season... speaks wonders for a coaching staff- even if they cannot get you all the way there.

I doubt very highly that andy reid will be fired after this "succesful" season-

They had a horrible first half, played well in the third quarter and had a chance at the end. Heck they even took the lead.
But give credit to a team that has been horrible at times (I cant believe the Jets pasted them sooo bad)- who "shouldn't even be here" (the championship game) Arizona played well, and I think everyone- including the eagles underestimated them and their defense (which rose to the occasion).

Good Luck next year.

2Epcot

01-19-2009, 01:28 AM

Arizona played well, and I think everyone- including the eagles underestimated them and their defense (which rose to the occasion).

Arizona has been underestimated for quite some time. I covered the Cardinals when they first came to AZ in the 80s. We took our entire show up to Northern Arizona for a week to cover their first training camp after leaving St. Louis. As a long time fan of the Cards I'm happy to see them make it to the big game. Twenty plus years of mostly loosing seasons, I know even the most loyal fans are a little suprised at their success this season. I'm sure they will be the underdog going into the Super Bowl, but that seems to work for them.

I think new facilities seem to energize the AZ teams. The Suns got to the finals in '93, their first year in their new arena. I'm hoping the Cards have a better outcome in the championship game then the Suns did.

Ian

01-19-2009, 06:25 AM

I will agree that the Cards played a near perfect game, which they had to in order to have a shot.

I will also mention that they got some BIG assistance from the refs who seemed to forget what the pass interference rule is all about. Oh yeah, and holding seemed to have gotten by them as well.

At the end of the day, I agree with barnaby. They lost as a team. Offense let them down early, Akers missed kicks, defense let them down late, and Reid coached poorly again.

In short, the entire team once again :ack:

diz_girl

01-20-2009, 10:01 AM

:(

Classic Eagles performance.

A good team, but not a great one.

Ian

02-28-2009, 03:01 PM

I'm thinking of retitling this thread, "Wait, Really??? The Eagles let Dawkins go to Denver??? REALLY?????"

DAKustodial

02-28-2009, 03:55 PM

The organization just proved beyond any shadow of a doubt what they are all about, and that is money. They're an estimated $48 million under the salary cap and they wouldn't give Dawkins a two year deal. The guy stated several times that he wanted to finish his career here and he is not washed up like people thought he was earlier last year.

I am just fed up with this whole regime. Lurie, Banner, Reid, Heckert...whoever was in charge of this decision is an absolute joke. The reason Philadelphia belongs to the Phillies now is because they at least show a little bit of loyalty to their players. This is a terrible day...I need an adult beverage! :beer:

PirateLover

02-28-2009, 05:26 PM

DAKustodial I am with you on all counts, including the adult beverage. Going to a party tonight, and am certain their will be a few toasts in honor of Weapon-X. He was one of the last big reasons I still had any interest in seeing the Eagles do well. I think I might finally be done with this current incarnation. Let's Go Flyers, Let's Go Phils!

Ian

02-28-2009, 11:05 PM

You'll all notice that I never once changed over to an Eagles helmet avatar like I do every year ... they clearly have no interest in winning.

They're a total bunch of frauds and people in Philly are finally, for the most part, seeing through their lies. You can't hide $48 million under the cap and not spending in free agency.

Especially not spending a few shekels to sign one of the best players in Eagles history. You can bank on the fact that next football season my avatar will be a #20 Denver jersey.

gueli

03-01-2009, 09:37 AM

Talk about changing the face of a team. As I recall wasn't Dawkins one of the major reasons that philly's D played so well in the games leading up to the postseason ?
If I recall correctly andy reid said that his 2 cornerbacks are the main reason that the D was performing so well ?
I take it that you do not think there is a long or short term game plan or reason behind this apparent insanity ? Is it just the owners cheaping out ? Do they have anyone slotted for taling dawkins place ?
I was going to ask you about the DB that philly just traded to the jets, and now I have to ask is that more of the same ?

Ian

03-01-2009, 10:08 AM

Well Lito (the CB we sent to the Jets) was just disgruntled with his contract and basically quit on the team when we signed Asante Samuel.

In his defense, the Eagles were kind of unfair to him. I assume he did something that angered the front office at some point, because we went from the penthouse to the outhouse almost overnight and it wasn't his play that put him there.

Anyway, he's a good player and now that he's somewhere where he's happy he'll contribute.

Dawkins is a tough call ... they have a young guy Quinten Demps that I guess they think is ready to step in and play, but my fear is more what Dawkins' loss will mean to the locker room. He was the heart and soul of this team, which is something our front office has never paid the slightest bit of attention to.

In the Eagles' defense, though, they've typically been right with this stuff in the past ... Bobby Taylor, Troy Vincent, Hugh Douglas, Jeremiah Trotter ... none of those guys really had anything left when the Birds cut ties with them.

barnaby

03-01-2009, 12:53 PM

First off, a BIG thank you to Brian Dawkins for his play on the field and his class off the field. He will be missed and will be remembered as one of the greatest players and leaders to ever put on an Eagles uniform

With that said, as much as I like Dawkins, he is one of the core guys on the teams that have been good, but never good enough.
Him, McNabb, Tra Thomas, Runyan, and yes even Westbrook (who is always hurt).
Time for this team to move on.
And not re-signing Dawkins is a start, and I doubt if Thomas and Runyan will be back.
Now if we could only talk Laurie into making Andy Reid a coach only or getting rid of Reid and starting completely fresh.

And Dawkins has repeatedly not shown up in the big games, just like McNabb.
How did Dawkins play in the NFC Championship game this year? :confused:Only time I saw him is when he was giving up a TD. :(
But Dawkins always gets the free pass because of his passion and heart.
But it is what it is, as much dancing and crying after games as Dawkins has done, he still has come up small when the Eagles needed him most.
Eagles fans won't say it, but look back at the playoff games the Eagles lost, and tell me how Dawkins played when the team needed him most.

This deal had nothing to do with money - Dawkins got 17 mill over 5 years with 7.2 mill guaranteed.
The Eagles in the past have always let guys his age walk, I was surprsied when they resigned him a few years ago.
The Eagles stuck to the formula they always have - don't resign older players to longer term deals.

PirateLover

03-01-2009, 02:00 PM

If they got rid of Reid and McNabb too, then yea, I'd be ready for a fresh start. But Dawk is my hero, man. I'm younger than the rest of you, so I grew up watching this guy. He is my favorite Eagle that has played in my lifetime. Right now we are finally transferring this year's epic Dallas game from DVR to DVD... B-Dawk was just leading the crowd in "Fly Eagles Fly"... I was there for that game, it was such a great day to be a fan and he was a big part of it. It almost brought me to tears. Yes I know that all things must end and that Dawk has been fading. But he wasn't done. You don't win defensive player of the month on reputation alone. Runyan and Dawk were the only ones left who I felt a real connection to. I'm ready for a whole new regime now.

Ian

03-01-2009, 06:20 PM

This deal had nothing to do with money - Dawkins got 17 mill over 5 years with 7.2 mill guaranteed.
The Eagles in the past have always let guys his age walk, I was surprsied when they resigned him a few years ago.
The Eagles stuck to the formula they always have - don't resign older players to longer term deals.Well, I don't really agree with anything you said at all ... Dawk can't win games alone ... but this last part is just totally incorrect.

Know how I know? Because THE EAGLES OFFERED HIM A CONTRACT!!

If it was truly just a case of the team "being ready to move on with an older player" then they never would have offered him a deal at all.

They wanted him back, they just didn't want to pay him what he was worth. They never do. That's why they're always signing guys off the scrap heap with busted up knees. As soon as a guy actually asks to be paid fairly they let him walk.

They're cheap. Period.

barnaby

03-01-2009, 07:53 PM

Well, I don't really agree with anything you said at all ... Dawk can't win games alone ... but this last part is just totally incorrect.

Know how I know? Because THE EAGLES OFFERED HIM A CONTRACT!!

If it was truly just a case of the team "being ready to move on with an older player" then they never would have offered him a deal at all.

They wanted him back, they just didn't want to pay him what he was worth. They never do. That's why they're always signing guys off the scrap heap with busted up knees. As soon as a guy actually asks to be paid fairly they let him walk.

They're cheap. Period.

I never said the Eagles weren't cheap. :confused:
But I am not going to turn this into a Dawkins bashing thread for me, so I'll keep my point about money short.
Dawkins signed what is a basically a 2 yr/9 mill guaranteed deal. Isn't Dawkins worth more than that?????? So what does that tell you about whatever the Eagles offer was? Seems to me the Eagles weren't serious about signing him, which was exactly my point

Same goes with his playoff performances. Watch the playoff losses closely and be objective, and you'll agree with me.

Dawkins is a great player, great leader and is an even better person. He'll be missed by the players and the fans.

Ian

03-02-2009, 10:19 AM

I'm not trying to say Dawk hasn't lost a step ... he definitely has and he's not the coverage guy he once was.

But trust me ... there's a way to fit him into this system. People keep wanting to write Dawk off as "done", but hey ... let's not lose sight of the fact that he was one of only two Eagles who made the Pro Bowl last year and he was defensive player of the month in December.

He had a lot left to give in other areas and Denver saw that. For a team that is $48 million under the cap to refuse to shell out a paltry $7 mil to the guy who has been the heart and soul of this team for 13 years is disgusting.

The Eagles want everyone to swear undying loyalty to them, be a company guy, give their all, but when it comes time to maybe give a guy a little more than you'd like to as a way of saying thanks ... no way. Then you're "done" and it's "time to move on."

I am absolutely spending money on two things next season ... a #20 Denver Broncos jersey and a ticket to the Broncos v. Eagles game at the Linc.

Guess what I'll be wearing at that game ...

Ian

03-02-2009, 10:21 AM

Oh and one other thing ... does anyone besides me wonder what this team is actually planning on spending that $48 million on??

It seems to me they're of the opinion that there are no players out there worth spending money on. I guess that $48 mil will just go right into Banner and Lurie's bank accounts ...

DAKustodial

03-02-2009, 11:53 AM

Ian, you're right on with everything you are saying and I feel the exact same way. If they truly didn't want him and thought he was done, they wouldn't have offered him a contract at all. Instead, they completely insulted him and offered the man who was the heart and soul of this team, not to mention a seven time Pro Bowler, a ridiculous two year deal that was WAY less than he is worth.

I can't blame Dawk for taking the Broncos deal. I'm sure he was hurt and you can tell from hearing his voice in the interviews on Comcast that he absolutely did not want to go and he might even have some regret now. The Eagles front office should be embarassed and ashamed. They trot out that company man Dave Spadaro and try to tell you that Dawkins is done and his skills have eroded...that's just insulting to the fans.

Last thing here, they are not going to find a way to spend the money that they have. Joe Banner has gone on the record and said that they couldn't spend all of that money even if they tried. Just remember everyone, Joselio Hanson was offered more money per season than Brian Dawkins...that's a joke.

barnaby

03-02-2009, 12:10 PM

I am not going to drag Dawkins name through the mud anymore.

I will leave it at this - Dawkins will be missed here in Philly and I wish him the best in Denver.

Ian

03-02-2009, 03:25 PM

Instead, they completely insulted him and offered the man who was the heart and soul of this team, not to mention a seven time Pro Bowler, a ridiculous two year deal that was WAY less than he is worth.Just to keep things straight, the Eagles did not offer him a two year deal and that was the sticking point. He wanted at least 2 and the Eagles only offered one.

I had Eskin on and he was basically saying the Eagles didn't want to commit to Dawk beyond 2009. They feel like Demps will be ready in 2010 and he's gonna be their guy there.

Also, I don't totally disagree that his skills had eroded. I'm certainly not saying he's the player he once was. What I am saying is that the Eagles found a way last season to use him and use him effectively and I think they could have continued to do that.

Bottom line to me is that it would have cost basically nothing the Eagles can't afford to give him a very, very front-loaded 2 year deal and then, if you truly have a guy ready to step in and fill his shoes, let him walk after 2009.

diz_girl

03-02-2009, 09:39 PM

DH told me the news and I just said, "This is probably the beginning of a painful few years."

I just can't see the the Eagles continue to play at the level that they have for the past decade. We've been pretty spoiled for the past few years, I mean, they've been to five NFC Championship games over the past decade. Plus, I've enjoyed annoying Cowboys fans by reminding them of the fact that the team hasn't won a single playoff game since 1996. :)

At least we'll have the Phils to sustain us, for a little while.

tjstrike

03-03-2009, 04:00 AM

I think you should all jump ship and become Steeler fans...LOL

Pittsburgh's right down the road right ?

Ian

03-03-2009, 09:06 AM

At least we'll have the Phils to sustain us, for a little while.You know ... I've been thinking about this a bit.

This current ownership doesn't remember back to the mid-80's when this team couldn't sell out their stadium and had games blacked out on T.V.

They assume it's always been like this and, no matter what baloney they try and pull on the fans (like oh ... cutting payroll by $48 million and raising ticket prices $10 per in the same year??) they'll just keep coming back.

It ain't like that and, if anything, this team should feel MORE pressure because of what the Phillies are doing. I know people (myself included) who are returning to their original sports fan roots and switching their primary allegiance back to the Phils from the Eagles.

I know everyone scoffs at the notion that the Eagles could ever not sell out a game, but I don't agree. If they keep this up they'll find out just how quickly things can fall apart.

Scar

03-03-2009, 10:03 AM

I know everyone scoffs at the notion that the Eagles could ever not sell out a game, but I don't agree. If they keep this up they'll find out just how quickly things can fall apart.Throw in the state of the economy and how many people are unemployed and it may happen even quicker than that.

Ian

03-03-2009, 10:05 AM

Right ... think about how this sounds for a minute ...

This team is $48 MILLION under the salary cap. Yet they let a truly beloved member of the team walk away over a couple million bucks.

At the same time, they raised ticket prices in an economy where most companies are trying to give things away just to keep their heads above water.

Does this sound like a group that gets it to you?? :mad:

diz_girl

03-03-2009, 11:47 AM

Does this sound like a group that gets it to you?? :mad:

IMHO - it seems to me that few people worth what Lurie is worth acrually do get it. I mean, the team is worth $1 Billion. Few billionaires "get it". The only one who does is probably Warren Buffett, since he doesn't live like a billionaire.

Lurie doesn't get it because the waiting list for season tickets is about the number of seats that are in the entire Linc. Once the economy starts seriously eroding the waiting list, then maybe he will get it, but not until at least then, if at all.

Ian

03-03-2009, 12:53 PM

I agree, Amanda.

First off, I don't think Lurie and Banner have ever really understood or connected with this town and the fan base. This is a "lunch pail" town and he comes from the Blue Bloods of Boston.

Secondly, this entire franchise, for whatever reason, just exudes a certain level of inexplicable arrogance. The whole baloney with the "gold standard" and "pedal to the metal" and all that ... for a team with ZERO Lombardi's, their high-and-mighty routine is just so hard to understand and tolerate.

Truth is, there's NO WAY any meaningful change is going to come to this organization unless Lurie gets seriously embarrassed somehow (like 3 or 4 Lions-esque performances) or if he gets hit squarely in the wallet.

DAKustodial

03-03-2009, 01:48 PM

You're right about the two years, Ian, word is they didn't offer him two. I posted that when that was still the word on WIP, before Eskin and his sources reported on it.

Anyway, I agree that his skills had eroded and he isn't the same player that he once was, but they wouldn't have offered him anything at all if they truly felt that he couldn't play at a high level. The fact that they made him an offer means that they wanted him back. Like I said before and like you have said, this was only about money. I don't understand why they couldn't overpay the guy for taking less on his last FOUR contracts with the team. He gave them a hometown discount every time and was never the highest paid safety even when he was the best safety in the game.

Ian

03-03-2009, 06:50 PM

Okay ... so Dawk was on Sports Talk 950 with Jodi Mac today and here's kind of the gist of what he said. This was also somewhat confirmed on 610 this morning by Hugh Douglas:

Basically, this is his story on the turn of events with the Eagles (at a very high level):
Dawk sits down to negotiate with Eagles
Eagles repeatedly remind him he is 36
Eagles downplay his ability excessively and lowball him
Dawkins is offended enough to walk away and test the free agent market for the first time in his career (most likely at the encouragement of his agent)
Dawkins goes to Denver and they blow him away with the offer (he said basically the offer he signed was the one they came at him with out of the gate)
In a fit of anger and resentment at the Eagles he decides to sign the Denver offer
He never gave the Eagles a chance to counter the Denver deal because, in his words, they gave him the impression there was no room for negotiation
There was evidence he might be having some buyers remorse and wishes he had taken more time to think it over and possibly give the Eagles another shot
The entire interview will be broadcast on 950 at 10AM tomorrow.

Also, Banner is supposed to be on with Eskin tomorrow at some point. Not sure when, but it will most likely be available as a podcast on their site when it's over.

PirateLover

03-03-2009, 08:00 PM

wow... just wow. I certainly can't blame him...

barnaby

03-04-2009, 12:21 PM

I know people (myself included) who are returning to their original sports fan roots and switching their primary allegiance back to the Phils from the Eagles.

Probelm is that you are in the minority.
Philadelphia is and always has been a football town. Heck, the Flyers are the 2nd rooting interest most years over the Phillies.

Basically, this is his story on the turn of events with the Eagles (at a very high level):
Dawk sits down to negotiate with Eagles
Eagles repeatedly remind him he is 36
Eagles downplay his ability excessively and lowball him
Dawkins is offended enough to walk away and test the free agent market for the first time in his career (most likely at the encouragement of his agent)
Dawkins goes to Denver and they blow him away with the offer (he said basically the offer he signed was the one they came at him with out of the gate)
In a fit of anger and resentment at the Eagles he decides to sign the Denver offer
He never gave the Eagles a chance to counter the Denver deal because, in his words, they gave him the impression there was no room for negotiation
There was evidence he might be having some buyers remorse and wishes he had taken more time to think it over and possibly give the Eagles another shot

So, it goes back to what I said originally - age.

Also from the interview:
Was owner Jeffrey Lurie involved in the negotiations?
“I don’t know if he was involved in the negotiation, but I feel like if perhaps he was things would be different right now.”

Interesting statement there from Dawkins about Lurie.

And what doesn't Lurie get?
He is a businessman,period. The Eagles are worth 5X what they were when he bought team. Why? Becuase he thinks with his head, not his heart like too many Eagles fans.

To me when a fan says "This group doesn't get it" it translates to "I am mad because the front office doesn't do as I, the fan, says."