I've officially had it! Vent about refinancing (kind of long)

[ldn324]

OK, I just absolutely blew my lid. I'm still shaking I'm so mad :mad: I've been working for what seems like months now on refinancing our mortgage. One broker offered a ridiculous rate, one direct lender took over a week to return my calls, others that I dealt with I just wasn't comfortable with. I finally thought I had settled with one direct lender. Everything seemed fine - rate was right, terms were right, closing costs were reasonable. The pessimist deep inside of me should have known it was too good to be true!

Two weeks ago, I send all of my pay information over. I work three jobs so there was plenty of income to cover what I was asking for and after reviewing my information, the representative told me everything was fine - no need to worry about anything. Now, less than a week before closing, he calls and tells me that the adjusters decided that the income isn't enough and that not only can I not get approval for the cash out for home improvements, that they would have to pay off my credit cards in the mortgage to get it approved. Now, I realize that some of this is standard practice and that's not what I'm arguing. I'm arguing the fact that the representative told me two weeks ago that the income was fine, the loan amount was approved and specifically that because of my income that I did not need to have them pay off my credit cards. He never once said that it was contingent on further approval. I thought everything was fine and dandy until they dropped this bomb on me this morning.

My ARM goes up starting August 1st. I really need to be out of that mortgage before then because it's outrageous (3 percentage points). I thought everything was fine with this new mortgage so I closed out everything else I was researching. Now I have to start all over again with another lender. Another ding on the credit report, copies of every document since I was born, etc. ALL OVER AGAIN! And who knows if I'll make it in time to avoid the rate increase on the current mortgage.

I can officially say that I have had it with online/long distance mortgages. :down: We're going across the street to our friendly neighborhood bank. We may pay more in the long run, but you know - I'd rather pay more and deal with an actual person who knows us. There is something to be said for good old fashioned face-to-face business!

There - I feel a little better. Thanks for letting me rant. I had to get it off my chest...

[DSNYMOM4JJ]

I'm glad that a little venting helped:mickey:

As for the refi business..I know all about it. I am a loan closer for several different lenders throughout my state. I have to agree that sometimes the process can take a long time...however that being said...over 2-3 months is just abnormal. The reason your income may have been rejected is due to the fact that many lenders are just be overly cautious at this point due to how mant homes are now in foreclosure and late payments caused by bad loans made in that last couple of years...especially ARMs and Interest Only loans.

What I suggest is NOT to do anymore online lending searches...especially with the likes of Lending Tree or broker searches since they place your information out there so that like they said lenders can compete for you loan...but what they dont say is that everytime one of those lenders runs a credit check it reduces your credit score...to many hits and then they dont have to offer a great rate.

By going to your local lender you may have to pay a higher rate, and for the piece of mind right now I think that you might be better off..although note this: It will probably take a few weeks also. Most banks are being cautious as well and for most parts they have hundreds of refi's in the works...it's kinda a take a number...they order appraisals (and yes even if the other company ordered one...the bank will do a new one at your expense) they also will have to do title checks, income to dept ratio's and any other hoops you might have to jump through.

Here's what I suggest....contact your lender you have now. Advise them that you are in the process of seeking lenders to refi out of your ARM loan and instead of looking for outside lenders could they offer you a better loan without an adjustable rate. Most lenders would rather keep your business and can generally make quicker decisions depending on payment history, equity, income and the appraisal value...I really think you might get the loan your looking for right from your current lender.

P.S. Tell your current lender that you have been working with your local bank...generally they pick up the pace and try keep your business and do alot more in your favor.

Hope this helps...let us know what the outcome is. Best of Luck, and some Pixie Dust:pixie:

Kristine

[ldn324]

Wonderful advice Kristine - thanks so much! All of these little things I never thought about. Like pricing it through the current lender - that is a really good idea.

I am fortunate enough that we live in a very rural area and the bank we are going to talk with is very small itself - not a ton of volume. I'm sure there still may be a wait, but even if we have to pay the first month of the new ARM, in the long run to know that we have peace of mind in that we didn't compromise anything to get a secure mortgage, it will be worth the extra time and money.

Only thing that irks me about the current lender is that the paperwork we signed at the purchase indicated the rate would not adjust more than 1/2 percentage every six months. The letter we received from them said it's going up 3 percentage points immediately. The broker that did this loan has since been investigated for tons of fraud issues and I'm thinking we may have been a victim as well. Maybe doctoring documents after we signed? That's what they were being investigated for. I really hadn't worried too much about it since I knew we would be out of that loan shortly.

Do you think it's worth it to call up our closing attorney and have him involve in the refi process too? I thought that might be overkill, but maybe under these odd circumstances it would be a good idea...?

Why, oh why does this have to be such a difficult process? :bang:

I really can't wait for WDW this fall....now, more than ever, I need a vacation after all of this! :thumbsup:

[BigRedDad]

I feel for you. All of the fly-by-night mortgage companies are going under because the people they mortgaged cannot afford the ARMs. My neighbor sells mortgages with one of these companies. His job will soon be over once the "magic" number of bankruptcies hit against their books.

My advice is to get a mortgage directly from a lender, not a mortgage broker. Definitely do not use one of those "we'll buy your house" places. Get a 30-year fixed rate. Make one additional payment each year and set it up to pay twice per month. Those two things will decrease your mortgage from 30 years down to about 22. It will save you a huge amount of interest.

[Ian]

Wow ... a lot of your story here just doesn't add up to me ... as I think I mentioned to you before, I work in the mortgage business so I might be able to help ...

Did they not send you a committment letter originally? Once you fill out your application, you're supposed to get a set of disclosures within 3 days. Did you get those? Was a committment part of them? I can't see any legit broker making a verbal committment without an official committment letter having already been sent out ...

It's true that many, MANY lenders are tightening underwriting guidelines because of all the default in the sub-prime area. Maybe they thought your DTI (debt-to-income) ratio was too high after a second review?

Can you PM me? I have quite a bit more I'd like to find out about this, but I'm not sure we should discuss it out on the boards.

[Jeff G]

My advice is to get a mortgage directly from a lender, not a mortgage broker. Definitely do not use one of those "we'll buy your house" places. Get a 30-year fixed rate. Make one additional payment each year and set it up to pay twice per month. Those two things will decrease your mortgage from 30 years down to about 22. It will save you a huge amount of interest.

This is statement skewed by the ever ignorant media. I've been a mortgaged broker for fifteen years and take great pride in what I do. My rates generally are a little better than other banks and mortgage companies (todays 30 year fixed is at 6.375% w/ 0 points and a $525 processing fee). My average loan close time is less than two weeks from start to close. Plus I also have many other programs my disposal at any given time so I can cater each loan. There are a few companies out there that did things the wrong way, not all of us.


As for ldn324, she would be very well suited to use someone like myself. It sounds like she has a few unique situations that not every company will offer. Jumping to the local bank may work -or- they may not have the perfect loan. Most local banks cap loans at 80% of you home value and they have low debt to income ratios. Your local bank will be able to give two options. The first is a conventional 30 year fixed, which almost all banks today sell to a third party(they may retain servicing rights). These are subject to Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac guild lines. Almost all of these programs are approved by one of two computer programs which are Desktop Underwriter or Loan Prospector. If the mortgage company your currently working with was looking at a 30 year fixed it's a good bet that they already did this and the bank will have the same income problem. The other option most banks offer is an in house loan that they service. Most of these loans are ARMS & balloons capped at 80% of the value of your house. Being that rates have been at 30 year lows the past few years I never would recommend these unless your moving before the term ends.

If you are a 700+ credit score borrower with one source of income a direct lender like Wells Fargo or a local bank is always an option. As for a borrower in a unique situation a reputable local mortgage consultant is a great option. The primary reason is that unlike local banks and direct lenders we have more than just the one option to choose from.

Just reading through the post one thing that stands out to me is the three jobs. Having three jobs may not be as great as it sounds. Most Underwriters will only consider income from a primary job plus part time jobs that have a minimum of two years history. Anything else will almost always be thrown out.


If you want to shoot me a email or private message I can get a little more information from you and maybe make this a little less of a headache. Like I said in the past I can't do loans in your market but I certainly can use basic info like scores, loan to value, income and in a matter of ten minutes I can tell you which programs you will have available and guide you to good mortgage companies in your area which have a program that will fit your needs. Taking out a mortgage can be very confusing and if not explained properly very frustrating. Let me know if I can help.

[ldn324]

Well, my frustration continues sadly. I certainly do appreciate all of the help from my fellow Intercotees - it's just that nothing so far is adaptable to our situation.

DH was looking at Clark Howard's site last night and there was mention of ING. I took a look at their website this morning and called. Now, I wasn't overly impressed with the guy that answered the phone. He wasn't very enthusiastic, but I got some initial information and I would imagine if I choose them, I'd get a representative with more ambition.

We've been so set on a 30 year fixed rate that we hadn't considered other options. A 5 or 7 year ARM is offered by ING with a much lower interest rate. We could also do our cash out on a separate line of credit that can be converted to a fixed loan to lock in a rate when we are finished using it (which will be within 2-3 months). Now I'm starting to think, maybe another ARM isn't THAT bad...??? Sure, the market could go crazy in 5 years but that's a gamble we might just have to take. I should add, I doubt this is the house we will spend our lives in. Our area is growing quickly and not for the better. Although we love our house, we most likely will leave the area within 10 years.

Does anyone have experience with the Orange Mortgage through ING? Would you recommend it? Is ING easy to work with? Honestly, I'm sick and tired of all of the other companies refusing to give me anything in writing, last minute changes, undisclosed items, etc.? It's harder and harder for me to trust anyone and I don't think a refi should be this difficult and stressful :(

[rnin02]

Oh, that doesn't sound fun at all. My DH is a loan officer for a mortgage broker and he has been struggling to get one of his clients closed for many months now...its been a struggle because the each lender he's tried has given an intial approval, then a few weeks down the road said "no, nevermind". The one lender who finally did say yes and mean it has taken forever to approve the conditions...I don't understand it all, but its been a huge pain for DH and his customers. I think they finally get to close Monday, and DH has been working with them since April. And this is a refi, btw. I think lenders are getting much more conservative about loaning out money, being more strict with guidelines,etc and not always communicating well with the loan officer. At least that has been my DH's experience. Good luck...I don't know anything about ING, but if you are not satisfied with them, I could recommend someone, if you want to PM me. Good luck again!