Please allow me to vent

[luvdiznee]

I will try to keep this short. My DD10 is a Type I Diabetic. And for this reason she wears a $7,000 insulin pump. We have been dealing with this for 9 years. Anyway, she is in the 5th grade and has been at the same school since K Grade. She was lucky enough to have the same loving caring compassionate nurse for her first 5 years at the school. Obviously this nurse knew my daughter very well. And because of this she understood her shyness and apprehension in talking to others, including the nurse. Anyway, this nurse decided she had to move onto to another job because she needed to make more money. No problem, we hugged cried and partied before she left. So now we are at a new school year with a new nurse, principal and teacher of course. I called the day before school to try to get in and talk to the nurse to explain my DD's routine as well as how to work her pump. This was in the morning and she let me know she was leaving in an hour. I was at work at the time and was going to be there until 2:00, she said we would just have to meet tomorrow. I said OK. Well of course the first day of school is very hectic so I had only limited time to explain things to her. I did ask her about dd using the restroom in her office, which this is for the students. The teachers of course have their own. She said, "what's the matter with her using the other one?" I said if she needs to be checked for ketones, at least she's there where you will need to know that. I mean I know that sounds minor but she so sounded like it bothered her. But in the first week she decides that my dd is "clueless", yes she actually used this word. Because dd had forgotten to come to her office once or twice to get her blood sugar (bs) checked. And I explain to her that it's a new year, with a little change in her routine (because at home we can be more flexible) so she is just a little forgetful. So I talk to dd about it and it is resolved. And I wasn't bothered too much by the term at first until she used it a couple more times. But her dad said that's not so bad, just let it go. So I did. Over the next few weeks she seemed to get alittle better bedside manner. But then she came up with this idea to make my dd more responsible with her diabetes that she should write down her bs and # carbs she eats. Kind of like a tally. I explained to her that her pump keeps all of that information and I didn't see the need for her to do it. She said I'm thinking about you. That it is going to make her more responsible and she will help you more. I told her my dd knows how to check her bs and give herself insulin and that's all she needed to do. I just said whatever. So my dd was doing this for a while and sure enough she got tired of it and had stopped doing it. So today, I paid a surprise visit to the school and found my dd in the nurses office writing this stuff. Now this was after she did all her stuff for her bs. So I said what did you come down late? She said no I have to write this. So dd had already finished and went up to the classroom. And me and nursie are talking she asked why was I against this, what are your concerns for your dd? I said my concern is her being able to recognize a low bs before she goes into a seizure not knowing how many carbs she ate or how much insulin she took. And she says well sometime your dd doesn't seem to know what she is doing, that I will ask her does she need me for anything and if not why isn't she back in her room? I said maybe she needs alittle prodding in getting things started but she knows pretty much what to do. So at this point I am thinking why doesn't dd do her stuff on her own like she does at home. But in letting this nurse ramble on she did say dd did check herself, ate her snack and gave herself insulin. I said so she did this on her own, she said YES. I said well then I don't understand what you mean when you just said she doesn't do things on her own. That right there you just admitted she did do this on her own. And of course I confirmed this with dd when I picked her up. She said what does she mean I am not doing it on my own? I think this nurse is too concerned with things that are none of her business. Like when my dd had a high bs and she asked what she ate for breakfast I told her cereal. She said don't they tell you to feed her less sugary stuff. I said yes but she is only 10 and I don't want to put her on a 24hour veggie diet. Just like she told dd not to eat a cookie, and I told her that is why she has the pump so it can give her insulin when she does decide to be a kid. I said all you need to know is how many carbs, which she said she got from the teacher and decided it was too high so that's why she told dd not to eat it. I could go on but I'm sure this is already too long. But I am going to tell her to stop with that nonsense of writing her #'s and all down and especially NEVER to call her during class time to do it. Thanks for listening. :mad:

[mrsgaribaldi]

Your DD sounds great and the nurse not so much. She's probably trying to help but not everyone can have a great "bedside manner". I wish that you and your DD didn't have to deal with any of this. I know it happens but it breaks my heart that she has so much to worry about at such a short time in life. Here's some :pixie::pixie::pixie::pixie:for your DD and for things to go better at school. She sounds terrific:thumbsup:

[kakn7294]

I'm sorry you have to go through this. The nurse is probably just trying to help but she sounds like she has control issues. Perhaps she doesn't really understand the whole insulin pump thing - they are rather complicated little devices and it's wonderful how independent they can make diabetics. Your DD sounds like she can manage her diabetes pretty well for a 10 yo (I know adults who don't handle it that well) and I don't see a problem with her "cheating" on her diet once in a while. In fact, she probably wouldn't manage her diet as well if you forced her to eat "healthy" all of the time - she's a kid! My suggestion to you is to schedule a conference with the nurse and perhaps the principal and teacher as well and find out just how much the nurse does understand diabetes and the insulin pump. Maybe you can come to an understanding and all of this madness will end. Good luck to you and your DD!

[DisneyTwirler13!]

I know people who also use the insulin pump, and when they tried to explain it to me, I got lost almost immediatly, so maybe the nurse is lost too, but that's no excuse for acting the way she is. I mean, she's your daughter, not the nurses. And as long as your dd knows what she's eating, whats the big deal about eating a cookie every once and a while? Your dd sounds like a very responsible girl who understands what to do with her diabetes. I send you some :pixie: to help you and your dd feel better, and some :pick: to brighten your day!

[MsMin]

If I saw a child in this situation I might suggest to hang in there and encourage her to "use both ears" meaning sometimes she has to let most of it go in one ear and out the other. Sometimes we have to jump through a lot of unnecessary hoops. I'm sure the nurse means well and some ppl think it's so easy to be "perfect". I know diabetes and diet is so hard for adults to manage much less a child. It's tough to teach an adult that what a person says or does is about themselves not about you (encourage your child to "not take it personally") By this I mean the nurse's comments speak more about herself than about your dd and getting a child to understand that she is not doing anything wrong is tough b/c I'm sure the nurse represents the authority to her.
Unfortunately w/ schools it's tough to make changes in situations like this and sometimes it's easier to bend even when they are wrong. The advantage of bending often saves us a lot of daily stress and puts us back in control b/c it's our choice to do so. Your child may be intimidated by the nurse and find it easier to comply than to deal with the stress of disagreeing.
Your child's doctor may be the only authority where the nurse may listen. Another option may be with your child's teacher. If you explain that you are concerned that your child is missing valuable class time for needless documentation maybe the teacher can help.
I know we have a lot of time left in this school year and I'm sending you and her :pixie: Good Luck...

[JPL]

Ok first off as an educator I can tell you the word "clueless" should not be used to describe a child and if you wanted to push the issue you could get the nurse in big time trouble.

As for the resolution, I agree with having a doctor call the nurse and tell her exactly what he needs from her and what he wants your child to do. Afterall he is the one who knows this stuff not her.

[luvdiznee]

I'm sorry you have to go through this. The nurse is probably just trying to help but she sounds like she has control issues. Perhaps she doesn't really understand the whole insulin pump thing - they are rather complicated little devices and it's wonderful how independent they can make diabetics. Your DD sounds like she can manage her diabetes pretty well for a 10 yo (I know adults who don't handle it that well) and I don't see a problem with her "cheating" on her diet once in a while. In fact, she probably wouldn't manage her diet as well if you forced her to eat "healthy" all of the time - she's a kid! My suggestion to you is to schedule a conference with the nurse and perhaps the principal and teacher as well and find out just how much the nurse does understand diabetes and the insulin pump. Maybe you can come to an understanding and all of this madness will end. Good luck to you and your DD!

I agree 100%. She wants more control which is why she came up with this writing down the #'s. Because I also believe she does not understand the pump itself. I told her in the beginning all she is there to do is to be a 2nd pair of eyes for my dd, for example when she eats 20 carbs make sure she puts that # in the pump and not say 50. That's it. And that's why I am definitely calling Monday and telling her no more # writing for my dd. If she wants a record she herself can do it. Especially the fact that she called dd down from class to do this. I was going to send an email to the principal herself about all of this, since that seems to be the new way they like to communicate. But I'm not so sure about that, because I had to send her one before :mad:about a teacher who would not allow my dd to drink from her water bottle in the classroom. I said WHAT??? It's not like she was asking to leave the room. This was a subsitute teacher not her regular teacher. Anyway I sent the em to the principal asked her to respond to me, she never did. So at open house I asked her about it. She said she never got it. I mean I got her em address off of the school stationary. So I explained it a little and said I'm not sure how much you know about being diabetic, she said, "oh I'm familiar with it, my uncle just died from it". Nice. Thanks. Anyway so I resent the em and a copy of it by mail and all she did was give it to her actual teacher. She then asked dd about it and told her she was going to turn this sub in. Haven't heard nothing more about this. See, told you I can go on and on. I so wish I could just quit my job and homeschool her. But I will schedule a meet with them. Thank You so much everyone for your pixie dust. It really gives me a good feeling. :cloud9:

[merlinmagic4]

I agree, you daughter sounds wonderful and it sounds like she's doing a great job!!!! Diabetes is so tricky; she doesn't need the nurse complicating things OR calling her clueless. That part is totally unacceptable and if she says it again I would definitely mention it to the teacher or principal. Who would say that?!?

Some people get so stuck in the "medical" part of things that they forget that the kids need to be kids and that means having a cookie sometimes. That is the wonderful thing about the pump! It seems a bit nosy for her to ask her what she had for breakfast since it seems to be clear that you are an actively involved parent.

I would get a letter from her doctor stating exactly what needs to be done in school and he/she could explain that the pump is keeping all the information so she doesn't need to spend precious school time writing it out. This is another great thing about the pump!

I sure hope it gets better for you. It is early in the year so don't lose hope yet. Just be firm and pleasant in your "requests" and hopefully they'll see you're not going to budge so they'll meet you where you need them to.

:pixie: to your daughter and to you.

[luvdiznee]

She does have doctors orders but they just don't spell out her plan of not having to write the #'s down. Maybe that's part of the problem. So if she hears that from them, that should help some. But she is controlling as well in that she says she is concerned about ME. Because when we have talked and I've told her I'm up checking dd's bs during the night like at 11pm, 2am and 5am, she doesn't understand why I need to do that. I said to be sure her #'s are good. Trying to avoid damage down the road. So a lot of you are right when you say she doesn't understand the pump, because she thinks with having the pump that everything should be all perfect and good. I also told her with me being her mother this is what I have to do and certainly want to do it for dd's health and well being sake. If I have to lose some sleep, so be it. She says but do you really need to do it that many times during the night? Uh, yes. Anyway. Thanks again. Believe or not even though I'm typing this on a keyboard this helps a lot. Thanks again. :thumbsup:

[Fairy Grandmother]

I so wish I could just quit my job and homeschool her.

I wish you could, too. I totally understand your reason to vent! It brought back so many unpleasant memories. My 11 year old granddaughter is a type 1 diabetic and has been since she was 22 months old. She went to regular school for two years before my daughter started homeschooling her and her twin sister. It took so much time to deal with all the different personalities and their agendas at the school that my daughter decided the time would be better spent on doing the teaching herself.

People do not realize the seriousness of this chronic illness and how difficult it is to manage, esp. for a child. You are doing a wonderful job and do not need the aggravation you are getting from the nurse and the school. I am sendiing you lots and lots of :pixie::pixie::pixie:.
I hope things get better soon.

[BronxTigger]

The nurse is probably having her write everything down to CYA (Cover herself). Especially with NCLB laws and the itch to sue, schools have to document everything. The nurse is new to the school and is probably trying to keep herself out of trouble (for example if your daughter has a problem with her b.s. then the nurse has the papers in your DD handwriting that she came in at such time and the numbers were ___.) However, the current system isn't working for you or your daughter; she's missing too much class time.

If the documentation is the real reason behind writing the numbers down, then the nurse should write it (she's prob a faster writer) and just have your DD initial it or something. She'd miss less class time but the nurse still gets her numbers.

I have to say that you are doing a good job with keeping your DDs diabetes in check. I don't know that much about it, but I'm a teacher and my room is next to the nurse's office at my school. Up until last year there was a type 1 diabetic (she was in 5th grade last year, she moved on) at our school, and the nurse was always so frustrated with the girl and her mother because they were not controlling it well and they didn't seem to understand the gravity of the situation. The nurse said she is going to have huge health problems down the road and no matter what she said to this girl, she never changed her ways.

Good luck dealing with the school. It sounds like you need it. :pixie:

[luvdiznee]

The nurse is probably having her write everything down to CYA (Cover herself). Especially with NCLB laws and the itch to sue, schools have to document everything. The nurse is new to the school and is probably trying to keep herself out of trouble (for example if your daughter has a problem with her b.s. then the nurse has the papers in your DD handwriting that she came in at such time and the numbers were ___.) However, the current system isn't working for you or your daughter; she's missing too much class time.

If the documentation is the real reason behind writing the numbers down, then the nurse should write it (she's prob a faster writer) and just have your DD initial it or something. She'd miss less class time but the nurse still gets her numbers.

I have to say that you are doing a good job with keeping your DDs diabetes in check. I don't know that much about it, but I'm a teacher and my room is next to the nurse's office at my school. Up until last year there was a type 1 diabetic (she was in 5th grade last year, she moved on) at our school, and the nurse was always so frustrated with the girl and her mother because they were not controlling it well and they didn't seem to understand the gravity of the situation. The nurse said she is going to have huge health problems down the road and no matter what she said to this girl, she never changed her ways.

Good luck dealing with the school. It sounds like you need it. :pixie:

Thank You. And, I did confirm with my dd's doctors office that even for high school students that this is the nuses job. Not a 10 year old. And they said the fact that she pulled her out of class to do this was ridiculous (their wording). Thanks again.

[IloveJack]

:mad::mad::mad:
Being an ins-dep. diabetic and a teacher myself, I can say you're doing a great job!

So I explained it a little and said I'm not sure how much you know about being diabetic, she said, "oh I'm familiar with it, my uncle just died from it". Nice. Thanks. Anyway
I have learned that so very few people actually know anything about this disease. They think that because it's "invisible" until major problems arise, that it's no big deal. So many of my students hear me say "I'm a diabetic" all the time, but just can't get their minds wrapped around it. They bring me cupcakes, cookies, ect., and I just don't have the heart to tell them no. (So I save them for my dh, who loves his job of "disposing" of them for me!)Their parents don't get it either. I get more homemade candy for Christmas than anything else! I have one parent who understands. When her son brings a snack for everyone, there's a Dt. Mt. Dew for me. :cloud9:

She does have doctors orders but they just don't spell out her plan of not having to write the #'s down. Maybe that's part of the problem. So if she hears that from them, that should help some... [br]I said to be sure her #'s are good. Trying to avoid damage down the road.
People who don't understand the way insulin works just don't get diabetes at all. The point of the insulin is to bring the sugar back down. There's no reason to take insulin if you don't eat any carbs. No one can go through life without ever eating any sugar. Sheesh, I'm a 27 year old, with a pretty good handle on my diet, and I still have a treat every now and then. It's better to do that, than to go without for so long that you end up blowing your diet to pieces, and eating a whole cake at one time!



People do not realize the seriousness of this chronic illness and how difficult it is to manage, esp. for a child.
I agree wholeheartedly! As said before, most people who aren't directly affected just don't get it. And I don't think the rest of the world should cater to me... don't get me wrong. But so many people look at me like I'm a complete idiot, when I go out to a nice restaurant and ask for a listing of nutrition facts! Like it's a crime to admit what's in their food! Come on, if McDonald's can admit to what's in theirs, why can't the more quality restaurants? :soapbox:

Anyhow, hang in there. Ask the doctor for a letter explaining everything to the principal, teacher, and nurse. If that doesn't take care of it, go to the school board. I'm sorry (well, no I'm not), but this can be taken as far as discrimination. Tell your daughter to keep up the good work, too. I had a pitiful excuse for a doctor for most of my adult life. I lost a good bit of my vision, and now live with slight neuropathy, because he wasn't worried about my 300+ fasting sugars! It's hard to control it, but the consequences of not are even worse, I promise!
Lots of prayer and :pixie: coming your way!

[DisneyDudet]

When I was in nursing school, we had to go through a Communities class for our Bachelor's. Our "clinical" for that class was to be placed in a school and work with the school nurse once a week. I think I had one of the best nurses! If they had a student with that kind of health problem, or any health issue for that matter, the nurse and a trained educator about the disease, would meet with all staff members, including janitorial staff, just in case the child wasn't with the teacher or nurse. They discussed treatment options and what to do in an emergency.

So, as a nurse, and one who has been in schools for a short time, I would suggest a Diabetic Educator come in and speak with the teachers, nurse, and principal. Most hospitals have one on staff, and are pretty willing to teach anyone about Diabetes.

As with anything, if you don't use it, you lose it. This nurse may not have had a lot of hands on experience with Diabetes, or it has been a while. They teach you in nursing school and the nursing books to log similar to what she is doing with your DD, but that is for people who are learning about the disease and are unfamiliar with it, or are pretty brittle, and require closer monitoring.

Obviously, she is not up to snuff on her information, because if your daughter is a brittle diabetic (nothing wrong with that, happens all the time) and she has some continuous insulin from her pump, it does require finger sticks and checks during the night, and there are some effects that the body does (Somogyi/"Dawn") that cause severe changes in blood sugar, that need to be reversed.

If she wants documentation on her BS levels, carbs, and insulin given, what if DD keeps a log in the classroom and on Fridays, everyone goes over it together at a time that does not take away from learning time? I can only see that the nurse would need immediate information if DD has uncontrolled DM, which, it sounds like she doesn't. It seems you keep great control over it. She's young, and yes, she might need to be reminded, as young minds get side-tracked, and I'm sure she longs to be "normal" like everyone else, not worrying about it all. But that in NO WAY means she is "clueless," which should never be said in the school environment, and should be reported. You did mention that she is a little shy, correct? That can be mistaken for many things, which the nurse is interpreting incorrectly. She may not want to answer the nurse or is just quiet. Plus, could this nurse have said something to DD to make her feel unintelligent? That will keep her from telling her anything, too. I was a very quiet and shy person. The school I was in tested my verbal ability, and they thought I couldn't speak very well. Come to find out, I was a very shy and quiet child, and didn't like to talk to people I didn't know. This might be the same for DD.

Sorry for this long winded nurse rant, but it sounds like the fault is on the nurse. It might be a control issue. It might be a lack of knowledge. It might be a combination of both. My suggestion is, speak with the principal about a Diabetic Educator(DE) for the nurse, teachers, and any other staff that your DD comes in contact with, and that might make an impact. The nurse might be offended by it, but it can be told that it isn't just for her, its for all staff that come into contact with DD. It would be great to find a DE that is familiar with the same pump DD has, in case of malfunction or a hypoglycemic episode. (Oh, btw, does she have some fast acting glucose? That is something she might need :) )

I hope you can solve this problem soon. I come into contact with Diabetic patients daily (albeit an older group of them) but it is something I am interested in. I've thought about studying for my Diabetic Educator certification, so I know a smidge... Also, I am all for a little "treat" for anyone on a restricted diet, for whatever reason. To stay on top of the diet, it seems almost needed to have a little "cheat" every once in a while. DD obviously knows how to control her diet, and knows she can't have a large amount of sweets. But a cookie now and then won't take years off her life.

Please let us know how this pans out. I will be thinking and praying for you and your nurse!

[luvdiznee]

That's a good suggestion about the Diabetes Educator. Since I do belong to a group of "Parents of Children who are Diabetic" that meets quarterly, I think I will contact our coordinator and see what if anything can be arranged. Or maybe I will ask DD's doctor. Not sure if there would be a cost to this, but it's at least worth a try. When I wrote the instructions for the school nurse, I made enough copies for ALL the teachers and by all I mean music, art, phys ed etc. But who knows who actually read them. :thedolls:Thanks again for the suggestion, DisneyDudet. And Thank you all for the pixie dust. :thumbsup:

[kakn7294]

That's a good suggestion about the Diabetes Educator. Since I do belong to a group of "Parents of Children who are Diabetic" that meets quarterly, I think I will contact our coordinator and see what if anything can be arranged. Or maybe I will ask DD's doctor. Not sure if there would be a cost to this, but it's at least worth a try. When I wrote the instructions for the school nurse, I made enough copies for ALL the teachers and by all I mean music, art, phys ed etc. But who knows who actually read them. :thedolls:Thanks again for the suggestion, DisneyDudet. And Thank you all for the pixie dust. :thumbsup:
I like Morgan's idea of the Diabetic Educator too - it would be great for all involved. As far as the teachers reading the instructions you sent, I'm sure that there are some that have either read it or have filed it in an easily accessible location in case of emergency but I'll bet there are some who ignored it as well. When my DD broke her arm last year, I sent a complete list of instructions to school as well as spoke to some of the key people involved in her school day, but every one of the rules on the list was violated at least once - fortunately it did not result in any setbacks for her recovery. My point is that sometimes people outside of the situation just don't get it. They think we are being over-protective parents - yes, I was told that when I approached Meg's teacher about her arm - "we know what to do, she's not the first child to have a broken arm in school". I know that, but she's my child and we had rules for the care of that arm I wanted to make sure they knew about. I'm sure you feel the same way about your DD's diabetes and her routine. It's what works for you and it may not be textbook care, but if it works why mess with it? Again, I wish you luck with this situation.

[Tiggerdog]

OP, like others have said, I would request a meeting with all the adults at school who have contact with your daughter.

I teach middle school music and would get the medical alert files on students frequently. As a former paramedic, I understood the importance of these files and would hound other teachers of the student to read them.

We do not have school nurses in our buildings (they are on call and share several buildings), so our principal decided she would require a parent, teacher, principal, anyone else who had contact with the child to meet before the school year begins. She brings in the nurse coordinator for our district for the meeting as well. These meetings allow us to ask questions and hear concerns the parents and child may have. If we get new students during the year, a meeting is scheduled ASAP.

At these meetings, we also ask how much information can we leave for a sub regarding the child's medical needs. We do this because we have had parents very upset that we tell complete strangers, the sub, about confidential medical issues.

Please contact the principal and request a meeting with all the adults your daughter has contact with. Teach them about diabetes so that they know how to help your daughter if she is in need.

[luvdiznee]

When my DD broke her arm last year, I sent a complete list of instructions to school as well as spoke to some of the key people involved in her school day, but every one of the rules on the list was violated at least once - fortunately it did not result in any setbacks for her recovery. My point is that sometimes people outside of the situation just don't get it. They think we are being over-protective parents - yes, I was told that when I approached Meg's teacher about her arm - "we know what to do, she's not the first child to have a broken arm in school". I know that, but she's my child and we had rules for the care of that arm I wanted to make sure they knew about. I'm sure you feel the same way about your DD's diabetes and her routine. It's what works for you and it may not be textbook care, but if it works why mess with it? Again, I wish you luck with this situation.

I sure do feel the same way. I can't say how many times, if there was a substitute and as soon as I try to start talking about DD's condition, "I know, we have dealt with this before". But like you said this is my DD. :thedolls:And yes things are different with her. What works for one does not usually work for another. Thanks

[Here we go again...]

I am so sorry that you are having to go through this at school. I do not know what is wrong with the nurses these days....

My DD has IBS and suffers with attacks quite often. Sometimes the flare ups are do bad that she starts vomiting and has even passed out. My DD can feel when an episode is coming on and if she can get to her anti-spasmodics in time she can usually keep the pain under control.
The new nurse this year decided that my DD can not take her mediine until 4 hours after school start because she "should know" when she is going to have an attack and take the pills before leaving home. She also think my DD is not intelligent enough to remember whether or not she took the pills before leaving home so even if she starts cramping the nusre dpes not want to give her the medicine. My DD is 13.
I called my doctor as spoke to the nurse in his office. She was furious at how the school nurse was acting. She sent a letter to the school that said that NO NURSE could over ride a doctors orders. She also asked for the nurses credentials because she did not feel this person could possibly be a real nurse. :D
Now they are getting a little better with my DD.

It is only going to get harder and harder every year. The school is so worried about lawsuits that they do not want to let any one take medicine.
If your doctor or nurse will write a letter like mine did, have them do it. You will see a change in attitude pretty quickly.

[luvdiznee]

It is only going to get harder and harder every year. The school is so worried about lawsuits that they do not want to let any one take medicine.
If your doctor or nurse will write a letter like mine did, have them do it. You will see a change in attitude pretty quickly.

I can't believe it to go as far as to try to override the doctors orders. Not good. But as far as a letter, I myself just sent an email to the Principal, detailing the tension that we have been going through with this nurse. I also left the nurse a message as of this morning that my DD will not be writing the #'s down. So waiting to see what happens next. Thanks again.

[kakn7294]

I am so sorry that you are having to go through this at school. I do not know what is wrong with the nurses these days....Part of what is wrong with the nurses these days has to do with what is expected of nurses these days. Nurses have so much more responsibility than in the past. We are expected to be much more independent within the scope of what we are allowed to do - no more blindly following doctors orders although we still must follow them. We are also expected to be much better educated than in the past - sometimes more than the doctors. Nurses used to be expected to be the meek angels of mercy in our white uniforms caring for our patients but never questioning things. That image has long gone by the wayside as we are not only caregivers but now also counselors, educators, patient advocates, and so much more. When this translates into the real world, it creates a lot of "know-it-all", hot-shot nurses who refuse to ask questions and want things their way or no way and certainly don't need anyone else's help.

I'm not defending these school nurses - I feel that they are way off base in the way they have treated luvdiznee's and Angel's DDs. Both situations could have and should have been handled much better by these nurses than they were. I just ask that you don't generalize their bad behavior to all nurses - most of us really do have our patient's best interests at heart.

[Here we go again...]

I can't believe it to go as far as to try to override the doctors orders. Not good. But as far as a letter, I myself just sent an email to the Principal, detailing the tension that we have been going through with this nurse. I also left the nurse a message as of this morning that my DD will not be writing the #'s down. So waiting to see what happens next. Thanks again.
Stay on top of it. If you do not get a response from the principal go to the head nurse at the school board.


Part of what is wrong with the nurses these days has to do with what is expected of nurses these days. Nurses have so much more responsibility than in the past. We are expected to be much more independent within the scope of what we are allowed to do - no more blindly following doctors orders although we still must follow them. We are also expected to be much better educated than in the past - sometimes more than the doctors. Nurses used to be expected to be the meek angels of mercy in our white uniforms caring for our patients but never questioning things. That image has long gone by the wayside as we are not only caregivers but now also counselors, educators, patient advocates, and so much more. When this translates into the real world, it creates a lot of "know-it-all", hot-shot nurses who refuse to ask questions and want things their way or no way and certainly don't need anyone else's help.

I'm not defending these school nurses - I feel that they are way off base in the way they have treated luvdiznee's and Angel's DDs. Both situations could have and should have been handled much better by these nurses than they were. I just ask that you don't generalize their bad behavior to all nurses - most of us really do have our patient's best interests at heart.

You are right, the way I worded my repsonse did generalize their behavior to all nurses... it was not intended that way.
Here in Lafayette we have 1 school nurse per 4 schools. They are overworked and overwhelmed. I do not like the fact that the system is treating them this way, but there is nothing we can change the system. So, the nurses at our schools have to get in and get out as soon as possible... this means trying to treat all conditions the same. Kind of like they have seen it all so they know what is best. However, in the real world it does not work that way.
I work in a pharmacy and have to work with parents all day trying to get the doctors to put wording on the prescritions just perfect or the nurse refuses to dispense the medications. The nurses here will not dispense medications more than once in a 4 hour period no matter how the prescription is written. So, if someone has medicine for a headache that says take one at onset of headache, may repeat in 15 minutes if needed... it will not happen. The school will not even accept a bottle with a label like that. Then we have to call the doctor to see if the want to change it to say take 2 at onset or leave it at one... Or see if they want to write a letter to the school.

So, while my original post may have sounded like I meant all nurses, that is not what I meant. I was strictly refering to the frustrations with the school nurses in our area. No offense intended.

[luvdiznee]

Stay on top of it. If you do not get a response from the principal go to the head nurse at the school board.






Yes, I certainly will. I did just call the nurse, as I usually do to find out what DD's blood sugar was and while the nurse was quick to get off the phone with me, she did give me the info I needed. As far as "writing" anything, I will just have to get that from DD when I pick her up.

[Cinderelley]

First off, in case this comes across the wrong way, I wanted to say that you know your DD better than anyone else does, so you know what is best for her.

But, it does seem like you're being a little hard on the nurse. From the sound of it, she is an older nurse (that doesn't have to be age-wise, but education wise), and is trying to do the best for your DD with what she knows. In the not too distant past, diabetics were supposed to count everything they ate, keep a tight control on all of it, and basically have no life. A lot of the patients I have still live this way (a lot of my patients are in their 70s-90s). And you can always tell the ones who have lived by the rules and the ones who haven't because of their health.

Then people in healthcare realized that people don't do well that way. So, the mindset, particularly for children/teens has changed to more of a "let them eat what they want and we'll use the insulin to cover it" type of attitude. That doesn't mean they want people overindulging themselves, but it's a much easier lifestyle than they were previously expected to adhere to. The insulin pump is a fairly new device too.

Unfortunately, nurses are expected to keep up with EVERYTHING! Is it a good idea? Yes! But in practice, it isn't possible. No one expects doctors to know everything. You wouldn't go to a cardiologist to have your daughter's diabetes controlled, or a neurosurgeon to take care of your urinary tract infection. As nurses though, we're expected to know all of it - not just from non-medical people either.

So, even though this nurse seems like she's way out in left field, it sounds to me like she just doesn't have the updated information that she needs to help your DD. And, yes, most nurses are trained that the family is a patient too, so she feels like she needs to help you. I've told countless family members to go home and get some rest so that they are better able to take care of the patient when he/she gets home. Sometimes, family members get so wrapped up in taking care of their loved ones, they forget about themselves. Maybe you should take what she is saying, and really look at it objectively. Sometimes outsiders see things that those of us who are stuck in the middle aren't able to. Yes, if that is what your DD needs, then that is what you must do, but it is not good for your health to be waking up that many times at night. Is there another way to handle it? Is there anyone else who can take one of those shifts? I know that no one knows her like you do, but you started out as a beginner too, and she did just fine. If you have a DH or another adult who could learn, it would help you too. I'm sure you want to be around for a long time - especially when DD starts have those grandkids. :D

[luvdiznee]

So, even though this nurse seems like she's way out in left field, it sounds to me like she just doesn't have the updated information that she needs to help your DD. And, yes, most nurses are trained that the family is a patient too, so she feels like she needs to help you. I've told countless family members to go home and get some rest so that they are better able to take care of the patient when he/she gets home. Sometimes, family members get so wrapped up in taking care of their loved ones, they forget about themselves. Maybe you should take what she is saying, and really look at it objectively. Sometimes outsiders see things that those of us who are stuck in the middle aren't able to. Yes, if that is what your DD needs, then that is what you must do, but it is not good for your health to be waking up that many times at night. Is there another way to handle it? Is there anyone else who can take one of those shifts? I know that no one knows her like you do, but you started out as a beginner too, and she did just fine. If you have a DH or another adult who could learn, it would help you too. I'm sure you want to be around for a long time - especially when DD starts have those grandkids. :D

The only thing I want from this nurse is to be there for my DD while she is at SCHOOL. I know how to take care of myself and I do that. I am a my DD's mother and I will do whatever it takes to be sure she is OK for the future. If it means checking her blood sugars throughout the night, then so be it. As a parent I would definitely put myself last. Is it always good? No. But as far as my DD10, it's what I have to do and wouldn't have it any other way. Thanks for your concern. ;)