Why DVC does or doesn't make sense for me

[dlpmikki]

This thread is to replace the two seperate threads on Why Join DVC and Why not to join DVC.

Discussion is welcome but not repetetive back and forth argument. The topic that has seemed to be most common in causing repetitive and unproductive argument has been on DVC finances and cost. The other posts (which remain stickied) have pages of argument on that point. If I see too much repetition or "I'm right, you're wrong" argument I will be editing and deleting posts as necessary. Hopefully it won't be necessary.

DVC has never sold itself as a financial investment. DVC is not cheap. You can make very good arguments either way on the money front but at the end of the day it is a personal decision as to what is good value for you.

Please come in and give / discuss your views. :mickey:

[DVC Mike]

Membership in the Disney Vacation Club is not for everyone. I consider it a luxury purchase. If you are not in a position, financially, to make a luxury purchase, then perhaps you should not be considering DVC.

DVC can make sense financially -- assuming you would always stay in a deluxe resort. If you always stay in a value resort, then it won't -- but that's not an apples-to-apples comparison. The DVC resorts offer deluxe amenities and room size.

DVC membership might make sense if you meet most or all of these criteria:

The cost of membership and dues does not appear to present a financial hardship.
You vacation at Walt Disney World frequently: ideally at least once every two years.
You plan to continue vacationing at Disney World far enough into the future to make the membership at least break even.
You prefer to stay in Deluxe or DVC accommodations and/or you stay a long time (10 days or more per year). If you always stay at a Value resort, or always stay off-site, or you really spend the entire day at the parks away from your hotel, and you don't spend time at the resort itself (other than crashing at the end of the day), then DVC may not be for you.
You are able to plan your vacations well in advance -- ideally 7 to 11 months out. If you aren't a planner, don't even look at becoming a DVC member. If you can't plan and book your vacations 11 months in advance, and staying at a particular DVC resort is important, then don't join DVC. If you really don't care which DVC resort you end up with, then it's not an issue.
You can do without daily mousekeeping and room service (of course, you can pay extra and get mousekeeping as a DVC member).
You desire more space than a typical resort room (such as a 2 bedroom villa, with full kitchen, living room, 2 bathrooms and jacuzzi suite, and even a washer/dryer).
You’re not looking at DVC as an investment or a way to make money (it’s not). It is a decision to prepay, at today's rates, the next several decades of Disney trips.People say that timeshares, in general, are a bad use of your money. I would generally agree. However, DVC timeshares have something that most timeshares don't have -- a great location that is in extremely high demand. Also, resale values for DVC contracts have remained high.

If the only consideration is whether it makes financial sense, then maybe you should be staying offsite and only eating offsite as well, since that beats staying onsite. Beyond just the financial considerations, DVC membership is emotionally satisfying (you “own a piece of the magic”), and it gives you a reason to take a vacation at WDW.

Buying a DVC membership is a rational, financially viable option for some people: namely people who plan to stay in the higher-end accommodations at Walt Disney World on a regular basis.

Buying into DVC is almost a lifestyle choice. A DVC purchase is a way of committing to an annual Disney vacation with family and friends. For some people, that may outweigh any financial considerations.

Only you can determine if DVC membership makes sense for your situation, based upon your lifestyle and financial capabilities.

I happen to have the disposable income available, and I was excited to commit to regular visits to WDW. I am a happy DVC member, and would recommend the program to those who fit the above criteria.

[Horizon93]

I agree with everything that DVC Mike has said. DVC is not for everyone. 10years ago, it was not right for DW and me. It is right for us now as we visit WDW once or twice every year for about 12-14 nights. We look at it as prepaying our vacations. As Mike said, if we wanted to be completely financially based, we would only rarely ever go to WDW, would stay offsite and eat offsite. But that is not what we want. We love being DVC members and we are looking forward to decades of great vacations for us, our families, and friends.

[magicofdisney]

In the original thread that was closed, I posted that this last year my family stayed at Disney over 35 nights. Including tickets, we were able to do this for around $5300. Yes, we stayed at the value resorts in order to do this (and we're FL residents). My entire point is that I WANT to stay at Disney for more than 10-15 nights per year and I want to do it for the least amount of money as possible. We are a family of 6 and DVC will not allow us to affordable stay as long as we like. For whatever reason, this point was lost in the discussion.

Now, an interesting fact I learned from that discussion is that the point value system (i.e. 97 points a week during value season) will not change over the course of ownership. That is definitely food for thought.

[Here we go again...]

Now, an interesting fact I learned from that discussion is that the point value system (i.e. 97 points a week during value season) will not change over the course of ownership. That is definitely food for thought.

I think that is what sold us. We know seasons change, but points do not.

It is perfect for us because not only do we hope to continue to go to Disney for years to come, but we want our children and their families to be able go to. For them, room prices are out of the equasion. They only have to worry about food and park tickets.

Also, with DVC we will always vacation in deluxe accomodations. Now we can stay at our favorite resort whether we have 3 people in our party or 12. With regular resorts you have to stay at POR or a deluxe once you hit 5 people. Right now with my kids and grandkids we have a group of 7.... I expect that to grow.
Next November we are planning a week in a 2 bedroom villa. I have not decided where yet. We will book in our home resort then decide at 7 months out if we want to change. So, next use year instead of 2 weeks we are taking 1 week with our whole family.
I already have Stan booked to take our family photos while we are there. What more could you ask for???:cloud9:

[goofy for pluto]

The main reason DVC does not make sense to me is that amount of beds you get in the room.
Do I really want to pay so much money to stay for a week at WDW and have my son sleep on a sofa bed? If there were two beds in the bedroom that would make sense. But 1 bed does not. With myself, DH and 1 child {12} we still would not have two beds untill we get a two bedroom unit, and that uses a lot of points all at once. If my DS wanted to bring a friend we would have to bring some inflatable bed or a cot to have a place for them. {Not so easy on the plane.} I can't see him and a friend sharing the sofa bed at their age and especially as they get older.
I know that SSR has those nice new design sofa beds, but the point of being a member is to try the other resorts as well, and other trip reports I have read have said those sofa beds are not so great.
So how do you all get around this problem. I would love to be a DVC member but I just can't seem to justify the amount of money I would spend to stay in order to get a unit big enough to have a real bed for my DS to sleep in.

[Horizon93]

The OKW studios have 2 beds. SSR, AKV, and i think BWV all have the new sofa beds.

[dlpmikki]

So how do you all get around this problem. I would love to be a DVC member but I just can't seem to justify the amount of money I would spend to stay in order to get a unit big enough to have a real bed for my DS to sleep in.

Old Key West has two beds in a studio.

[Donald A]

I am a DVC member and am getting ready to take my first trip with my points. I am going to take my family including my parents, wife's parents, and my two brothers next month to stay at the Beach Club Villas. We are getting 2 two-bedroom villas for 5 nights during value season (Sunday-Thursday night).

We bought in for 150 points at Saratoga Springs. By the time I pay this off with finance charges (if I don't pay it off ahead of time) I guess you could say that those points cost me $20,000. You average annual dues (that are now about $650) and say they average out to $1000 a year for those points. You put that into the 48 year or so contract and that is a total cost of close to $70,000.

This next trip is something I always wanted to do for our family before we have kids and my brothers get married and move away. If I would by these two villas outright for the exact nights I book, the cost would be $7000 ($3500 for each villa). This is on two years of points. So, say I take this exact trip every other year at the same time for the same points for the life of my contract. The cost would be in today's dollars, $168,000!

For my $70,000 I more than doubled my money in 50 years. But the catch is the price of these rooms will go up and the points will not. So who knows what the actual value will be, $200,000 or even $300,000. Plus, currently being a DVC member gets one discounts that add up.

I know that a good finance man could invest my money and get me a good return. I am a doctor, not a finance guy so I don't know.

I'll tell you what I do know. I love Walt Disney World. I can leave knowing I get to go back. In fact, as we leave for this trip we are going to make reservations for another next Christmas.

I literally feel like I am part of the magic. I actually own a percentage of a building on Disney property. That is neat for me. I get a special magazine and publications from DVC. I am reminded quite often that I belong to this. Some people buy season tickets to sports and I enjoy that too, but this is something better.

Material goods can get stolen and new cars break down and are eventually replaced. Memories, however, last forever. These trips are something I can always remember and are often something much more valuable than the money it costs to make them.

[goofy for pluto]

24 trips to WDW divided by $70,000
would that not be $2,916.66 for each vacation.
and that is assuming that the fees do not go up more than you are expecting, and of course that is only for the room itself.
I think that WDW has figured out that they can charge a lot for rooms, have the members pay for the upkeep of the properties. Charge extra admission for evening events. (MVMCP, MNSSHP, P&PP) close down attractions and leave buildings empty. and they will not have to worry about attendance because they have so many people who have a signed contract to come down and stay in a room with no maid service,( a lot of rooms with only one bed.) and will pay a large sum of money to do so.
So tell me again why this is such a great deal for members? :confused:

[Donald A]

24 trips to WDW divided by $70,000
would that not be $2,916.66 for each vacation.

Yes, it would. :mickey:

I do not think our fine moderator, Mikki, wants much back and forth discussion about numbers. However, I will say $3000 a trip in which I can take 8 people ending up with essentially 4 bedrooms and two living areas with kitchens (washers and dryers too) makes sense for me personally. To top it all off, all of this in a deluxe resort at Walt Disney World.

Not only does that make sense for me for the trip I will take in a few weeks, it makes sense for me in a trip I will take in 20 years (where $3000 will likely not be the same as it is today).

Like I said, I can't discuss returns for money with investments. I do not know much about that. All I do know is that I could not take this trip if I wasn't a member of the club. These two Villas for the time I am going next month would cost me $7000 just for the villas ($3500 each). Sure, I could get like 4 rooms at a value resort for 5 nights for like $500 a room for those nights ($2000). For my one big vacation a year I prefer deluxe resorts. 4 rooms at a deluxe would be like $300 a night for each room or $6000 total for the 5 nights.

It is just what I like and what makes sense to me. That being said, Disney is a business. I am perfectly aware that they are using my money to build resorts at no or little cost to them. They are using my money in annual dues to run this whole thing and keep the buildings nice with upkeep. I think, for me it is still worth it.

[Horizon93]

It is absolutely worth it. For those of us who value being DVC members and see the benefits to ourselves and our families, in financial, and more importanly quality of vacation terms, it makes perfect sense. I also clearly see that Disney ultimately benefits from my membership, but I bought the product called DVC. It is what i wanted, my wife and I personally see value in that product. As has been said, it is not for everyone.

Some of the points that are used to say that DVC is not a value could apply to any time share. For that matter, people who do not understand why so many of us here at Intercot are willing to pay for repeated vacations to WDW may think tha we are all wasting our $$. So, whether you are a DVC member, or a loyal WDW onsite guest in one of the great cash resorts on property, we are all quite similar.

[NJGIRL]

[QUOTE=DVC Mike;1473051][FONT=Trebuchet MS]People say that timeshares, in general, are a bad use of your money. I would generally agree. However, DVC timeshares have something that most timeshares don't have -- a great location that is in extremely high demand.

I own a timeshare and think it's great especially if you go on vacation every year and don't want to be crammed into a hotel room. But I can't understand what you are saying in your quote above. My timeshare I will own forever and have traveled all over the world with it including staying at some resorts in Florida that are 5 mins away from Disney and was alot cheaper than the Disney timeshares. How are timeshares a bad way to use your money but a Disney timeshare which you won't have forever and can only travel to one place a better way to use your money.

[Horizon93]

[QUOTE=DVC Mike;1473051][FONT=Trebuchet MS]People say that timeshares, in general, are a bad use of your money. I would generally agree. However, DVC timeshares have something that most timeshares don't have -- a great location that is in extremely high demand.

I own a timeshare and think it's great especially if you go on vacation every year and don't want to be crammed into a hotel room. But I can't understand what you are saying in your quote above. My timeshare I will own forever and have traveled all over the world with it including staying at some resorts in Florida that are 5 mins away from Disney and was alot cheaper than the Disney timeshares. How are timeshares a bad way to use your money but a Disney timeshare which you won't have forever and can only travel to one place a better way to use your money.

I am not necessarily agreeing with Mike. I really don't have enough information on other timeshares to judge them. In terms of owning for the rest of my life, I will be 98, God willing, when my AKV contract expires. If I am still going to WDW, I will hope for a good extension deal. But what Mike says about larger Disney accommodations is a good point. For those of us who want to stay in a DVC resort, and have a priority booking advantage, it makes perfect sense. And we can use our points outside of DVC. That is not always easy from what I hear, but it is not always easy for other timeshare owners to book a DVC stay.

[NJGIRL]

Beleive me I'm not disputing that a Disney Timeshare is money well spent but I looked at them and also own a non disney timeshare that I can pass on to my son at not extra cost to him. My timeshare is for two weeks and it is a 2 bedroom, 2 bathroom, full kitchen, living room and dining room at a beautiful resort with 6 pools. All that I am saying is a disney timeshare is no better than any other timeshare when it comes down to the financial end. In fact from what I was told when deciding weather to buy one or not is that the disney timeshare was less of a deal when compared to the non disney timeshare. After having a timeshare all of these years I hate when we stay at a hotel because we feel cramped so I understand why people like them but basically a timeshare is a timeshare Disney or not.

[DVC Mike]

People say that timeshares, in general, are a bad use of your money. I would generally agree. However, DVC timeshares have something that most timeshares don't have -- a great location that is in extremely high demand.

I own a timeshare and think it's great especially if you go on vacation every year and don't want to be crammed into a hotel room. But I can't understand what you are saying in your quote above. My timeshare I will own forever and have traveled all over the world with it including staying at some resorts in Florida that are 5 mins away from Disney and was alot cheaper than the Disney timeshares. How are timeshares a bad way to use your money but a Disney timeshare which you won't have forever and can only travel to one place a better way to use your money.

Timeshares are typically a bad investment. You are putting a bunch of money into a depreciating asset. Similar to buying a new car, the typical new timeshare looses up to 50% of it's value the minute you sign on the dotted line.

With DVC, this is not the case. DVC maintains it value due to two things: 1) they are in a high-demand location (WDW), and 2) Disney exercises their ROFR on resales. Both of these keep the resale value of DVC higher than your typical timeshare.

Depending on where your timeshare is located, it may be difficult to trade out. Again, this is not a problem with DVC, as there are loads of folks who want to trade in to DVC.

Non-DVC timeshares are best purchased on the resales market (much like buying a 1 or 2-yr old car).

And yes, non-DVC timeshares are "forever", but will you be around forever? Even if you pass it on, will your grandchildren enjoy staying in a 100-yr old condo?

[NJGIRL]

Timeshares are typically a bad investment. You are putting a bunch of money into a depreciating asset. Similar to buying a new car, the typical new timeshare looses up to 50% of it's value the minute you sign on the dotted line.

With DVC, this is not the case. DVC maintains it value due to two things: 1) they are in a high-demand location (WDW), and 2) Disney exercises their ROFR on resales. Both of these keep the resale value of DVC higher than your typical timeshare.



I'm not rying to get into an agrument here but this being a Disney site I think sometimes people don't realize Disney isn't the only place people vacation. Other locations are very high demand and the fact that Orlando has sooooo many hotels, timeshares,rentals etc. it is a fairly easy place to trade into any time of the year. Also any timeshare I have been in is kept very nice. That is what the maintenance fees that you pay every year is used for.



Depending on where your timeshare is located, it may be difficult to trade out. Again, this is not a problem with DVC, as there are loads of folks who want to trade in to DVC.


I have never had a problem trading out of my timeshare as long as I trade 6 months in advance. As long as you deposit in advance your trading power is pretty good.

Non-DVC timeshares are best purchased on the resales market (much like buying a 1 or 2-yr old car).

And yes, non-DVC timeshares are "forever", but will you be around forever? Even if you pass it on, will your grandchildren enjoy staying in a 100-yr old condo?

As far as I know Disney has never torn down a hotel so the Grand and Poly are older than any timeshares I have stayed in. Of course if things are not kept up they will go down hill but again that is what the maintenance fees are for.

Again I'm not saying that it doesn't make sense to buy a disney timeshare if that's what you what to do but it really is no different that spending your money on any other timeshare.

[dlpmikki]

I'm not convinced that there is anything new being added in the back and forth about whether Disney timeshares are any different to other timeshares value wise. (This from someone who owns both a Disney and a non-Disney timeshare). No timeshare is an investment in money but in your vacation. True that my Disney timeshare could still be sold for more than I paid for it but that may not continue. True that my other timeshare will leave me with an interest in the property long term but that may leave me with more bills to.

This isn't a productive discussion and unless you really have something new to add please drop it. I don't want to edit/delete unless I really have to. Thank you.

[bjlaac]

I've posted reasons in the previous threads about why DW and I didn't purchase a timeshare at Disney. However, in reading the reasons to join, many have stated they compare the timeshare to a deluxe resort.

I'm not looking for an arguement but just an honest answer. What does the Timeshare offer above Carribean Beach, Port Orleans or Coronado Springs that make it a deluxe in many of your minds? Transportation to the Parks, Restaurants? Maid Service? Pools? Food Court?

Thanks

[Horizon93]

I am not looking to argue either. I firmly believe that DVC is not for everyone, but it is for me.

The DVC resorts have many amenities that moderates do not. For that matter, many amenities that deluxe resorts do not. The kitchenettes in the studios, the full kitchens in the one bedroom villas and larger, the washer and dryer in the one bedroom and larger villas. The ability to stay in a grand villa. The perks of membership, such as the AP discount, and the overall different feel of a DVC stay.

Not to mention point charts that will essentially stay the same for the life of each resorts contract.

[comicguy]

I know for us, right now a DVC does not make much sense. As we always stay at a value resort and spend most of our time outside of the resort at the parks or DTD.

I feel that the DVC is a good deal. I will probably buy it in about 10 years depending on finaces at the time?

[DVC Mike]

What does the Timeshare offer above Carribean Beach, Port Orleans or Coronado Springs that make it a deluxe in many of your minds? Transportation to the Parks, Restaurants? Maid Service? Pools? Food Court?


The 1-BR units I typically stay in at the four DVC resorts I own have:

Room Service
Free Valet Parking
More Room (710-814 sq ft versus 314 sq ft at a moderate)
Jacuzzi tub
1 King-size bed a Queen sleeper sofa
a full kitchen (with all the basic cooking utensils, pots, pans and dishes supplied)
a living room
washer and dryer in room
great onsite restaurants (Artist Point, Jiko & Boma, Yachtsman Steakhouse, Flying Fish Cafe, Spoodles)
Balconies (typically 2)
Indoor, A/C hallways
Elaborately themed pools with awesome themed slides
Boat service to parks
Character Dining
Fitness CenterThere is a huge difference between DVC and the Moderate resorts!

[DVC Mike]

I know for us, right now a DVC does not make much sense. As we always stay at a value resort and spend most of our time outside of the resort at the parks or DTD.

I feel that the DVC is a good deal. I will probably buy it in about 10 years depending on finaces at the time?

I agree with you, comicguy. DVC won't make much financial sense to someone who always stays at a value resort or never spends any time at their resort.

[Aurora]

I like the word "product" when you're talking about whether or not DVC makes sense. That's exactly what you're buying. If you buy another high-priced "product," like a car, everyone knows it depreciates and no one is likely to say, wow, that's a terrible investment. Because it isn't one. It's a car.

DVC makes sense to us because we already were buying the same "product," a two-bedroom villa for our extended family to vacation together, regularly, for a lot more money. So because we had the chance to buy the exact same product at a more reasonable cost, that made sense.

P.S. Stayed on one of the new sofa beds at SSR in December and it was like sleeping on a foam-covered board with a ridge right in my shoulder blade. Very uncomfortable, IMHO.

[Here we go again...]

The 1-BR units I typically stay in at the four DVC resorts I own have:

Room Service
Free Valet Parking
More Room (710-814 sq ft versus 314 sq ft at a moderate)
Jacuzzi tub
1 King-size bed a Queen sleeper sofa
a full kitchen (with all the basic cooking utensils, pots, pans and dishes supplied)
a living room
washer and dryer in room
great onsite restaurants (Artist Point, Jiko & Boma, Yachtsman Steakhouse, Flying Fish Cafe, Spoodles)
Balconies (typically 2)
Indoor, A/C hallways
Elaborately themed pools with awesome themed slides
Boat service to parks
Character Dining
Fitness CenterThere is a huge difference between DVC and the Moderate resorts!
I agree with everything you said. And, I want to add this...
Depending on how you are able to do thing financialy, this almost becomes a mind game. We were lucky enough to pay for our 210 points at SSR in cash. So, we only have to consider the yearly dues with our membership. If we book right, we get 3-4 stays per year with our points, depending on season and length of stay.
There is no way we could stay at a moderate resort for $745 (what we paid in dues this year) for more than 1 week per year. So, for us, we get Deluxe accomodations with much more room and we feel like we are getting something for nothing.
So, like I said, it is a mind game.... "do you want to go to Disney World next month? The room is free!" ;)


P.S. Stayed on one of the new sofa beds at SSR in December and it was like sleeping on a foam-covered board with a ridge right in my shoulder blade. Very uncomfortable, IMHO.
My DD and her friend stayed on the sofa sleeper and said it was horrible. We are going to start bringing an air mattress with us instead. That way we can lean it up against the wall during the day and not have to open and dlose the sofa.
I wish all studios would have the 2 queen beds. The reason we are staying at OKW for the second time is because we can get the 2 beds.

And here is one more option to those thinking about just money...
I rented points to a friend of mine so she could come with us in February. I only charged her the cost of our yearly dues for the 1 week she is staying. That came out to just over $10 per point. She could not have stayed at a value for what I rented her the points for and my dues were paid for the year. So, the rest of the year truely is free for us!! :D This was a win - win situation for both of us.

[Ian]

Basically, we should just sticky DVC Mike's original post in this forum and close everything off to further discussion. He laid out, as clearly as you can, when DVC makes sense for you.

It's obviously not for everyone, for the reasons Mike specified. It's a personal decision, a primarily emotional one in some ways, that everyone has to make on their own.

One thing I will say, though, is that I think some people dismiss it out of hand without ever really stopping to listen to what's being said or to really think about the benefits DVC provides.

I can say that with a degree of confidence, because I used to be one of those people. I figured if Disney is pushing DVC on me so hard, it must be heavily slanted in their favor. But when I finally stopped and sat down and really listened to my Sales Guide I realized I was being foolish and really passing up a lot of benefits.

One other thing not mentioned here ... $100 off AP's ... if you have a family of four, that's $400 right in your pocket each and every year.

[dlpmikki]

One other thing not mentioned here ... $100 off AP's ... if you have a family of four, that's $400 right in your pocket each and every year.

Ian, that benefit has only been around a couple of years and like all others could be changed at any time. I do agree that it is a great benefit while we have it!

[adoptionislove]

I am enjoying these posts. Both the pro's and con's. One question though...what are all of the abbreviations? Is there a cheat sheet somewhere that I can look up what all this means? (I am polish and I do things a little slow)!!!!!! LOL:)

[Ian]

Is there a cheat sheet somewhere that I can look up what all this means? (I am polish and I do things a little slow)!!!!!! LOL:)Ask and ye shall receive!

Abbreviations (http://www.intercot.com/infocentral/Abbreviations/default.asp)

[Nurse Kim]

We are taking our first trip to Disney in March and I am strongly considering DVC. We are staying offsite this trip because we can't seems to make staying on property affordable to us. By staying offsite we are saving almost $1000. We have a family of 5 and would like to purchase points for a 2 bedroom villa. I guess no matter how many times I look at the points chart it just don't make sense to me. The chart I have seen shows 350 for example. Does that mean that resort takes 350 points to stay there?
How do I figure out how many points it will take to stay at the resort we want? I have heard not to purchase more than we need to stay at the resort we choose.

My last question is if I bought 120 points and they are $13 a point does that mean we pay 1,560 every year for our points or do we pay 1,560 once and then just our dues every year.

I have read and read and I just can't understand things.

[Horizon93]

Congrats on booking your first DVC trip!

In terms of the cost of points, the current price is $104 per point at Animal Kingdom Villas or Saratoga Springs.

The minimum initial purchase from DVC is 160 points.

[dlpmikki]

We are taking our first trip to Disney in March and I am strongly considering DVC. We are staying offsite this trip because we can't seems to make staying on property affordable to us. By staying offsite we are saving almost $1000. We have a family of 5 and would like to purchase points for a 2 bedroom villa. I guess no matter how many times I look at the points chart it just don't make sense to me. The chart I have seen shows 350 for example. Does that mean that resort takes 350 points to stay there?
How do I figure out how many points it will take to stay at the resort we want? I have heard not to purchase more than we need to stay at the resort we choose.

My last question is if I bought 120 points and they are $13 a point does that mean we pay 1,560 every year for our points or do we pay 1,560 once and then just our dues every year.

I have read and read and I just can't understand things.

Have a look at info central for general information on how DVC works - or ask a general question in the forum. A lot of folks won't look here because it is just about pros and cons.

There are two costs with DVC - the initial points cost and the annual maintenance charge which is also per point and does change. Ball park figure $100 per point to buy and currently around $5 per year maintenance.

To use the points is more complicated because there are nightly and seasonal charges. If you go low season and Sunday - Thursday it will need far fewer points than high season weekends.

You may also want to look at Animal Kingdom Lodge villas as they actually have a one bedroom designed to sleep 5 people which would obviously be far fewer points for you than a two bedroom anywhere.

If you want to get a better feel for how many points you need just post a new topic in the DVC forum saying what time of year you like to go, where you want to stay and for how long. Folks will be happy to give you sample points usage based on that.

[DVC Mike]

We are staying offsite this trip because we can't seems to make staying on property affordable to us. By staying offsite we are saving almost $1000.


Cost wise, it will always cost less to stay offsite than onsite -- including DVC. If you're happy staying offsite, then don't consider DVC. For me, staying onsite is part of the magic of vacationing at WDW.



We have a family of 5 and would like to purchase points for a 2 bedroom villa. I guess no matter how many times I look at the points chart it just don't make sense to me.

How do I figure out how many points it will take to stay at the resort we want?

I have read and read and I just can't understand things.

links removed as per terms of service

[hlkeck]

Just to weigh in -- I was very thankful for the old thread and all the back and forth, even though it wasn't that productive - because it helped me to hear everyone's perspective (good or bad).

We decided YES to DVC. We also have the Disney Visa Card, which we have moved most of our bills to - and we earn Disney Dollars that we can pay our DVC yearly fees with. That takes the $700/yr fees out of the equation for us.

AND - we sometimes have to be forced to take vacations, so now, we are sure we'll take one yearly (2 this year!)

[lockedoutlogic]

In the original thread that was closed, I posted that this last year my family stayed at Disney over 35 nights. Including tickets, we were able to do this for around $5300. Yes, we stayed at the value resorts in order to do this (and we're FL residents). My entire point is that I WANT to stay at Disney for more than 10-15 nights per year and I want to do it for the least amount of money as possible. We are a family of 6 and DVC will not allow us to affordable stay as long as we like. For whatever reason, this point was lost in the discussion.

Now, an interesting fact I learned from that discussion is that the point value system (i.e. 97 points a week during value season) will not change over the course of ownership. That is definitely food for thought.


Just one thing...you are from florida...which means you are more than likely never going to step foot on a plane to get to WDW....you most likely use Florida annual or seasonal passes...which provide a very good discount

So this discussion isn't really directed to those that are in your situation

If you want to spend 35 or more...or roughly 10% of the year...at WDW...more power to you.

But there are most likely very few of us outside of driving range that could even fathom doing that...with the added cost of airline, fuel....rental cars....or other transportation fees.

Those that aren't at WDW so frequently are often likely to spend more on food and merchandise per visit as well...as being there is more exotic. Not maybe to the adults...but definitely the children.

So I agree that DVC probably wouldn't be right for you for a long time....but it is more because the system isn't designed for those who are THAT into being there...and it is not meant to be offensive....just pointing out that it is a completely different scenario....

You would need a minimum of 240 points of year if you only stayed M-Thurs at OKW in a studio for 30 nights in low season...that is a minimum and provides no flexibility

So really...you are correct in that it's not for you....

for someone who loves deluxes, lives in the northeast, is a former local resident and employee, got married there, has traveled at least 3 times a year annually since leaving...is just starting a family...who has other family with DVC....who wants to use it outside of Orlando through exchange and now disney's expanded offering in California, Hawaii and beyond....
...it is perfect


I don't think that the point was lost in the discussion...it simply just doesn't apply in anything other than a tiny fraction of cases

[lockedoutlogic]

Basically, we should just sticky DVC Mike's original post in this forum and close everything off to further discussion. He laid out, as clearly as you can, when DVC makes sense for you.

It's obviously not for everyone, for the reasons Mike specified. It's a personal decision, a primarily emotional one in some ways, that everyone has to make on their own.

One thing I will say, though, is that I think some people dismiss it out of hand without ever really stopping to listen to what's being said or to really think about the benefits DVC provides.

I can say that with a degree of confidence, because I used to be one of those people. I figured if Disney is pushing DVC on me so hard, it must be heavily slanted in their favor. But when I finally stopped and sat down and really listened to my Sales Guide I realized I was being foolish and really passing up a lot of benefits.

One other thing not mentioned here ... $100 off AP's ... if you have a family of four, that's $400 right in your pocket each and every year.

I agree, Ian...

But the one thing that I do put a little extra emphasis on is that you are paying a one time purchase fee at a locked in rate...

This is even more important if you pay cash for the sale...as then you can approximate a reasonable cash value per point that your purchase will yield over the course of the contract....even with escalating maintenance fees.

I figured my room night at Beach Club (a friday night...so 22 points in low season)...equated to somewhere in the range of 160-180 dollars a night in real money expenditure over the course of the contract....that is already a substantial savings on the room and will only increase based on the rise of room rates well into this century...

you have to consider that...it is the key to DVC use at WDW....now of course you will continue to have to pay more for all the other parts of your trips....but to almost lockin a fixed dollar amount for 40-50 years is a great buy

the moderates are up to 149 - 165 plus a night (in the case of CBR...probably 70% of the room inventory is either preferred, water view, or king bed by default...so the average starting rate is probably closer to 157 or so dollars - for example) That would mean that spread out over the contract a studio at OKW is already less than the moderates....

I cannot tell you how much of an increased value that is....it is not even realistic to think that spending out of pocket in the future will come anywhere close to the value of DVC from a ROOM perspective....

I just like to point out that the practical numbers involved are heavily in favor of the longterm value of DVC.

[johnO]

What's so bad about a debate here? I don't own DVC but I've been kicking the idea around a bit. I think its very informative to get a little back and forth here as well and can't understand why the mod wont allow it. Well thought out point / counterpoint is one of the main benefits of this style message board. Strange......


:twocents:

[mouse-logic]

...I know that a good finance man could invest my money and get me a good return. I am a doctor, not a finance guy so I don't know.

I'll tell you what I do know. I love Walt Disney World. I can leave knowing I get to go back. In fact, as we leave for this trip we are going to make reservations for another next Christmas.

I literally feel like I am part of the magic. I actually own a percentage of a building on Disney property. That is neat for me. I get a special magazine and publications from DVC. I am reminded quite often that I belong to this. Some people buy season tickets to sports and I enjoy that too, but this is something better.

Material goods can get stolen and new cars break down and are eventually replaced. Memories, however, last forever. These trips are something I can always remember and are often something much more valuable than the money it costs to make them.

Donald A. sounds like me.

I bought into DVC for the same reason my dad bought tickets 10 rows back from home plate during the 1970 Baltimore Orioles baseball season when I was 7 years old. Sure, he could have gotten seats in the bleachers and we would have seen the game and had a good time, and he would have saved money. But he wanted to make sure it was the best possible experience, because he valued the moment, valued the time, and valued the memories we made more than saving a few dollars.

I cannot imagine not having my DVC membership for the last 5 years. I cannot imagine being without the memories of the time spent there together with my all my family and friends. Those all too brief moments are priceless to me.

So feel free to make all the financial comparisons, the cost-benefit analyses, calculations of concerning the all-powerful investment theory of the "time-value-of-money."

If that's what's most important, then so be it...I will be the first one to step up and agree that DVC is not right for you.

But for me, I'll keep my memories and I'll keep my DVC.

[dlpmikki]

What's so bad about a debate here? I don't own DVC but I've been kicking the idea around a bit. I think its very informative to get a little back and forth here as well and can't understand why the mod wont allow it. Well thought out point / counterpoint is one of the main benefits of this style message board. Strange......


:twocents:

Nothing wrong with a well thought out debate on pros and cons. What is wrong is repeating yourself and beating a point to death - that's the kind of 'debate' I am aiming to prevent. I want useful information available to all, not lost in meaningless arguments. Does that make more sense to you?

[Mrs Bus Driver]

I don't have a DVC membership, can't afford one right now. However I look forward to my retirement (and possibly before) when I will have the time and money to join. The thought of being able to stay in large nice room with kitchen, washer/dryer while on property sounds good to me. I would love to able to stay for awhile and take things at my own pace and not feel rushed into cramming what I can into 5 day once every few years vacation. I'm not looking for a money investment, I would be investing in vactions or to put it better, the quailty of my life. If you can't afford this I totally understand. I would do this to bring the family together every other year and to take my own vactions without family. So for me this makes good since. :mickey::mickey:

[johnO]

:thumbsup:

[WDW1985]

Great discussion...I don't mean to jack the thread here, but I have a different area for discussion regarding DVC.

I have been going to WDW with my family since around 1985 and have truly loved every minute of it. Because we love WDW resorts we normally stay on property, but now that the family has grown, space has become an issue - hotel rooms don't cut it. Because of that we recently stayed at a vacation home 5 min from the world and it worked out really well, especially in regards to getting around to the parks and other resorts with our rental car (usually less than total 15 min trip to any park).

However, with the larger villas being offered I still go back and forth on joining the DVC. The space is nice for staying on property and even though in the long term I will probably only break even on the purchase, I like many of the benefits. But here's one issue I still struggle with...Transportation. During out last trip on property (Oct 2007) my family and I seemed to wait forever for the buses. Like any other family we use them frequently and it just seemed to take a large amout of time out of the day just waiting around - especially with resort to resort transfers. With that said I wonder what benefits the DVC gives when it comes to getting around the kingdom or do you just have to line up with everybody else? When I look at the pros and cons this issue is one that doesn't make sense to me. :confused: I would think that there should be some type of transportation benefit for such an investment and maybe there is. (i.e. Large rebates on rental cars, special shuttles?)

Thanks.

WDW1985
:mickey:

[mickeys_apprentice]

How is the sales pitch for the DVC? Is it high pressure or easy-going?

[Horizon93]

How is the sales pitch for the DVC? Is it high pressure or easy-going?

The pitch is not high pressure. Quite the opposite. It is informative, Disneyfied, and low pressure.

You will leave with questions answered and the ability to call your guide with more questions. You will tour the SSR and AKV models, and leave with tons of information. You can buy on the spot, or buy later or not at all. Your guide will call you if they have not heard from you to see if you have made a decision.

If you decide to purchase the process is easy.

[mouse-logic]

Great discussion...I don't mean to jack the thread here, but I have a different area for discussion regarding DVC.

.... But here's one issue I still struggle with...Transportation. During out last trip on property (Oct 2007) my family and I seemed to wait forever for the buses. Like any other family we use them frequently and it just seemed to take a large amout of time out of the day just waiting around - especially with resort to resort transfers. With that said I wonder what benefits the DVC gives when it comes to getting around the kingdom or do you just have to line up with everybody else? When I look at the pros and cons this issue is one that doesn't make sense to me. :confused: I would think that there should be some type of transportation benefit for such an investment and maybe there is. (i.e. Large rebates on rental cars, special shuttles?)...

This is a perfectly acceptable question for this thread...because it is one of the reasons I really appreciate my DVC membership.

The original poster commented that he/she doesn't mind staying at the values. I assume in his statement that he doesn't mind the transportation service from the values as well. If I am not mistaken, the only transportation at the values are the busses. ...and you are right, they can get crowded and the wait can be a pain

But I also believe that with the exception of SSR and AKL, every DVC resort has alternative transportation, which can be both more convenient and more fun. For example, BCV and BWV is within a 5 minute walk of Epcot and 15 mins of the Studios. The Friendships also run to both parks. Of course you'd need to take the bus to MK or AK, but those busses are usually dedicated to that resort alone and are almost never full.

Same with the VWL...take the boat to MK

The new DVC (under construction) at the Contemporary will be the most conveniently located DVC property of all...take the monorail to MK and EPCOT...boat to MK, walk to MK.

So........I think transportation convenience is a great benefit of DVC ownership.

[Horizon93]

Adding to the transportation discussion. AKV has some advantages as well. After Kidani opens, there will only be two bus stops, one at the lodge and one at Kidani. Very close to each other. And the AKV bus service is very good. Not to mention a quick hop to AK

[WDW1985]

Thanks for the replies. I can see the benefits and it makes the DVC all the more alluring to me. When you look at the future of going to WDW I think transportation/logistics is going to become more of an issue for those who come often. Time is money and the more time you spend waiting the more money you waste and the less fun you have in the kingdom. On our October trip to WDW, staying at POR, we spent an average of 30 minutes between waiting and actually driving in the bus for each roundtrip. Taking into account 3 roundtrips for most days that equals a lot of wasted time! Sounds like the DVC can really help with some of these issues.

wdw1985
:mickey:

[Aurora]

The new DVC (under construction) at the Contemporary will be the most conveniently located DVC property of all...take the monorail to MK and EPCOT...boat to MK, walk to MK.


Just to clarify, unless they're building a direct monorail connection from the Contemporary to Epcot (unlikely), to get to Epcot you will still have to take the monorail from the resort to the TTC and transfer to the Epcot monorail.

[DestinationWDW]

Hi everyone,
I have a couple of questions that haven't been answered in this lengthily thread. Here I go.

1. The point system, say I purchase enough points for 10 days and let’s say that totals 300 points. In 5 years will I still be able to stay in the same room with the same length of stay for the same amount of points?

2. Every discussion I've seen for the DVC always refers to the "WORLD” isn’t the DVC also good for other locations around the globe? I love Disney in fact my 4 old and tell it better than me, but I would like to mix it up a little bit right?

3. The maintenance fees, do they go up every year and if so by how much?

4. I am pondering the idea of purchasing a DVC because we are a family of 5; the kids are getting to the age where they probably shouldn't sleep in the same bed. Yes I could go to 2 rooms but as it stands now, we usually purchase the packages. You hotel stay, tickets, dining plan, and usually we find some discount to save a little money. Then when I think about it in
2005 I spent $2900
2006 I spent $3600
2007 I spent $3600
2008 I spent $4200
and that included room, park hopper 8 days and dining. If i were to purchase the DVC I would be spend about $3000 a year for a hotel room with no park hoppper and no dining. Sure the prices go up every year but Disney also produces discounts every year. This is my problem on deciding.

5. Ok one last item, As with many other people I would have to make monthly payments, although I could buy it out right, I’d rather have my money make some money over the time period. Well with finance charges may me not, but I'd like to thinks so. One of my concerns at the moment is the economy as we head into a recession it might not be a wise decision at the moment. The what if factor, and how is Disney if a financial burden occurred, do they or will they work with you?

I just want to thank everyone in advance for your comments.

[lockedoutlogic]

Just to clarify, unless they're building a direct monorail connection from the Contemporary to Epcot (unlikely), to get to Epcot you will still have to take the monorail from the resort to the TTC and transfer to the Epcot monorail.


as a follow up.....i don't believe that anywhere near the magic kingdom can be described as most conveniently located.....

Beach Club Villas and Boardwalk are the best located and have been since the day they opened....

WDW is much more than the Magic Kingdom....and those two locations put you in much better position geographically to get to everything than the MK area resorts do.....

now if MK is your favorite....or you have small children....fine

but DVC is a 40 year committment....and it is more than likely that everyone's tastes and situations will change over that span....

also, if they open another gate.....it will be most likely on the southern end of the property or out towards the turnpike entrance......not making the lower end resorts more attractive....


love wilderness lodge....interested with what they will do at the contemp....and most likely grand and poly after that.....

but i don't see those ever being "more convenient"...all things considered

[Horizon93]

Hi everyone,
I have a couple of questions that haven't been answered in this lengthily thread. Here I go.

1. The point system, say I purchase enough points for 10 days and let’s say that totals 300 points. In 5 years will I still be able to stay in the same room with the same length of stay for the same amount of points?

Yes, The point charts are basically frozen for the length of the contract.


2. Every discussion I've seen for the DVC always refers to the "WORLD” isn’t the DVC also good for other locations around the globe? I love Disney in fact my 4 old and tell it better than me, but I would like to mix it up a little bit right?

The World Passport collection through Interval International is probably the best point value second only to DVC resorts. I have not yet booked a World Passport vacation, but I have read reports of other people's trips and they seem to be very happy.

3. The maintenance fees, do they go up every year and if so by how much?

They can and traditionally have. I am not sure of the percentage.

4. I am pondering the idea of purchasing a DVC because we are a family of 5; the kids are getting to the age where they probably shouldn't sleep in the same bed. Yes I could go to 2 rooms but as it stands now, we usually purchase the packages. You hotel stay, tickets, dining plan, and usually we find some discount to save a little money. Then when I think about it in
2005 I spent $2900
2006 I spent $3600
2007 I spent $3600
2008 I spent $4200
and that included room, park hopper 8 days and dining. If i were to purchase the DVC I would be spend about $3000 a year for a hotel room with no park hoppper and no dining. Sure the prices go up every year but Disney also produces discounts every year. This is my problem on deciding.

The old adage is that if you go at least every other year and stay in moderate to deluxe resorts, DVC can be a money saver. Depending on when you vacation and the level of accommodations you book, you will eventually break even. I looked at our purchase as a pre-payment on future vacations at today's prices. As was stated above, that 300 point stay today, will be a 300 point stay in 34-49 years. It is tough to predict what resort rates will be in 5 years. And Disney has been getting stingy with discounts

5. OK one last item, As with many other people I would have to make monthly payments, although I could buy it out right, I’d rather have my money make some money over the time period. Well with finance charges may me not, but I'd like to thinks so. One of my concerns at the moment is the economy as we head into a recession it might not be a wise decision at the moment. The what if factor, and how is Disney if a financial burden occurred, do they or will they work with you?

Financing through DVC is easy with good credit. The rate is a little high, currently 10.75%. They do a soft credit check and the loan is not reported. If you do not pay, your reservation privileges can be suspended. I don't know how they are with working with people who fall far behind.

I just want to thank everyone in advance for your comments.

I hope some of those answers help!

[DVC Mike]

1. The point system, say I purchase enough points for 10 days and let’s say that totals 300 points. In 5 years will I still be able to stay in the same room with the same length of stay for the same amount of points?


The total number of vacation points required to use all rooms during each calendar year can never increase. However, DVC may reallocate or adjust point requirements; reallocation cannot exceed 20% per calendar year. If vacation points for one specific night increase, it will be offset by a decrease on another night or nights. DVC has only done this once over the past 15 years.



2. Every discussion I've seen for the DVC always refers to the "WORLD” isn’t the DVC also good for other locations around the globe? I love Disney in fact my 4 old and tell it better than me, but I would like to mix it up a little bit right?


Keep in mind that the only resorts guaranteed over the life of your contract are your home resort and the other DVC resorts. DVC controls which resorts you can trade into via Interval International (aka, the World Passport Collection).



3. The maintenance fees, do they go up every year and if so by how much?


Historically, maintenance fees have increased anywhere from 2.3 - 4.4% annually (that's $.09 - $.18 per point per year). According to legal documents, DVC may not raise maintenance fees by more than 15% in a given year without owner approval.

[MarkC]

Lots of fair points here on both sides. This decision is partially financially based and partly lifestyle based. If you are going to vaction every year or every other year at Disney and like to stay in a nice hotel, then you can definitely make the finances work. If you aren't sure how often you'll vacation later and prefer budget motels, then DVC is clearly NOT for you. We did look at the current purchase price (we bought resale at BCV) vs. what the cost would be in 10, 20, 30, 35 years. One of the things that made us decide was that it would be a tremendous benefit for our grandkids (we don't have any as our kids are only 18 and almost 16). We figured this would be a tremendous gift to them in the future, and how appreciative they would be of this gift. We use our Disney Visa to pay our maintenance fees so we don't have any out of pocket costs, and we usually have about $100 left over each year for food, etc. Everyone is different so I can't tell anyone else what to do. All I can do is share my experiences and the reasons we decided to buy. Mark

[hlkeck]

If you get a Disney Visa, you can pay your annual dues with the Reward Dollars. We have moved quite a few of our monthly bills to this Visa in order to rack up the free dollars to pay our dues. This should help offset some of the costs you are considering.

We have small children and know that we will likely heavily travel to Disney over the next several years - then stretch it out later to the other places you can trade to visit. We are darn excited about the Hawaiian DVC to open and are already planning that trip, as I write, today.

The DVC will provide us, our children, and our grandchildren a lot of years - at today's prices - of true magical happiness.

A monthly payment plan is definitely reasonable (you can even pay your monthly dues on your Disney Visa, but you pay an extra percent interest rate (over the life of the loan would likely equal about $1,000 - and you'd only get about $100 in reward dollars, so it's a no-brainer to do the monthly withdrawal instead if you need to do the monthly payments.)

I used this board to decide if we were going to purchase or not - and I appreciate all of those who weigh in on these issues. Thank you for all of your help.

[TinkerbellT421]

Me and my boyfriend just bought into the DVC w/ SSR. He owned before. And we wanted to own together. We are doing the automatic payment w/drawal thru our account. We got financed thru disney. And we have currently done this all via USPS which is also convenient. I dont know if anyone mentioned that you can join all via USPS. You don't have to wait to go down for your vacation to have it all set up if you already know that you are joining. They also answer any question you could possibly have all over the phone. Very nice ppl. Its very convenient. So know we have it setup so we can use our points for when we are there in January '09 :-)

[DestinationWDW]

Well after all the treads, blogs, and anything we could find on the internet, not to forget all the great comments from Intercoties, we finally decided to take the plunge. After working with a DVC sales person for over 8 months, I finally broke down and as of today we now own a small interest in Disney's AKV. Yeah, 8 months, that was as long as I could come up with excuses to postpone the inevitable. Have we made the right choice? Who knows, but it sure is going to be exciting to find out.:party:

Thanks for all your help

[DVC Mike]

we finally decided to take the plunge. After working with a DVC sales person for over 8 months, I finally broke down and as of today we now own a small interest in Disney's AKV.

Congrats and Welcome Home, fellow AKV owner! We absolutely love AKV! We've stayed there twice so far.

[Kidsmom]

We just got back from our first DVC owner visit (AKL) and loved it.....I am sure you will too!

Welcome!!

[Dixie Springs]

Just a comment on the 'pressure' aspect: Our first DVC sales pitch was in fact Disney-esque, and not like the typical time-share peddle. The second, however (years later), was a bit more emotional, with outrageous projections like the Contemporary eventually reaching $2,500/night, and the salesman did have that International Drive parasitic style.

One thing these 2 experiences had in common was the giddy couple they ushered past us who just bought. I believe it was the same castmembers both times (just kidding - I think).


Regardless, we never bought in. We sided with the naysayers' logic ultimately. I'm sure it's great for some. Believe me - I was tempted!

[Ian]

The second, however (years later), was a bit more emotional, with outrageous projections like the Contemporary eventually reaching $2,500/night, and the salesman did have that International Drive parasitic style.I'm not sure how "outrageous" that is, but I do understand how the whole high pressure thing can be a turnoff.

I'd encourage you, though, not to shut the door on the idea simply because you had one bad experience. Consider this ... when Animal Kingdom opened 10 years ago today, a one-day/one-park pass was $44.52. Today it's $75.62. That's a 70% increase in ticket prices in just 10 years.

Is it so inconvceivable that, one day in the future, the Contemporary might be going for $2,500 a night? Also, bear in mind, that's a rate for accomodations comparable to DVC accomodations (i.e. a suite). I bet if you price a 1BR suite at the Contemporary today it ain't far off from $2,500 a night as it is!

[jonahbear2006]

i agree with the numbers, the previous post pulled. We did the math and $3000 a year plus yearly dues and then on top of that dining and tickets, was way too much for it to be a "great deal!!" By Sept. we will have been three times in the past year and a half and will have spent 19 nights with a family of 6, had dining plan and bought 15 days into the parks. All for a grand total of $4100. I could not do this, with my 4 kids, on DVC. There may be years we can afford to spend less or more. It is a financial burden to contract to HAVE to spend that money every year, even if you are financially stable. Every kingdom must fall, and when it does, the less contracts you sign, the less it hurts you. But we only make about 30,000 a year and have 4 kids. Dvc isn't even an option for us, at this point.

[lockedoutlogic]

i agree with the numbers, the previous post pulled. We did the math and $3000 a year plus yearly dues and then on top of that dining and tickets, was way too much for it to be a "great deal!!" By Sept. we will have been three times in the past year and a half and will have spent 19 nights with a family of 6, had dining plan and bought 15 days into the parks. All for a grand total of $4100. I could not do this, with my 4 kids, on DVC. There may be years we can afford to spend less or more. It is a financial burden to contract to HAVE to spend that money every year, even if you are financially stable. Every kingdom must fall, and when it does, the less contracts you sign, the less it hurts you. But we only make about 30,000 a year and have 4 kids. Dvc isn't even an option for us, at this point.

i'm just curious what numbers you're using to come up with 3000K a year.....

if you're talking 300 points....sure....but if you are using that many you are spending far more than 3K a year on travel.....

my numbers come out to be around 1500 a year over the 40-45 year term for 175 points.....assuming a significant but not outrageous increase in maintenance dues....and no financing....

that is still about 60K....but over that length of time inflation will make the comparitive out of pocket expenditures much more...

[jonahbear2006]

Well, as a general rule, time share is not a good buy. This has been stated over and over. I guess if you really have the money to spend, spend it. When we looked into it, we did the math, husband and I, and we came up with rounding it up to about $3,000 a year. I don't remember where the numbers came from but they were all off of Disney's specifications. I realize that Disney's time share is different than a lot of other time share's but generally if something is a "great deal" then you are probably getting jipped somewhere. Besides, I can't rationalize staying in deluxe everytime we go. I just can't see needing that kind of accomodation that ends up costing $20,000+ for rooms I will only see while I sleep. I can see every once in awhile but for the most part, we camp. It is much more affordable and we can get 8 day park hoppers, camp for 9 days, AND get dining plan for $2800. Now, THAT is a deal to me. I absolutely love Disney, but we want to see the rest of the world, too. We love museums and history and I think I will just keep camping. For the most part, hotel rooms are overrated. We are going BC this fall but we prob won't do that again for a long time and it is only cause we got free dining and complimentary tickets. We do have some friends whom are dvc members and they love it and have tried to talk me into it but something about it just makes me feel very uneasy about purchasing this. I think I would be sorry. That is typically a good reason to steer clear of it.

[DVC Mike]

but for the most part, we camp. It is much more affordable and we can get 8 day park hoppers, camp for 9 days, AND get dining plan for $2800. Now, THAT is a deal to me.

DVC is not sold as a "cheap" way to visit WDW. If you want that, you're better off camping, staying at a Value resort, or staying offsite. These are all less expensive than DVC, and anyone who prefers those options should not be considering DVC.

DVC is for those why regularly visit WDW and stay in Deluxe (or even Moderate) accomodations.

[DestinationWDW]

We've just bought in to DVC and will not use it until Oct. We bought in to AKV. We played around with the idea for about 2 years, we have camped and loved it several times, we have stayed in value, and moderate. We have never stayed in a deluxe resort. WE are a family of 5 with a girl and 2 younger boys. Yes vacation is about family and being together and yes for a week you can deal with the close quarters. But my theory is I want some privacy from my childern who i love very much but sometimes can't stand. Plus I am looking at the future when I can enjoy my grandchildren if I am blessed enought. Plus being in Atlanta we can do quick trips even though its eight hours away. The thing is you don't miss what you don't have. So if your wealthy and can afford 5 star accomadations, or if your on a tight budget then you look at lower star accomadations. The point is timeshares are not for everyone, and every negitive person against them over reacts, no one is forcing anyone to purchase, not evern the DVC CMS. Infact I think I bugged the guy who helped me more then he ever called me. I figured for us, we just about break even, more on the high side but your getting so much more than just a room your getting a seperate sleeping area from your kids or guest. Nice Doulble shower, you get point. Vacations don't have to be about the whole family all the time, My wife and I always take time for ourselves. Like I said we live in Atlanta with no family so on vacation the kids go to daycare or whatever they call um at WDW for a few hours so we can be alone. Pluse with the size of my family I can either stay at a deluxe that sleeps 5 or i get 2 rooms per night. Either way I am spending 200 bucks a night with tax so it might as well be nice. Hey monies money and you can't take it with you and i'm sure as hell not giving it to my kids, their on there own. I am enjoying my life because you never know what life might throw at you.

[jonahbear2006]

I love Disney and would love to be DVC but I think that will never happen for us. We will be just as happy camping at Disney, though, so I imagine we will probably be better off putting the money into different areas of our lives. As much as I love the idea of the vc, I think more than the ability to stay at the villas, I would love carrying the status symbol. Being able to say I was a dvc member would be enough for me but then at the end of the day, I really don't want to stay in the villas. I would prefer to stay in the main building of a deluxe. But considering we would spend more on DVC than my husband makes in a year, I would probably be more stressed out about dvc than anything. Maybe when we get older we can buy it for my grandkids. that would be fun.

[TracyL]

We did take a look at DVC, and decided it was not the right fit for me. The obvious reason is that we are Florida residents, which means we already get the AP discount (there's a $2 difference between the DVC AP price and the FL resident AP price), and we live close enough to go whenever we want. That said, we still stay on property a fair amount, and so DVC was worth considering. We ultimately decided no because:

1) It's just the two of us, no kids, and we spend minimal time in our resort room when we're at WDW. A moderate is enough resort for us.

2) Our vacationing habits are weird. We go at random times, for random lengths of time, for a huge array of reasons. A lot of our traveling is to conventions or conferences where we can't necessarily pick or predict the venues, and a DVC option may not exist there. In a given year, we might spend anywhere from 2 to 20 nights at WDW, and 0 to 20 nights anywhere else.

3) In the very unusual case where we would want a DVC-like experience, we do have friends who are members and who are willing to sell/rent points to us. In fact, we just got to spend one night at AKL because they had some points that were expiring that they couldn't use, and they gave them to us. (YAY!)

I think if you have 2 or more kids, are a Disney fanatic, and tend to take "traditional" (1-2 weeks) vacations every year (more often at Disney than not), DVC is a great option.

If you do not have kids, or if you are not planning to do at least one Disney vacation for every vacation you take somewhere else, or if you have other constraints on your paid time off that make it hard to utilize DVC, then it may not be a good fit.

[mom2morgan]

Great informtion in this thread - thanks to all for answering all my questions! I'd LOVE to do DVC, and I think it would make sense for us except for one barrier - we live in Alberta, so the biggest cost of our wdw vacations will always be travel. We just got back from a trip where our airfare was nearly half of the full total. Sadly, that means I can't know for sure that I'd be able to afford to GO often enough to make good use of a membership.

[Ian]

Great informtion in this thread - thanks to all for answering all my questions! I'd LOVE to do DVC, and I think it would make sense for us except for one barrier - we live in Alberta, so the biggest cost of our wdw vacations will always be travel. We just got back from a trip where our airfare was nearly half of the full total. Sadly, that means I can't know for sure that I'd be able to afford to GO often enough to make good use of a membership.One thing to remember, though, is that if you have to skip a year you can always bank those points and then the next year take a longer vacation, go at a more popular time, or stay in larger accomodations.

And if it's longer than that, you can always rent your points and make most of your money back for that year.

[stitchaholic]

Hey monies money and you can't take it with you and i'm sure as hell not giving it to my kids, their on there own. I am enjoying my life because you never know what life might throw at you.
you are my kind of person,that post had me lol! i met with a DVD specialist last year,and having stayed at a value and it being my last day there,i was convinced.i filled out all the paperwork and then started having a panic attack,i told the guy that i needed some time to mull it over,so keep my paperwork until the afternoon and io would get back to him.
i am a single mom of 2 kids,and dependant on my own finances,my ex is no help. i just could not rationalize the purchase,although it has been constantly on my mind,and if i had 10 grand to kick around today,i would sign on the dotted line for sure.

p.s. i am a canadian also(montreal),if you fly out of the nearest us city,airfare is about 400.00 cheaper than it would be to fly out of canada.

kudos to all you DVC members,i hope to be able to join you soon!

[Dsnygirl]

I absolutely love Disney, but we want to see the rest of the world, too. We love museums and history ...

For the most part, hotel rooms are overrated. We are going BC this fall but we prob won't do that again for a long time and it is only cause we got free dining and complimentary tickets.
We are considering DVC, as well, and one of the pulls for us is that you don't have to stay at Disney to use your points... I'm sure we will, but if we decide one year when the kids are a bit older to go to Europe or California instead, we can use our DVC points for a week there at one of the associated hotels. We have friends who do this quite often, and love it.

We also agree that the whole concept of staying at a deluxe every time is overrated -- you don't have to do that to have a good trip. But, we've been three times now, twice at a moderate (CBR) and once at an All-Star. All three times were good experiences, and ones we would choose to repeat.

That being said, our girls are getting older, we're becoming familiar enough w/ the parks and what we enjoy that to be able to have some downtime at our resort and be able to relax there, as well, is becoming a priority to us, as well. You can't do that as easily at a value or a moderate resort, as the rooms don't have the space or the freedom to kick back in a chair and watch a bit of TV while you pop a snack into the oven before heading to the pool or back to a park. We are used to being able to do this on other vacations, as friends of ours own a home we rent in Maine, and we're more used to the space that affords us.

So -- we're taking all these things into consideration as we decide how we'd like to proceed -- I like this thread, b/c it makes you think!

:thumbsup:

[KayDee]

Great informtion in this thread - thanks to all for answering all my questions! I'd LOVE to do DVC, and I think it would make sense for us except for one barrier - we live in Alberta, so the biggest cost of our wdw vacations will always be travel. We just got back from a trip where our airfare was nearly half of the full total. Sadly, that means I can't know for sure that I'd be able to afford to GO often enough to make good use of a membership.

I hear you. We live in SK and have the same problem. Not sure if this applies to you or not but I am looking at how many Air Miles we could collect in a year and how that would help.

[Ian]

We are considering DVC, as well, and one of the pulls for us is that you don't have to stay at Disney to use your points... I'm sure we will, but if we decide one year when the kids are a bit older to go to Europe or California instead, we can use our DVC points for a week there at one of the associated hotels. We have friends who do this quite often, and love it.I know it's just a matter of opinion, but if it was me I would not buy into DVC if that's one of the big selling points for you.

IMO, it's not at all an economical use of your points. Personally, I think unless you plan to use your points at a DVC resort like 95% of the time you should steer clear of DVC. The economics just don't work out otherwise.

[CaptainSad]

My wife and I looked real hard into getting into DVC a few years ago. Because of the cost and the limited avalibility at the time we decided to not purchase it. When we looked they had only a couple of places to stay. Now they have a few more choices. I still don't feel it is worth the price for what you get. I since have gone another route. Yes it is not Disney, but it is on Disney property. The time share I got into is right next to the Caribbean Resort. If you know Disney property you know where I am talking about. You can't miss the 8 towers. I am not limited to when I can go to WDW. I can reserve anytime I want and not have to worry about being turned away. I have a choice of 1 BR suite up to a 4 BR Presidential. I can book 11 months in advance and upgrade 45 days before my date of arrival. There are better deals out there. If you need the Disney name then by all means go DVC. If you don't there are other options. Don't get me wrong. I love Disney World :mickey: as much as any of you. I like like more bang for the buck....

[jonahbear2006]

I am a DVC member and am getting ready to take my first trip with my points. I am going to take my family including my parents, wife's parents, and my two brothers next month to stay at the Beach Club Villas. We are getting 2 two-bedroom villas for 5 nights during value season (Sunday-Thursday night).

We bought in for 150 points at Saratoga Springs. By the time I pay this off with finance charges (if I don't pay it off ahead of time) I guess you could say that those points cost me $20,000. You average annual dues (that are now about $650) and say they average out to $1000 a year for those points. You put that into the 48 year or so contract and that is a total cost of close to $70,000.

This next trip is something I always wanted to do for our family before we have kids and my brothers get married and move away. If I would by these two villas outright for the exact nights I book, the cost would be $7000 ($3500 for each villa). This is on two years of points. So, say I take this exact trip every other year at the same time for the same points for the life of my contract. The cost would be in today's dollars, $168,000!

For my $70,000 I more than doubled my money in 50 years. But the catch is the price of these rooms will go up and the points will not. So who knows what the actual value will be, $200,000 or even $300,000. Plus, currently being a DVC member gets one discounts that add up.

I know that a good finance man could invest my money and get me a good return. I am a doctor, not a finance guy so I don't know.

I'll tell you what I do know. I love Walt Disney World. I can leave knowing I get to go back. In fact, as we leave for this trip we are going to make reservations for another next Christmas.

I literally feel like I am part of the magic. I actually own a percentage of a building on Disney property. That is neat for me. I get a special magazine and publications from DVC. I am reminded quite often that I belong to this. Some people buy season tickets to sports and I enjoy that too, but this is something better.

Material goods can get stolen and new cars break down and are eventually replaced. Memories, however, last forever. These trips are something I can always remember and are often something much more valuable than the money it costs to make them.

awwww, i like you sooo much. i actually want to show this to my in laws so when we buy they can see im not crazy.

[Plex]

I've strongly considered DVC, however I have decided against it. I did a pretty extensive financial analysis of the options, and here's a rough summary of my results:

(Just FYI, I have a degree in Accounting and work in the financial industry. Although I'm not fully versed in all of the bells and whistles of DVC,I asked a whole lot of technical financial questions of the DVC sales staff, and when it comes to financial analysis, I know my stuff :))

For purposes of my analysis I really didn't take into account all of the 'extras' that come with DVC, but merely looked at it as a different way to pay for your hotel stays and WDW. I did this basically because the value of those extras to the purchaser are somewhat subjective, and I was trying to make this as much of an objective comparison as possible.

To do this I used the estimates I got from DVC about increases in rack rates (reportedly averaging 7% per year), increases in annual fees for DVC (reportedly averaging 3% per year), and interest rates(I used their best available interest rate of 10.75%. (Note that after calling a few banks, the best rate I could find for an unsecured loan like this was about 14%)) To come up with the DVC cost, I used prices of re-sales (and only the best prices at that). More about the minimum direct buy-in at the bottom.

I experimented with different down payments and financing periods. Depending on those different variables, the total amount you'll pay into DVC after 50 years is around $115,000 - $130,000. (Principal, Interest, and Annual Fees).

Depending on if you go to a Value, Moderate, or Deluxe resort, it will take you 30-40 years for DVC to "break even". This is without taking into account promotions and discounts - a AAA discount will push this out to an even longer period to break even - if at all.

________________________________________

Now then, if you actually take into account the minimum buy-in direct from DVC, you're basically being forced into more than one week a year. The price per point is also higher. Considering that your annual fees are on a per-point basis, you really get no benefit for buying a greater quantity of points other than, well, having more points.

________________________________________

So, in a nutshell, if you're looking into DVC as a way to save money, I don't think it's a good plan. If you stay at Moderate and Value Resorts and look for deals and discounts, you're probably better off financially by opting out of DVC. If you're going top-of-the-line all the time and place a lot of value on getting the other amenities (living room, kitchenette, etc) then DVC is for you.



Anyone that's interested in how I came up with those numbers, feel free to get in touch with me and I can send you my calculations. My spreadsheet will probably need a little cleaning up before I send it to someone though because it's not exactly near and organized at the moment :secret:

[Plex]

Just realized that I misspoke in that last spoke - it doesn't take 30-40 years to break even, it takes 30-40 years for paying Rack to equal the cost of DVC. I'm actually going to clean this up today and post up the full results

[Hammer]

Thorough analysis, but it does not apply to my case or anyone else who did not finance their purchase, either through DVC or resale.

I do agree with the premise that DVC does not make much sense for people who are happy staying at value or moderate accommodations. I prefer the space that DVC villas provide, so it makes sense for me.

[Plex]

Apparently I was half asleep when I did my analysis the first time. DVC is actually better than I had originally thought. Coffee in hand, here's my results:

Period: 50 years
Annual Increase In Rack Rate: 7%
Annual Increase In DVC Dues: 3%
Financing Rate: 10.75%
Annual Stay: 7 Nights
Season Prices: Late April

________________________________________

Rack Rates

Value: $432,191
Moderate: $544,240
Deluxe: $1,072,475
Villa: $1,408,625

15% Discount

Value: $367,365
Moderate: $462,605
Deluxe: $911,600
Villa: $1,197330

_______________________________________

DVC

Minimum Buy-In, 10% Down Payment, 10-year financing: $114,100

120 Points, 10% down, 10 year financing: $84,840

120 Points, Resale, 10 year financing: $78,560

I also worked it out with shorter financing periods, but I'm excluding those from this post to save on space and time. It doesn't significantly change the overall price.

________________________________________

Break-Even

Principal + Interest + Fees = Rack Stay

Value: 19 years
Moderate: 16 year
Deluxe: 6 Years
Villa: 1 year

Sum of all Previous Years at Rack = Total DVC Cost

Value - 27 years
Moderate - 24 years
Deluxe - 17 years
Villa - 14 years

_______________________________________

So it's a much better deal than I had thought from my original analysis, which was apparently all messed up and I'm not sure how it got like that. My Rack Rates were different for some reason, and didn't include the Villa prices.

What is absolutely for certain is that if you make the apples-to-apples comparison to renting a Villa directly from Disney, DVC is a great deal. If you're going to stay cheap every time you go, it's not quite as good.

If you're not financing, it's a great deal. That 10.75% interest rate is brutal, and really takes Opportunity Cost out of the equation. If you can finance DVC with a refinance or a HELOC, then you're in good shape.

I'm still not convinced to buy in for a variety of intangible reasons - choice of resorts, flexibility of when to go or when not to go, financial flexibility, interest in other vacation destinations, etc. Personally, I spend so little time in the hotel that I really don't feel that I need the room or extra accommodations.

One of the major deterrents to me is that the annual price of your vacations in the first years is much higher when using DVC. I'm 25, so my earnings power is going to be much more in 10 years than it is now. It doesn't make much sense to me to pay for 50 years of vacations at the lowest income level that I'll have in my lifetime. Furthermore, by the time DVC breaks even, I probably won't be interested in going every year anymore.

If I ever have a large lump sum of cash with no immediate use for it, I'll probably buy in. For now, I've need to save for a new car, a down payment on a house, etc.

[hubbyofadisneyholic]

Thorough analysis, but it does not apply to my case or anyone else who did not finance their purchase, either through DVC or resale.

I do agree with the premise that DVC does not make much sense for people who are happy staying at value or moderate accommodations. I prefer the space that DVC villas provide, so it makes sense for me.

Exactly.
And as is often mentioned in these discussions, the decision whether to buy or not buy is more than a dollars and cents issue. There are many factors involved and buying into DVC certainly should be a lower priority than necessities like a home and car.

But...for us it has worked out quite well. :thumbsup:

[Kenny1113]

I have looked into DVC extensively and I have chosen not to buy in. For one I do not spend as much in lodging at Disney as I would per year for DVC, and as a pp mentioned it is not worth ot to use the points outside of Disney. Another reason that I have chosen not to buy in is that at the time I was looking into it they were selling BLT, well I do not book my WDW anymore than 2-3 months in advance. I felt that I would not be able to stay at my home resort and therefore not worth the money. My ultimate reason for not buying in, I do not see myself going to WDW every year for the next 50 years.

[BigRedDad]

My mom got the bug this last trip. She is not made of money and her investments, social security, and pension need to help her last for the rest of her life. When we looked at all the options from the cost she given, it amounted to almost $10k down and about $250 per month of lost income. Realize that this is not the maintenance cost. The $250 comes form the monthly income loss from selling part of the investment, the monthly maintenance fees, the monthly payments on the other half of financing. Running the calculations, we could rent the same number of points from other members for $2000 a year vs the $3000 it would cost her in monthly payments.

It is definitely not a go for us. The only way we can see it being viable is if the initial payment is throw away money. Who has $20k to throw away besides the wealthy.

[Jeffybob]

Here is my two-cents, for what it is worth ...

When I purchased back in 1998, I was not looking to buy when I took the tour and met with the Sales Rep but it was the flexibility that sold me.

I was single then and did not need a large place, so the lowest point allotment (150 at the time) was perfect.

I am no longer single, and we use it at least once a year for long weekends mostly, to get our Disney fix, where a studio room is perfect. In addition to WDW visits, we have been to Vero Beach, Hilton Head, New York City and Paris with DVC. Further, we have upgraded to one bedrooms, when the need arises and also booked additional rooms when traveling with family and friends.

This past year, for example, we took a cruise with family and friends, and we were able to use the points for 3 studios, arriving the Friday before we sailed and again, on the Saturday, upon our return. That was a substancial savings to my travel party and I was glad that I could make that happen.

Doing the math, as I recall, a studio at the Boardwalk went for $325. per night. $325. x 2 = $650 x 3 = $1,950. My HOA dues are $803 annually.

Budgets and lifestyles need to be considered when purchasing timeshares as timeshares are not one size fits all. People considering this purchase should look at the big picture, and to the future. You are setting yourself up for future vacations using today's dollars.

Hope this helps.

-Jeffybob (Boardwalk DVC Member since '98) :mickey:

2010 - BWV - Valentines Day
2009 - BWV (2), DCL - Eastern Caribbean
2008 - BWV (2)
2007 - BWV
2006 - DLR (2), SSR, BWV, DCL - Western Caribbean
2005 - HH, BWV (2)
2003 - BWV
2002 - BWV, Disneyland Paris
2001 - BWV, DLC - Bahamas
2000 - BWV
1999 - BWV, HH, VB
1998 - BWV, Swan

[CaptainSad]

Just wondering. How much do you pay? I know it is none of my business. But with my timeshare at Wyndham I can book at the Bonnet Creek Resort (Disney Property) tomorrow if I needed to. As a matter of fact, almost anywhere in the world. But the numbers I have seen for DVC is totally not worth it. I don't come anywhere to what DVC owners are paying. Like I said in an earlier post I love Disney, but I don't see any value except the Disney name and perks. If I wanted to pay that much I would just buy Disney stock...

[Plex]

So we just got back from WDW and I figured while we were there we would spend a morning with the folks at DVC.

I was quite shocked at something - this actually changed my mind about DVC! What I hadn't been able to find before was the points table for trading your DVC points in for non-Disney vacations and what other resorts you can trade for. Before seeing the tables, I had been under the impression that using DVC for non-Disney trips wasn't worth it. This is far from the truth.

In a nutshell, trading for a week for a vacation outside of Disney properties will cost you about the same number of points as any trip within the Disney Properties. This level of flexibility has really changed my mind about DVC. These sorts of vacations can be re extremely expensive to do without staying in ****** hotels. Not to mention the number of nearby resorts that we could use for a long weekend or cheap vacation.

I don't plan on doing WDW every year, but I certainly see myself taking some sort of vacation every year. I'd love to have the flexibility to go to a resort pretty much anywhere on the planet for a known, fixed price, and really only have to worry about airfare.

I still don't think that buying directly from DVC is the best option - you can easily get a much better deal through resales.

Off for resale shopping!

[Kenny1113]

Wow! I'm glad you were able to find that. They must have changed that since I went, because even the DVC CM I was dealing with in Jan 2009 even told me it didn't make since to get it if I was going to use it for a large %age of non disney hotels.

[Plex]

Well I've got the book, so I can give you some insight on it :thumbsup:

In talking to the DVC CM about it and reviewing the charts, it appears that the trades to non-Disney resorts are based on the point charts for everything else. The CM we talked to told us that they base it mostly on the averages of the point charts for Disney properties, which is pretty consistent with what I actually see on the charts.

It's probably slightly more points to go with this route to take a vacation, but the up side is that their 'peak seasons' may vary from WDW, so you might be able to find yourself a week at some exotic international destination for like 130pts if you catch the right times.

The big plus I think is that the current max for a week is 160pts. It's pricey, but worth it when you take into consideration that you're staying somewhere that's extremely expensive for the same price as a WDW vacation with a nice view.

The list of resorts that you can trade to is astounding - over 500 resorts all over the US and the world. There's about 15 or so in Hawaii, a whole bunch in the Carribean, Greence, Italy, the UK (including a castle!), Australia... the list goes on.

You can also use it for Adventures By Disney, although the point totals are astronomical! (500+ PER PERSON) Even with the points it would take, it's very tempting to rent points and give it a try :mickey:

[SamG]

We are a family of 5 and have stayed deluxe our last 3-4 trips because of the larger rooms (and amenities). I want to bring up a couple points that I'm surprised hasn't been mentioned (or I've missed them)...

A) You don't have to purchase DVC from Disney. You can get points much cheaper/pt (and in lesser amounts) from resalers (do a google search for DVC resale).

B) No one has mentioned that you can RENT points from DVC members. There are other message boards that handle that. In fact, that's what we're looking to do for our trip next year.

With those two things being said, here's the comparison I've made... 'Rack Rate' for a standard view at CR for the 5 nights we want to go next year is $1690 (regular season).

Renting points (at the going rate of $10/pt) for the same five nights @ AKV is $1440. To me, renting is a no-brainer. Yes, there's some risk, but there's ways to limit that risk.

So for those comparing the 'rack rates' of the Villas vs. purchasing DVC, yes, the purchasing makes sense there. But you might want to consider renting.

[Dsnygirl]

So, once again, my DH and I have been considering buying into DVC in the spring.

Here are our reasons for waiting.

One, we would have to finance it. For what we see needing in points (about 230), it would cost us about $13000, on average, for a re-sale. We considered putting $4K down, and financing the rest over 2 or 3 years.

Then we did the math, and REALLY understood what people were talking about when they said DVC doesn't make sense, if you have to finance it.

A 3yr loan would be about $300/month, so $3600/year. Add in annual dues of about $1100, so that's $4800/year. Plus the cost of tickets ($1000 for family of 4, 8-10 days), airfare (b/w $800 and $1200) & food (figure at least $120/day)- you're up to about $7200 for the trip per year.

Now, our trips usually cost us between $4000-$5000 for 10 or 11 nights, 5 of which are at a moderate, 5 at a deluxe like AKL.

So, over the course of 3yrs of financing, we'd spend an extra $2200 a year (or more) for our trips.

Instead, if we save $300/month (instead of paying it to a bank for the loan) for the next 3 years, and buy in then (when our financed purchase would be paid off) and continue taking trips on our own, we'll have saved about $6000 on our trips, pay for the purchase in cash, and THEN, the purchase would make sense and have a cost-savings for us down the road.

So -- as much as I HATE waiting, it's what we will continue to do -- and I'll enjoy staying at my favorite moderates until then. :D

[Georgesgirl1]

My parents own DVC and my brother and I are on the deed for estate planning reasons.

They first looked at DVC back in the early 90's when it first become available. They didn't end up buying until 2005. For them, to buy before then just didn't make sense. As a family of four, we could easily stay at a any hotel without being cramped. Plus, at that point in their lives, they would have needed to finance the purchase.

Once my brother and I finished college and moved out, they had the money to pay for DVC with cash, so they went for it. Also, when I got married and DH and I started a family, the family of four that could stay in any hotel became a family of 6. My parents bought enough points that we can get a grand villa each year or each go on our own trips in a studio or 1 bedroom.

The final (and probably most important) reason that my parents bought into DVC is the memories we can make as a family. My grandparents have a timeshare and so many of our amazing family vacations when I was younger were possible because my grandparents took us with them on vacation. My parents know how tight money can be with youg kids and wanted to make the same opportunity available to my brother and I and our families. Now they can make sure that their grandkids will be brought up going to and loving Disney!

[RevKjb]

Just passed through ROFR with Disney and we're SSR "members" now! 120 points. Thanks to TIMESHARE store. Just 2 months ago we made our 3rd trip as a family in 3 years. That was my wife's 16th trip and my 6th. It made and makes sense for us. AND we're not limited to Disney...we plan to go to Europe in a few years, using our DVC points.
BUT it has to make sense to you.
KJB

[disneyfreak2]

my husband and i bought into dvc in 2005 and i can honestly tell you it was the best decision we made. we go every yeart to wdw and a few times we have taken family with us. In 2006 we invited my family and there were 13 of us!! we were thrilled that we were able to provide the rooms and they just had to pay for their tickets and meals. we are planning on a huge family trip in dec 2011 22 of us going!! what wonderful memories we have made by joining dvc. :mickey:

[Dixie Springs]

I haven't checked into any prices for a while, but has the recent phenomenon of people giving away their timeshares placed any downward pressure on DVC resale prices? I know DVC isn't the standard timeshare, etc., so you don't have to defend it. I'm also not knockng DVC, so no flames, please. Just wondering if the timeshare 'bear market', if you will, has made DVC any more affordable?

[starry_solo]

As of March 2011, the benefits for those who bought resale (after a date in March) were decreased. They could only use at DVC resorts. The points could not be used at any other resort (no hotels, no concierge collection, no cruises, etc.).

The other forums specifically dealing with DVC (disboards and mouseowners) has a great deal of information regarding prices that people have been able to purchase their points from (either direct with additional benefits or through the resale market).

[Aurora]

As of March 2011, the benefits for those who bought resale (after a date in March) were decreased. They could only use at DVC resorts. The points could not be used at any other resort (no hotels, no concierge collection, no cruises, etc.).

The other forums specifically dealing with DVC (disboards and mouseowners) has a great deal of information regarding prices that people have been able to purchase their points from (either direct with additional benefits or through the resale market).

For clarification, while it's true that DVC points purchased through resale after March 21 cannot be used for non-DVC Disney hotels, Disney cruises, or hotels in the Adventurer Collection, these points can still be used at RCI, Club Cordial and Club Intrawest resorts.

[Ian]

I haven't checked into any prices for a while, but has the recent phenomenon of people giving away their timeshares placed any downward pressure on DVC resale prices? I know DVC isn't the standard timeshare, etc., so you don't have to defend it. I'm also not knockng DVC, so no flames, please. Just wondering if the timeshare 'bear market', if you will, has made DVC any more affordable?I haven't seen any significant downward moves in resale prices for awhile now. They did drop pretty dramatically not long after the rest of the real estate market collapsed, but nothing major since then that I've noticed.

The other thing is, the prices for the more desirable resorts still remain pretty strong. It's the older or less desirable spots that seem to have taken the biggest hit.

[Hammer]

The other thing is, the prices for the more desirable resorts still remain pretty strong. It's the older or less desirable spots that seem to have taken the biggest hit.

While the price of the "more desirable" resorts (in your eyes, anyway) is not at as low as say Vero Beach or Saratoga Springs, they most definitely are cheaper than buying through Disney. Bay Lake Towers is being sold at $130-140 by Disney, $ 95-99 through resale.

[joonyer]

I would love to be a DVC member, but.

1) we are unable to travel to WDW but once every 2-3 years, and probably less in the future, and

2) We don't do very much timeshare type travel anywhere else either. We do mainly long road trips with spontaneous route changes. and wilderness camping trips. We do travel to a beach somewhere usually every year with extended family. (I would never do a Disney trip together with all of them)

That's the reason we have not seriously considered buying into DVC.

[AndrewJackson]

My family and I have rented DVC points for 7 of our 15+ WDW vacations. It is the only way we go now.

We have looked very seriously at buying around 100 points on the resale market.

Has anyone done an analysis comparing buying DVC and renting DVC? We typically rent for $9 - $11 per point.

[Ian]

While the price of the "more desirable" resorts (in your eyes, anyway) is not at as low as say Vero Beach or Saratoga Springs, they most definitely are cheaper than buying through Disney. Bay Lake Towers is being sold at $130-140 by Disney, $ 95-99 through resale.I meant desirable in terms of their demand on the open market. I actually happen to like SSR quite a bit (which I think you and I have discussed before), so it wasn't really in my eyes I was referring to.

But your point is well taken ... buying resale is significantly cheaper than buying direct from Disney.


I would love to be a DVC member, but.

1) we are unable to travel to WDW but once every 2-3 years, and probably less in the future.This alone is a good enough reason not to buy, IMO. Yes, you can do other things with your points (like rent them or bank them or trade out) on the off-years, but where the real value comes into play for owning DVC (IMO) is when you consistently use your points to stay at DVC properties.


My family and I have rented DVC points for 7 of our 15+ WDW vacations. It is the only way we go now.

We have looked very seriously at buying around 100 points on the resale market.

Has anyone done an analysis comparing buying DVC and renting DVC? We typically rent for $9 - $11 per point.I've tried, but honestly it's a pretty tough scenario to model because of all the inflationary and economic unknowns you have to deal with.

It also depends a lot on where/when/how you stay, what you anticipate your future needs are for accomodations, and how long you think you might be vacationing at WDW into the future.

Because let's remember, the real value in DVC comes once your membership is paid for (assuming you finance). In the first 10 years your total cost of ownership is going to be a lot higher as compared to just renting points, but predicting what happens beyond that period is where it gets dicey.

[seanyred]

Because let's remember, the real value in DVC comes once your membership is paid for (assuming you finance). In the first 10 years your total cost of ownership is going to be a lot higher as compared to just renting points, but predicting what happens beyond that period is where it gets dicey.

I agree with you when all you have is annual dues the real value of having DVC kicks in. But in my case another way I look at it is comparing rack rate to what I pay now (annual dues + mortgage payment). In those instances I am spending less money. Of course when Disney is offering deep discounts I might be spending a little more, but those discounts will not be forever or as deep.

[MarkC]

I think it really boils down to how often you go to Disney, and whether you like to stay at a value resort or a deluxe resort.

We average about 1 trip per year and love to stay at Beach Club so for us its an absolute no-brainer to have DVC. Plus we use a Disney visa to pay our annual dues so we basically stay there 6 nights a year and will never pay another cent while staying there. I will point out we've been there about 20 times, so even though we go to the parks daily, we also like to relax and swim and enjoy the surroundings.

If you are a person who likes to spend all their time in the parks or is fine staying at a value resort, DVC is not for you, especially if you have to finance it.

Finally, as other posters have mentioned, there is the non-financial aspect of being able to enjoy a deluxe resort and a Disney vacation without worrying about the cost. In fact, my son and his fiance are getting married next May, and we were happy to give them our points and a week at the Beach Club next May for their honeymoon. That falls into the "priceless" category.

[epceddie]

DVC makes sense for us, because we're able to make two or three trips a year during value season when the kids are all back in school and the crowds at the park are much smaller and a lot more manageable.

[mrsmouse]

Quite a few years ago we took the tour and decided against it. We had no grandchildren and were not really in a financial position to enjoy our commitment. In 2008 we did the tour again. We were certainly in a better financial position and also had a granchild who had already been to WDW a few times. For us it was a 'no-brainer.' We have visited 2-3 times every year since 2008 and have definitely found the benefits. We need the additional space that a 2-bedroom unit offers, and have several other family members that we have been able to share the experience with. For us, the timing and choice was right.

I should also mention that for us, BLT :cloud9: and a grandchild go together. Needless to say, that was our reason for choosing BLT.

[lawgirl]

I am going to jump in, and hopefully it won't be in the wrong place! Someone please redirect me if needed!

We go to Disney usually 2 times a year, always stay at AKL. Right now, we honestly don't have that much cash all at once to pay the DVC 100%. But I'm trying to figure out from a smart "investing" perspective, if we keep up our intentions of going 2 times a year and only staying at a deluxe villa, would it make more sense to buy into DVC and just finance it? I'm hoping we would pay it off early, and probably will. We are really "lifetime" Disney people, and I cannot imagine a year without going. And we are definitely not Value resort people (I don't have a problem with Value resorts, and I definitely see their "value" but its not our cup of tea. We LOVE the AKL and spend alot of time at our resort.)

Before I make the call to get more info from our DVC guide, I hope someone here can help me out! I really need a financial advisor to crunch the numbers;-)

For instance, I am looking at going in September and December, like we did last year. We paid approx $1200 in Sept for a 1 bedroom villa, and $800 in Dec for just a standard view room (not DVC rental) (and we have always paid the vacations off). And we've pretty much done that trend the past few years. I guess I just need to add up how much financing payments would be versus how much we would spend on the hotel each time.

Thanks ahead of time...this is new territory for us, even though my dad was there on opening day!

[VWL Mom]

Right now, DVC direct AKV is running about $125/point (after promotions applied) whereas resale is running in the $65 range. Our sponsor The TImeshare Store (http://www.dvc-resales.com) is one place to start your search.

I think you're right to want to sit down with an advisor to run the numbers. That's probably your first step. Look at the point charts (http://www.dvc-resales.com/Animal-Kingdom/index.htm) for AKL and decide how many points you want to buy. You don't need to buy them all at once, maybe start with one week and add on later. Keep in mind, annual dues this year are running $5.68 per point so that is an added cost.

If you are financing a portion than you need to consider the interest rate. If you are buying resale you would need to arrange your own financing. Figure all that out and then decide if you want to proceed.

[lawgirl]

Thanks for the info Lynn! One more question, which seems relevant. Why would someone pay full price for a DVC membership when they can do the resale for almost half-price? What is the drawback to resale points?

Thanks so much. This has definitely given us something to consider!

(And on a side note, as I obviously have alot more research to do, so you can buy in at, let's say 90 points, then later on, you can add another 90 points? How does that work?)

Thanks!!!!!!

[TinkerbellT421]

Thanks for the info Lynn! One more question, which seems relevant. Why would someone pay full price for a DVC membership when they can do the resale for almost half-price? What is the drawback to resale points?

Thanks so much. This has definitely given us something to consider!

(And on a side note, as I obviously have alot more research to do, so you can buy in at, let's say 90 points, then later on, you can add another 90 points? How does that work?)

Thanks!!!!!!

There are a few reasons for some.
1) The right of first refusal by Disney
2) You cannot use points for anything other than on site Disney property with resale
3) The contracts are shorter and already in use so instead of having "so many years from today" the ones already in use only have so many years left.

If purchasing through Disney there is a minimum first purchase buy in, ours was 160. It is higher now I believe. With add-ons however you can buy any amount you want.

[VWL Mom]

Effective March 2011 restrictions were put on resale which limited owners from using points for Disney Collection, Disney Concierge Collection, and Disney Adventurer Collection. If you are planning on using your points only at WDW or DL, than this is a non-issue.

Other than that, right now there is no major drawback. Resale rates are low right now and IMO are just a reflection of the economy. Especially BLT and AKV where many bought and then realized they couldn't afford it so either decided to sell or were foreclosed.

Another point is DVC requires a minimum purchase which I believe is 150 whereas resale doesn't have a restriction so if you could find some small contracts you could buy them. If you are going to be combining smaller contracts it's best to keep the same use year, just simplifies booking later on. We did our original purchase through DVC because we didn't know about resale, our recent add-on was through resale and saved us 50%.

Resale requires some patience, once the contracts are signed they go to Disney and they decide whether or not they want the contract. Most times the sale goes through but there are times when the exercise ROFR because they think it's too cheap or they may have someone waiting to buy the spot. Since they have plenty of AKV inventory I don't think that would be an issue.

[TinkerbellT421]

Effective March 2011 restrictions were put on resale which limited owners from using points for Disney Collection, Disney Concierge Collection, and Disney Adventurer Collection. If you are planning on using your points only at WDW or DL, than this is a non-issue.

Other than that, right now there is no major drawback. Resale rates are low right now and IMO are just a reflection of the economy. Especially BLT and AKV where many bought and then realized they couldn't afford it so either decided to sell or were foreclosed.

Another point is DVC requires a minimum purchase which I believe is 150 whereas resale doesn't have a restriction so if you could find some small contracts you could buy them. If you are going to be combining smaller contracts it's best to keep the same use year, just simplifies booking later on. We did our original purchase through DVC because we didn't know about resale, our recent add-on was through resale and saved us 50%.

Resale requires some patience, once the contracts are signed they go to Disney and they decide whether or not they want the contract. Most times the sale goes through but there are times when the exercise ROFR because they think it's too cheap or they may have someone waiting to buy the spot. Since they have plenty of AKV inventory I don't think that would be an issue.

As of 2008 when we purchased the minimum allowment was 160 points.

[VWL Mom]

3) The contracts are shorter and already in use so instead of having "so many years from today" the ones already in use only have so many years left.
.

Just to clarify, resale contracts and direct contracts have the same life for the same resort. The shelf life of the contract depends on the specific resort.

January 31, 2042 (Old Key West*, Boardwalk Villas, Beach Club Villas, Villas at Wilderness Lodge, Vero Beach Resort and Hilton Head Resort.) Saratoga Springs memberships end on January 31, 2054, Animal Kingdom Listings end on January 31, 2057, Bay Lake Towers listings and The Villas at Disney's Grand Californian Hotel® and Spa end end January 31, 2060. *Some Old Key West listings end 2057 and those are clearly marked.

[VWL Mom]

Tonya, we always seem to be cross-typing :D

[TinkerbellT421]

Just to clarify, resale contracts and direct contracts have the same life for the same resort. The shelf life of the contract depends on the specific resort.

January 31, 2042 (Old Key West*, Boardwalk Villas, Beach Club Villas, Villas at Wilderness Lodge, Vero Beach Resort and Hilton Head Resort.) Saratoga Springs memberships end on January 31, 2054, Animal Kingdom Listings end on January 31, 2057, Bay Lake Towers listings and The Villas at Disney's Grand Californian Hotel® and Spa end end January 31, 2060. *Some Old Key West listings end 2057 and those are clearly marked.


Tonya, we always seem to be cross-typing :D

lol, meant years used to date! Duh!

Aren't we? lol :D Your always much more detailed though!